My experiment with adding caster (1 Viewer)

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Moby

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About a year ago I dumped my 31x10.5 BFG ATs and moved to some Nitto Terra Grappler 265/75R16s (32x10.5s). I noticed that they tended to wander and pull more, especially on grooved roads, at highway speeds and on washboard. I recently started reading about caster and the role that it plays in steering and handling and decided to experiment a little.

Solid axle Toyota mini trucks, Jeeps... seem to be in the 3-6 degree range (positive). SO guys (40s and 60/62s) that do a cut and turn seem, from what I could find, to aim for around 5-5.5 degrees with good results (again, positive). Stock caster for 60/62s is basically 0 degrees +-1 degree. Not sure why Toyota blessed us with no positive caster but they did.

I decided to try some caster shims (4Crawler Offroad Products - Custom Leaf Spring Shims - very happy with these by the way). I first had my caster measured and found that I was at 1 degree positive. I'm only running a mild OME lift but since adding caster via shims will point your pinion down I decided to be somewhat conservative and have 3 degree shims made to bring total caster to 4 degrees positive. I was hoping that 3 more degrees would be enough to make a difference but not so much as to cause 4wheel high problems.

I finally found an afternoon to install the shims and have been very happy with the results so far. Over a local section of heavily grooved road that previously required very attentive steering, especially while braking, the truck now tracks cleanly with very little steering correction necessary. Tracking at highway speeds is somewhat improved as well. No chance to gauge impact on washboard yet.

Steering effort might be slightly higher but I could easily be imagining this. Certainly not a problem.

In 4wheel high at speeds of up to 45-50mph and during deceleration I couldn't detect any additional driveline vibration (I had just a little bit before the shims which is another reason I was conservative with the shims but the shims don't seem to have negatively effected this).

Anyway, your results may vary but so far this has been a good improvement for my truck.
 
This is good info, Moby.

I've got some similar issues with my mild OME lift, but wasn't sure what degree to try first.

Thanks.
 
Notice any effect on slow - 4LO - steering action, say a wider turning radius?
 
i can say the same for my 4crawler shims when I added them. I was a -.4 before. Now I am at a 4+. much improved!!
 
Notice any effect on slow - 4LO - steering action, say a wider turning radius?

Haven't tried that yet. I'll crawl the neighborhood this weekend and report back :D I don't think that it should effect turning radius though. At least from my understanding of the caster, which is likely incomplete. It might feel harder to go to lock though and thus indirectly effect turning radius...
 
It might feel harder to go to lock though and thus indirectly effect turning radius...

it's not a "feel" harder, it is harder. due to the added caster, you are lifting one side of the truck or the other when you turn from one side to the other.
 
I did the same on mine with blue torch fab shims the alum ones brake. :cool::rolleyes:
 
Caster changes Toe........;)
 
Moby:

Thanks for posting this up.

Are your shims aluminum or steel?
 
Steel. Man-a-fre sells aluminum shims in 2 and 4 degree angles that are cheaper but their specs didn't quite match the spring perch dimensions of my 62. I also liked that 4crawler machines a flat in the shim for the bolt head.


How does caster effect toe? I haven't come across this in anything that I've read on the subject.
 
Did you go for a "custom" 2 1/2" wide shim, or the standard 2"? By my reconning, 2.5"x5" would be ideal. Anybody know off hand what diameter the threaded portion of the centering pin is?

I've been meaning to order a pair, but haven't followed through yet.
 
Last edited:
Here is what I ordered:

3 degree angle
2 3/4" wide
5 1/4" long
3/8" center bolt - bolt is centered side to side and front to back.

This worked out well on my truck. The angle is going to vary truck to truck. The 3/8" center bolt is what I measured for OME Dakkar springs. Not sure if that is stock or not. I did not have to use extra washers or a center bolt with a taller head. With more angle that might be necessary though.

I also chose the high accuracy option (additional $15).
 
Here is what I ordered:

3 degree angle
2 3/4" wide
5 1/4" long
3/8" center bolt - bolt is centered side to side and front to back.

This worked out well on my truck. The angle is going to vary truck to truck. The 3/8" center bolt is what I measured for OME Dakkar springs. Not sure if that is stock or not. I did not have to use extra washers or a center bolt with a taller head. With more angle that might be necessary though.

I also chose the high accuracy option (additional $15).

Thanks for the info :cheers: I have the Dakkars too, so I'll likely order the same, perhaps 4 degrees. :)
 
Interesting stuff, Joel. I'm curious how this will affect an otherwise stock rig (though my full length AALs added about 1.5" of lift to my truck IIRC). If the effects will be beneficial or not.

You said that adding positive caster meant the pinion being pivoted downwards. I had thought it was the other way around. Given what you said, I'm assuming you installed them with the thicker ends forward (for a SUA setup)?
 
Great thread! I've wondered about doing the same, but I'm so far from thinking about fine tuning at the moment. Have to finish the engine swap first.....

Caster changing the toe setting:
See if I can make it clearer;
Picture the axle having no caster. Now give the tires some toe-in. Think of the tires as being very, very thin.
OK, now rotate the whole axle top toward the rear. Think of how those thin tire "discs" rotate with the axle housing rotation. Exaggerate the toe-in, the OD of the tire "discs", and the amount of rotation in your mind. Note that the place where toe is measured does not rotate with the axle housing.
As you rotate the housing to gain Caster you will lose toe-in.

it's not a "feel" harder, it is harder. due to the added caster, you are lifting one side of the truck or the other when you turn from one side to the other.
This is a good reason for running a lot of Scrub Radius on a serious crawler. That lifting can load a tire and find traction.
 
I'm thinking I will need to add some caster to my rig as it wanders a decent amount. No bump steer, but plenty of wander.

ntsqd, perfect explanation as usual. :cheers:
 
....

In 4wheel high at speeds of up to 45-50mph and during deceleration I couldn't detect any additional driveline vibration (I had just a little bit before the shims which is another reason I was conservative with the shims but the shims don't seem to have negatively effected this).

...
I'm not sure rotating the pinion down would result in DL vibrations. What it will do is add stress to the pinion gear splines, increasing the chance of breaking the gear at the splines. This is the notorious weak link in the Land Cruiser axle. It's my understanding that's why most of the SOA guys do the cut and turn.
 

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