LC250 Stop Sale

[Jetboy]

Thinking about it, it is a little bit surprising that the V35A engine failure even "qualified" as a safety recall. I wonder if the NHTSA would even have gotten involved had Toyota not done the voluntary recall.

Anyways, I could be wrong, but I don't think the fact that you could break down far away from home or in a remote place plays into the safety aspect of the recall.

"Loss of motive power" at high speeds was the reasoning... so, the driver just loses the ability to accelerate? Is electric power steering affected? I'd assume not and you'd at least have a shot at pulling over before losing momentum. Braking, other safety systems (BSM, hazard lights, etc) should all continue to operate fine?

The "high speeds" scenario doesn't even sound like the worst case. People dramatically slam their brakes on the highway all day, every day.

The biggest risk scenario I see to simply losing acceleration is probably something like making a left turn on a green without the arrow, losing the engine just as you initiate the turn, leaving you slowly coasting to a stop stuck in the lane of the oncoming traffic.

I would be curious if there have been ANY accidents as a result of the 824 documented failures - let alone a crash with injuries or fatalities.

Only real danger I can think of is breaking down in the middle of a major highway and not being able to get out of the lane of travel. I would think the electric power steering and brakes would still function normally. Or something like you are suggesting - stalling mid turn in front of oncoming traffic. But there are a lot of vehicles with higher engine failure rates that never had safety recalls.

My 4Runner had a recall for the fuel pump. I think that's in the same category that a failure would be a no start or a stall while driving. Annoying? Sure. Safety hazard - pretty remote chance of an actual injury resulting from it.

 

[Rednexus]

Only real danger I can think of is breaking down in the middle of a major highway and not being able to get out of the lane of travel. I would think the electric power steering and brakes would still function normally. Or something like you are suggesting - stalling mid turn in front of oncoming traffic. But there are a lot of vehicles with higher engine failure rates that never had safety recalls.

My 4Runner had a recall for the fuel pump. I think that's in the same category that a failure would be a no start or a stall while driving. Annoying? Sure. Safety hazard - pretty remote chance of an actual injury resulting from it.

Regardless of if the safety of an engine failure is a real concern or not, it's inexcusable performance for such an expensive and brand-new vehicle .

 

[04UZJ100]

@04UZJ100 uuuhh, I hope to god Toyota doesn’t say “I expect you mechanics to disassemble, repair and reassemble the engine”.

My expectation is they throw in a short block, maybe even a fully dressed long block

We can debate if they’re capable of that job, but there’s now way they are doing a rebuild

You’re out of the loop. YouTube tundra engine failure. Look at how the dealers are managing it.

 

[04UZJ100]

@04UZJ100 uuuhh, I hope to god Toyota doesn’t say “I expect you mechanics to disassemble, repair and reassemble the engine”.

My expectation is they throw in a short block, maybe even a fully dressed long block

We can debate if they’re capable of that job, but there’s now way they are doing a rebuild

 

[NYCGX]

Been ongoing since 05/17. Rumor is an issue with the sunroof drain hose, but nothing official has come out. Currently projected to end early July.

Hi All,
Long time lurker, first time poster and hopeful future GX or LC owner here. This has me concerned, I had a 2022 RX with a clogged hose and it was a disaster, caused the interior to flood and Lexus forced me to go through insurance for what seems in my opinion - Lexus/Toyota's issue. Curious if there is any updates on this?

 

[OregonLC]

Hi All,
Long time lurker, first time poster and hopeful future GX or LC owner here. This has me concerned, I had a 2022 RX with a clogged hose and it was a disaster, caused the interior to flood and Lexus forced me to go through insurance for what seems in my opinion - Lexus/Toyota's issue. Curious if there is any updates on this?

What clogged the hose? Manufacturing debris or defect, or organic sludge build up?

 

[joseywales]

It is kind of meh...when we compare it to our lx570 it feels such a let down!!. Even our old gx460 felt better built. This is supposed to replace our durango...but now have been looking at low mileage gx460s.

It’s going to for sure be better than a Durango, but still not anywhere near as good as it could have been. A couple of years from now I’ll likely re-visit.

I think for now we’ll go Bronco Sasquatch for the “reliability”!

 

[Rednexus]

It’s going to for sure be better than a Durango, but still not anywhere near as good as it could have been. A couple of years from now I’ll likely re-visit.

I think for now we’ll go Bronco Sasquatch for the “reliability”!

At least the Bronco is lower-priced, vastly more customizable, and available with more power than just about any Toyota product. IMO, there is no reason to buy a Toyota/Lexus vehicle other than the reliability/residual resale value. If they don't offer that, a domestic vehicle is more attractive.

 

[joseywales]

At least the Bronco is lower-priced, vastly more customizable, and available with more power than just about any Toyota product. IMO, there is no reason to buy a Toyota/Lexus vehicle other than the reliability/residual resale value. If they don't offer that, a domestic vehicle is more attractive.

I’m inclined to agree with you. I lease my new vehicles for my business, so I don’t really factor resale into it much. I might gain some money back by selling a Toyota at higher than lease end value, but my current Tundra lease in this market is underwater by about $12k. I’ll drop it off and walk. The Broncos went through similar teething pains as the new TFNGA or whatever the new chassis designation is. The difference now is, Ford has sorted the issues out, and things are “normal” again. Will Toyota sort out the issues with the new lineup? Of course. And maybe in 2028/29 when the Bronco lease is up, we’ll revisit the LC or 4Runner option.

 

[open country]

You trust a Toyota dealer to replace an engine? Have you seen the pictures? Parts all over the ****ing place. Toyota dealers/techs are not engine builders or machinists.

