Bill you FJC looked really good when I saw it tonight. Nice job.
Help Bill Upgrade his FJC Thread
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Thanks Marshall. I'm pretty much where I wanted to get for medium solo to serious group wheeling. The bumper and winch were the last big step. I really like the way she looks with the tires and bumper. No more the Barby Cruiser/Starbucks/Soccer Mom look, don't ya'll think?
All I have left on the 'do' list right now are to install the lights. One came in broken and I don't quite know about the wiring yet.
My outfitting is pretty close. I've ordered the outstanding recovery hardware items (snatch block, another screw shackle, 10' of high grade 3/8" chain with grab hooks and 3"X10' treesaver strap) that I need to complement the pull straps and receiver shackle I have. I have an old 48" Hi-Lift which I've mounted in the floor in front of the back seat. I decided I don't want it on the roof. A friend is going to make me a receiver bracket for it which I will use on trail runs.
I fitted a fire extinguisher. I'll install some mounts for shovel and ax and maybe my peavey on the roof rack and a little shotgun in the rear door. I'll use QuickFists for all that, thanks Rick; I really love those gadgets. I used a large one for my fire extinguisher on the shelf in the left rear. I ordered a travel bag for my little chain saw, a 14" Stihl 017C. Husqvarna makes a neat Cordura bag with an internal drip pan for about $20. The Husky blue w/orange trim should look good in Bonnie.
I'll probably eventually get more skids but for now I want to get my ATRAC re-enabled and hacked and try her out like this on the level 3 trails at Tellico, see how much rubbing I get. The FJs come stock with pretty good underbody protection already, I don't want to add more weight (and $$$'s!) until I'm sure how much I'll need it. The bling factory front skid is starting to acquire a certain elan of it's own I think.
And I'll get a rear bumper when (if) I ever find what I want.
What am I forgetting. Or overlooking?
b
All I have left on the 'do' list right now are to install the lights. One came in broken and I don't quite know about the wiring yet.
My outfitting is pretty close. I've ordered the outstanding recovery hardware items (snatch block, another screw shackle, 10' of high grade 3/8" chain with grab hooks and 3"X10' treesaver strap) that I need to complement the pull straps and receiver shackle I have. I have an old 48" Hi-Lift which I've mounted in the floor in front of the back seat. I decided I don't want it on the roof. A friend is going to make me a receiver bracket for it which I will use on trail runs.
I fitted a fire extinguisher. I'll install some mounts for shovel and ax and maybe my peavey on the roof rack and a little shotgun in the rear door. I'll use QuickFists for all that, thanks Rick; I really love those gadgets. I used a large one for my fire extinguisher on the shelf in the left rear. I ordered a travel bag for my little chain saw, a 14" Stihl 017C. Husqvarna makes a neat Cordura bag with an internal drip pan for about $20. The Husky blue w/orange trim should look good in Bonnie.
I'll probably eventually get more skids but for now I want to get my ATRAC re-enabled and hacked and try her out like this on the level 3 trails at Tellico, see how much rubbing I get. The FJs come stock with pretty good underbody protection already, I don't want to add more weight (and $$$'s!) until I'm sure how much I'll need it. The bling factory front skid is starting to acquire a certain elan of it's own I think.
And I'll get a rear bumper when (if) I ever find what I want.
What am I forgetting. Or overlooking?
b
...the fuzzy dice?Really, you have everything covered, maybe a way to air up (compressor/CO2 tank) after airing down.
You liking the Demello bumper and was it as easy to install as the pics I posted made it look? Which way did you go with the winch install, did you put the box in like I did or go with the other option?
Regardless, you are set up for some serious fun. Can't wait to get a look at Bonnie all dressed up for some wheel'n...
Yes I like the bumper a lot. Good design, good workmanship, light but strong, no complaints. I especially like the crackle finish powder coat.
I did the box like you except ran the strap down. The bumper was easy to install, but I took a lot of time getting the winch in. I must have spent an hour trying to put the bolts into the nuts with lock washers before I finally realized the washers had to go under the bolt head instead of the nut. They didn't name the bumper D'O for nothing. The rubber boots over the connections were a pain too. I should have just put them in hot water for a while but I just kept playing with them. I basically worked real slow, enjoyed the day and bonding with my FJ.
Question: I have two plastic caps or covers that came with the winch, about one inch in diameter. I hope they weren't important because I didn't see anywhere to put them.
