isuzu 4BD1T swap?!
- Thread starter orangefj45
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I talked to Dieseltim and he told me the kits are $750 and includes the machine work needed to modify the Isuzu 5speed bellhousing. If you chose to have someone else modify your bellhousing then they are knocking $100 off the kit for the machine work. The kit includes the pilot bearing, the clutch disk and the adapter plate for $650.
Sound like a pretty good deal to me. Wish my wife wasn't insisting on an automatic.
LC_Hamma
The Anti-Leafer
Is that 1/2" alum plate? I'd use 3/4" min. steel plate for all the havoc between. That will be too much stress on the alum & it will eventually fail. Think about how much wt. you are sandwiching together. Are those 6 - 7/16" fine threaded countersunk bolts? Not enough clamping fasteners & too much mat'l. is removed for those bolt heads - you'll soon see stress cracks there first. Look at any SM plate adaptor & compare it to your design. JMO & I'm just an armchair enjuneer 
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Adapter plate
The plate is 6065 t651 Aircraft quality alum. and all of the bolts are 1/2 coarse threaded bolts. I went with the 1/2" thick so that the input shaft and the pilot bearing have the proper ingaugement, if you use anything thicker you will not be into the pilot bearing far enough. I decided that 1/2 was thicker than the bell housing, so the bellhousing would most likely fail before the adapter plate.
For those interested here is a few more pics.
Dieseltim
The plate is 6065 t651 Aircraft quality alum. and all of the bolts are 1/2 coarse threaded bolts. I went with the 1/2" thick so that the input shaft and the pilot bearing have the proper ingaugement, if you use anything thicker you will not be into the pilot bearing far enough. I decided that 1/2 was thicker than the bell housing, so the bellhousing would most likely fail before the adapter plate.
For those interested here is a few more pics.
Dieseltim
The plate is 6065 t651 Aircraft quality alum. and all of the bolts are 1/2 coarse threaded bolts. I went with the 1/2" thick so that the input shaft and the pilot bearing have the proper ingaugement, if you use anything thicker you will not be into the pilot bearing far enough. I decided that 1/2 was thicker than the bell housing, so the bellhousing would most likely fail before the adapter plate.
For those interested here is a few more pics.
Dieseltim
Could you do a steel plate option for people who want something heavier duty? I can imagine some people needing to use mounting arrangements which place quite high bending moments on the bellhousing.
A steel plate will flex 1/3 of what aluminium does, but it will also weigh 3x as much.
You do have to have an NV4500 to use this kit, it can be Dodge or Gm but it will have to have an input shaft for a Dodge because they are about 1" longer than the Gm input shaft. If you have a Gm NV4500 then all you have to do is change out the input and you can use this adatper kit.Dieseltim
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No I don't, but if I go this route then I could try to find the Dodge trans to save some work.
4BD2t in FJ40
hey guys... just thought i'd chime in here. Was at a local Cruiser shop, and they were working on an ultra clean FJ40 with a 4BD2t. Was a tight fit in the FJ40... but it fit nearly perfect. Lots of room between the axle and sump... only tricky thing they had to do, was find a different starter. They brought the original starter to a starter shop, and had one built that twisted the starter closer to the block.
hey guys... just thought i'd chime in here. Was at a local Cruiser shop, and they were working on an ultra clean FJ40 with a 4BD2t. Was a tight fit in the FJ40... but it fit nearly perfect. Lots of room between the axle and sump... only tricky thing they had to do, was find a different starter. They brought the original starter to a starter shop, and had one built that twisted the starter closer to the block.
Radiator Options
Now that my project is actually progressing, next up is the radiator. It's a 4BD2T going into a '72 FJ55. I've got the stock 55 rad and the Isuzu rad (way too tall). Isuzudieselswapper says stock rads are fine regardless of application and I am always leary of all encompassing comments like that. I see a few have stuck with stock and a few have changed out. Since I'm gonna be running a/c there's a little more strain on the engine but not much.
This may be one of those good to do now if you have the extra cash but wait until later because other costs are piling up quick.
Now that my project is actually progressing, next up is the radiator. It's a 4BD2T going into a '72 FJ55. I've got the stock 55 rad and the Isuzu rad (way too tall). Isuzudieselswapper says stock rads are fine regardless of application and I am always leary of all encompassing comments like that. I see a few have stuck with stock and a few have changed out. Since I'm gonna be running a/c there's a little more strain on the engine but not much.