To be fair, replacing a short block is neither "engine building" nor "machine work." Sure there's a lot of parts removal and proper FSM procedure to follow and therefore risk of error, but nothing out of the scope of work Toyota techs do with some frequency. The videos you posted had parts laying around but wasn't evident of disorganization or chaos in my opinion.

Not at all defending Toyota as handling this correctly, and clearly you've had bad experience with Toyota dealer work so understand your different take.

 

[04UZJ100]

To be fair, replacing a short block is neither "engine building" nor "machine work." Sure there's a lot of parts removal and proper FSM procedure to follow and therefore risk of error, but nothing out of the scope of work Toyota techs do with some frequency. The videos you posted had parts laying around but wasn't evident of disorganization or chaos in my opinion.

Not at all defending Toyota as handling this correctly, and clearly you've had bad experience with Toyota dealer work so understand your different take.

Disagree. These are the techs that can’t torque lug nuts let alone remember to put oil in during oil changes. There are several reports of techs killing 200s.

No thanks.

 

[Rednexus]

To be fair, replacing a short block is neither "engine building" nor "machine work." Sure there's a lot of parts removal and proper FSM procedure to follow and therefore risk of error, but nothing out of the scope of work Toyota techs do with some frequency. The videos you posted had parts laying around but wasn't evident of disorganization or chaos in my opinion.

Not at all defending Toyota as handling this correctly, and clearly you've had bad experience with Toyota dealer work so understand your different take.

The quality of the job will be directly correlated to the skill of the mechanic and how clean the shop is. With parts laying out for weeks, it's very likely they'll get cross-contaminated with dust, debris, etc. that can lead to excessive wear. A dealership service bay is not a clean room; engine assembly should be done in a very clean location rather than a location where bay doors are opening/closing, dirty vehicles are going in and out, etc.

Outside of a long-block R&R (which is not currently on the table), the proper way to do this would be to remove the engine and pull it back into a clean/clean-ish room outside of the main service bay for disassembly. Then take the re-assembled long block back out to the rig to put back in. I really doubt dealerships are doing it that way. Maybe if the problem becomes pervasive enough dealerships will add a dedicated VA35F assembly room to their footprint .

 

[open country]

Yes, there are many ways to perfect a short block install of which I'm sure a dealer service bay falls short. That said, they are not touching rotating assemblies, and I haven't seen evidence that these replacement engines are being installed in subpar conditions or with talentless labor enough to also then fail shortly after.

 

[Jetboy]

Disagree. These are the techs that can’t torque lug nuts let alone remember to put oil in during oil changes. There are several reports of techs killing 200s.

No thanks.

I'm with you on this. My last Honda motorcycle had a recall to replace the entire rotating assembly due to a bearing issue on some bikes. I chose not to take it in for a warranty. I'm sure there's plenty of very qualified excellent engine builders outside of the Toyota ecosystem. But the odds of finding one at a Toyota dealership that they're going to stick on a warranty repair that likely is underpaying the labor seems low.

That said - obviously the factory isn't doing such a great job either. So maybe I'm on the wrong side of this.

 

[NYCGX]

What clogged the hose? Manufacturing debris or defect, or organic sludge build up?

According to the dealer, organic sludge/debris. That being said, I never use the sunroof and around the time this happened in the northeast, there had been a recent slew of heavy rainstorms.

While I was at the dealership getting this diagnosed, I spoke with quite a few other owners who had their cars in the shop for the same reason. That and the fact that I've never had this problem on multiple vehicles (all with sunroofs that have had significant more use than the one that got clogged) leads me to believe that it's more the result of a design/engineering than "external" factors like Lexus was trying to claim.

 

[ryanjl]

Sunroof drains clog on every modern vehicle I've ever heard of. "Cleaning out sunroof drain hoses" is a common maintenance item.

I never had a sunroof drain problem on my 95 FZJ80, but that thing did rattle like crazy after a while.

Sunroofs are just too much problem and hassle for their worth. For me, it's either no sunroof at all, or a full removable top.

 

[Rednexus]

Sunroof drains clog on every modern vehicle I've ever heard of. "Cleaning out sunroof drain hoses" is a common maintenance item.

I never had a sunroof drain problem on my 95 FZJ80, but that thing did rattle like crazy after a while.

Sunroofs are just too much problem and hassle for their worth. For me, it's either no sunroof at all, or a full removable top.

Zero sunroof drain issues on my 2007 GX470. It's parked outside under lots of trees as well, including some maples. The drains are still clear and free. I can hear them working in the drain (drip/trickle noise in the A pillar).

So......Toyota should know how to design one that drains without issue .

 

[Jetboy]

I've never had a sunroof drain issue. But I've also never lived in a climate where mold and moss are problems. I suspect that's the issue more than foreign debris. Probably some chemicals could fix it with occasional use. Maybe the solution is to have the windshield wiper fluid flush it occasionally or something like that. I think it would be enough to kill whatever is growing in there.

Maybe we need a really long pipe cleaner?

Seems like in most cases a kinked tube could be opened up by either compressed air or running a rod down the drain. And aren't there usually 4 drains? Are they all kinked or just one?

 

[ryanjl]

Most clean sunroof drains either with compressed air or weed-eater line.

 

[1NTRANSIT]

The hoses on my 5th gen 4R clogged constantly, it was unbelievably annoying to have rain water spill onto your lap while driving or open your door after parking outside to find the floor mats full of water. This was when the truck was barely 2yrs old. Compressed air was the only remedy.

Our 100s and 460 have never had a clogged drain problem, same driveway and same office parking lots.

Now I hope we can eventually get a sunroof delete option on the LC Premium, any whiff of another drain issue and Im out.