What I expected to be the hardest part, mounting the loaded bumper, turned out to be a breeze. I jacked it to the top of my floor jack and my lady and I heaved it onto the studs. She's not frail but I was surprised we managed. If it hadn't fit first time we may not have had the strength for a second but of course I had fitted it up before the winch went in so I knew it fitted.
Thanks for the links, they really helped.
I bought a cheap ($70) air compressor kit from Harbor Freight for now. Logan had one at Cullowhee and it worked pretty well. Saved considerable money and the space for an extra battery maybe some day. I aired up with it at URE and it seemed to take about the usual amount of time. I'll probably get a kitchen timer so I can do other stuff while it's running.
Fuzzy dice maybe for my 'stang. I want a shrunken head for my Voodoo Blue FJ.
b
I did the box like you except ran the strap down. The bumper was easy to install, but I took a lot of time getting the winch in. I must have spent an hour trying to put the bolts into the nuts with lock washers before I finally realized the washers had to go under the bolt head instead of the nut. They didn't name the bumper D'O for nothing. The rubber boots over the connections were a pain too. I should have just put them in hot water for a while but I just kept playing with them. I basically worked real slow, enjoyed the day and bonding with my FJ.
Question: I have two plastic caps or covers that came with the winch, about one inch in diameter. I hope they weren't important because I didn't see anywhere to put them.
What I expected to be the hardest part, mounting the loaded bumper, turned out to be a breeze. I jacked it to the top of my floor jack and my lady and I heaved it onto the studs. She's not frail but I was surprised we managed. If it hadn't fit first time we may not have had the strength for a second but of course I had fitted it up before the winch went in so I knew it fitted.
Thanks for the links, they really helped.
I bought a cheap ($70) air compressor kit from Harbor Freight for now. Logan had one at Cullowhee and it worked pretty well. Saved considerable money and the space for an extra battery maybe some day. I aired up with it at URE and it seemed to take about the usual amount of time. I'll probably get a kitchen timer so I can do other stuff while it's running.
Fuzzy dice maybe for my 'stang. I want a shrunken head for my Voodoo Blue FJ.
b
You got it all covered but where to find that shrunken head...
"Probably start with some heep driver that says the wrong thing."
Something like this maybe?
Something like this maybe?
You just had that lying around the house, huh? Hmmmm.
It's actually a picture of me before my morning coffee.
I figured it was you, the lips and eyes aren't stiched up.
b
b
Broken Rear Control Arm
This is a transfer from the Gulches thread which I had hijacked.
I broke a Lower Control Arm down there Sunday and I had mentioned it in that thread.
In the Gulches thread BMThiker wrote:
All-Pro has two versions, but only the pricey one ($350) is pictured on their website. If you check the other forum in the vendor section you'll find the less expensive ones ($200), which are made from square tube instead of round tube. Cheaper ones reuse your OEM bushings and are not adjustable--just a HD replacement for your OEM arms. Pricey ones come with Johnny Joints or something like that and are adjustable.
I went by Toyota today and priced OEM and they are $226/176 EACH!
The two different prices are 'Retail' and 'Trade'. The guy gave me the $176 price. I asked him what they meant and he said "Retail is what we can charge and trade is what we have to get for them. It depends on your attitude and the expression on your face when you come in which price you get."
I don't know if Rick Arflin is discounting the retail or trade price, there's almost 25% difference between them but regardless of that I am going to go with the All-Pros, plus the skid plate they sell to protect them.
Rick PM'd me with more details and I'll study them and decided which to go with but it will probably be the top-of-the-line. An engineering maxim I picked up at Clemson: When in doubt, build it stout.
One alternative is to rebuild my originals with DOM tubing. If my buddy the machinist/metal expert comes by this afternoon I'll show him the All-Pros and discuss beefing mine up instead. He likes to build stuff, has built two buggies and lots of other stuff. His dad has a fab shop and Brian works in the machine shop at BMW.
But what I like about the All-Pro is the adjustable length. When I got my lift Toyota was not able to get the caster in when I got it re-aligned. I didn't ask which end but it's pretty much a given that stock links would change the caster. Isn't it???
This is a transfer from the Gulches thread which I had hijacked.
I broke a Lower Control Arm down there Sunday and I had mentioned it in that thread.