This may be one of those good to do now if you have the extra cash but wait until later because other costs are piling up quick.
What Isuzudieselswapper means is that a comparable petrol engine puts far more heat into the coolant. Unless you're pulling out a tiny petrol engine or much smaller diesel engine the stock radiator will be fine.
I'd stick with your original. The Isuzu truck one is sized for pulling 8000kg of truck and load up steep hills in the tropics.
any updates on swaps, adapters, etc? looks like this thread just died?
clint
clint
Nothing to add as far as progress on my conversion. Right now the focus is getting the 60 axles set under the 55. I did find a good source for Isuzu parts if you're needing them. Real helpful guy and very reasonable prices.
craig floyd
import truck parts
877-554-9008
IMPORT TRUCK PARTS | USED ISUZU TRUCK PARTS | COMMERCIAL | HINO | NISSAN UD | TRUCK PART
craig floyd
import truck parts
877-554-9008
IMPORT TRUCK PARTS | USED ISUZU TRUCK PARTS | COMMERCIAL | HINO | NISSAN UD | TRUCK PART
Hey Andrew,
any chance you could fill me in on why you chose the isuzu over the cummins? As much as I keep looking at the Isuzu as a great alternative I always end up at the Cummins 4bta.
thanks,
clint
any chance you could fill me in on why you chose the isuzu over the cummins? As much as I keep looking at the Isuzu as a great alternative I always end up at the Cummins 4bta.
thanks,
clint
Partially availability at the time I was looking but mostly noise level. I heard a 4bt running and thought it was pretty loud. Then I took Rhino's 4BD pig out for a drive and was amazed at the noise level difference. While driving I could carry on a conversation in the cab and Rhino's 55 had little to no sound deadening at the time. It really wasn't much louder than my stock '62 was when I had an exhaust leak. I think at the end of the day it's going to cost more because there are more adapters to buy but it's worth it. With the new adapter for a manual transmission it opens up a lot more options for drivetrain also. If you do a noise comparison of your own you'll see what I mean. Pull up next to a bread truck and you'll see how much louder they are in comparison to the box trucks. I think the 4BD is actually quieter in an LC than in the box truck but that might just be me.
Someone will probably correct me on this last part but I believe the 4BD gets a little better mileage than the 4bt. I think around 5 mpg which wasn't a big deal a year ago when I got the engine but since diesel is just shy of $5 by me (4.91 as of today), that's basically a buck a gallon now.
Someone will probably correct me on this last part but I believe the 4BD gets a little better mileage than the 4bt. I think around 5 mpg which wasn't a big deal a year ago when I got the engine but since diesel is just shy of $5 by me (4.91 as of today), that's basically a buck a gallon now.
the stock rad works great to cool the isuzu engine, its actually overkill i think but for the AZ heat i can live with it. plus it was already installed in the rig.
dont know about mileage difference, but i'm averaging 25 so i really dont care
dont know about mileage difference, but i'm averaging 25 so i really dont care
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FJ62 with 4BD1T- tuning and tweaking
Sorry for not posting some progress on my project. I have chased around a lot of various small issues to improve performance, and chasing some oil leaks. I will post in the hopes that others can benefit.
1. gauges - I have added a turbo boost gage, and an EGT gage. I think this is a minimum requirement so that you know what is going on with the engine fuel delivery, and boost.
2. oil pan - i had horrendous leaks at the oil pan. I replaced the pan during the rebuild, the original was kinked with a hole. I found in fact that there were supposed to be large plate washers that should have been on the pan. My replacement pan did not have these plates, but the original pan had these plates spot welded on. These plates improved the clamp up alot. I also used an isuzu oil pan gasket that was like 4 mm rubber, that seemed too soft. the new isuzu gasket was a more substantial pressed material, and was awesome. While I had the pan off, I revised the shape to increase clearance to the axle, and moved the drain to the drivers side.
3. turbo to intake - I could hear a small boost leak. a quick fix, but it would help in turbo boost.
4. overdrive and lock up on the 700r4. I had to hook up the electronics to get the lock up to function. I added a later model brake light switch, that also has a cruise shut off. this allows the lock up to turn off if you push on the brake.
See my next post for the driving test! I would welcome any thoughts on the power and performance!
Sorry for not posting some progress on my project. I have chased around a lot of various small issues to improve performance, and chasing some oil leaks. I will post in the hopes that others can benefit.
1. gauges - I have added a turbo boost gage, and an EGT gage. I think this is a minimum requirement so that you know what is going on with the engine fuel delivery, and boost.
2. oil pan - i had horrendous leaks at the oil pan. I replaced the pan during the rebuild, the original was kinked with a hole. I found in fact that there were supposed to be large plate washers that should have been on the pan. My replacement pan did not have these plates, but the original pan had these plates spot welded on. These plates improved the clamp up alot. I also used an isuzu oil pan gasket that was like 4 mm rubber, that seemed too soft. the new isuzu gasket was a more substantial pressed material, and was awesome. While I had the pan off, I revised the shape to increase clearance to the axle, and moved the drain to the drivers side.
3. turbo to intake - I could hear a small boost leak. a quick fix, but it would help in turbo boost.
4. overdrive and lock up on the 700r4. I had to hook up the electronics to get the lock up to function. I added a later model brake light switch, that also has a cruise shut off. this allows the lock up to turn off if you push on the brake.
See my next post for the driving test! I would welcome any thoughts on the power and performance!
- Joined
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4bd1T driving test and results.
Driving test ! - I am still not happy with the power. I can not hold the overdrive when going up a hill, and have to go to third gear, and will go about 55mph. it is at altitude about 6000 ft, perhaps a 6% grade. I had HOPED that the 88tlc would cruise up the hill like my Dodge cummins. but I do not have that kind of power, or torque. I would welcome any thoughts on this.
some data first
stock turbo, no waste gate - the turbo will obtain 10 psi boost, but I gotta have my foot in it! at cruise it is perhaps 4 to 5 psi. egt gage is post turbo.
injection pump, and injectors - stock, rebuilt. fuel turned up approx 6 %. Timing was checked at about 12 deg, but this seems to be a course measure per the manual.
700r4 with overdrive. I also have 33s on the rig now. 4.11 stock gears.
at cruise- 65 mph, egt are at 1000 F, boost about 4psi to 5 psi. there is a bit more power there, but the egt are high!
Up a hill - 4% to 6% grade. i have to shift down to third. it has plenty of power but the EGT can climb quickly . boost is 5-7 psi?
what is the EGT temps that this isuzu handle? the small oil jets that shoot into the cylinders, and cool the pistons, post turbo.
would a wastegate turbo give better power, early in the throttle?
Driving test ! - I am still not happy with the power. I can not hold the overdrive when going up a hill, and have to go to third gear, and will go about 55mph. it is at altitude about 6000 ft, perhaps a 6% grade. I had HOPED that the 88tlc would cruise up the hill like my Dodge cummins. but I do not have that kind of power, or torque. I would welcome any thoughts on this.
some data first
stock turbo, no waste gate - the turbo will obtain 10 psi boost, but I gotta have my foot in it! at cruise it is perhaps 4 to 5 psi. egt gage is post turbo.
injection pump, and injectors - stock, rebuilt. fuel turned up approx 6 %. Timing was checked at about 12 deg, but this seems to be a course measure per the manual.
700r4 with overdrive. I also have 33s on the rig now. 4.11 stock gears.
at cruise- 65 mph, egt are at 1000 F, boost about 4psi to 5 psi. there is a bit more power there, but the egt are high!
Up a hill - 4% to 6% grade. i have to shift down to third. it has plenty of power but the EGT can climb quickly . boost is 5-7 psi?
what is the EGT temps that this isuzu handle? the small oil jets that shoot into the cylinders, and cool the pistons, post turbo.
would a wastegate turbo give better power, early in the throttle?
You need to shift your EGT probe to before the turbo. Which fuel pump do you have? Some have boost compensators, some do not. If you have a sick boost compensator then you'll be way down on power.
I've run my engine at up to 750 deg C preturbo regularly for a long time with no issues. These engines are built to work hard all day, factory fitted oil spray, oil coolers etc.
What rpm do you think you have at 65mph?
A smaller wastegated turbo will give more boost, but I'm not convinced boost is the only issue you have right now.