In the Gulches thread BMThiker wrote:
All-Pro has two versions, but only the pricey one ($350) is pictured on their website. If you check the other forum in the vendor section you'll find the less expensive ones ($200), which are made from square tube instead of round tube. Cheaper ones reuse your OEM bushings and are not adjustable--just a HD replacement for your OEM arms. Pricey ones come with Johnny Joints or something like that and are adjustable.
I went by Toyota today and priced OEM and they are $226/176 EACH!
The two different prices are 'Retail' and 'Trade'. The guy gave me the $176 price. I asked him what they meant and he said "Retail is what we can charge and trade is what we have to get for them. It depends on your attitude and the expression on your face when you come in which price you get."
I don't know if Rick Arflin is discounting the retail or trade price, there's almost 25% difference between them but regardless of that I am going to go with the All-Pros, plus the skid plate they sell to protect them.
Rick PM'd me with more details and I'll study them and decided which to go with but it will probably be the top-of-the-line. An engineering maxim I picked up at Clemson: When in doubt, build it stout.
One alternative is to rebuild my originals with DOM tubing. If my buddy the machinist/metal expert comes by this afternoon I'll show him the All-Pros and discuss beefing mine up instead. He likes to build stuff, has built two buggies and lots of other stuff. His dad has a fab shop and Brian works in the machine shop at BMW.
But what I like about the All-Pro is the adjustable length. When I got my lift Toyota was not able to get the caster in when I got it re-aligned. I didn't ask which end but it's pretty much a given that stock links would change the caster. Isn't it???
Correction:
All-Pro has three price points now:
Pro Links $350/pr adjustable with JJ ends, zerks
Ultimate Links $280/pr heavier square construction, but uses OEM bushings, no lube
Extreme Links $200/pr comes with new Urethane bushings, zerks
Some of their products are on sale now, but the above is regular retail.
I'm getting the Extreme Links and some skids for the Lower Control arm bracket for $180 and $70 respectively.
Bill - sounds like you had a good time, too bad Bonnie suffered a breakage. From what I've gleened from many "serious" off-roaders, this is the weak link besides the front CV's.
If it were me, I would pony up for the beefiest available, the links from Sonoran Steel. Yes, they are pricey but look to be bombproof. The "pro links" from Allpro look very stout also and are $100 less than the Sonoran steel links. I don't know the value in having them adjustable since I have been told its not needed for lifts under 3". I guess I see the adjustability adding some weakness to the link as compared to a single piece of solid DOM steel.
But, like the others have said, use the stock as a back up and get something that you can bang up and feel sure you will get out and home safely. Seeing you go through this is making me think that I need to be pro-active and pony up now for the Sonoran units instead of waiting to break one, like I have been advised to do...
If it were me, I would pony up for the beefiest available, the links from Sonoran Steel. Yes, they are pricey but look to be bombproof. The "pro links" from Allpro look very stout also and are $100 less than the Sonoran steel links. I don't know the value in having them adjustable since I have been told its not needed for lifts under 3". I guess I see the adjustability adding some weakness to the link as compared to a single piece of solid DOM steel.
But, like the others have said, use the stock as a back up and get something that you can bang up and feel sure you will get out and home safely. Seeing you go through this is making me think that I need to be pro-active and pony up now for the Sonoran units instead of waiting to break one, like I have been advised to do...
Now I dunno.
The 'flex' joint in the Sonoran Steel item could be a plus, but the greasable feature in the AP is nice too. If, that is, you ever grease them. AP Pro is .281 wall DOM* vs .250 at SS. I don't know the diameter of the SS, AllPro is 1.75 and looks like maybe wider than SS.
The adjustable feature has undefined value for me. My lift is 3" but it seems like it could be a plus. Weakness at the adjuster should not be an issue. Bending stress is maximal at the center of the strut, at the ends only shear is a factor, in this case a non-issue, I'm sure the bolt into the strut can handle that.
Decisions, decisions.
The Extreme at AllPro is way cheaper, has new urethane bushings, and has the same wall thickness DOM tubing as Sonoran Steel. At less than half the price.
That's where I'm tending now unless someone thinks greasability and adjustability, or ball joint flex are a valuable consideration.
I read posts in the FJC forum until I got bleary eyed. I saw no conclusive input. Apprently this failure is not that frequent, albeit it looks like it would be. Someone said the trail teams run stock LCAs, never have problems. Maybe they don't wheel quite the same as I do. I'm sure hacked TRAC helps.
Enough of all this.
b
*DOM (drawn over mandrel) tubing is clearly the way to go. The welded seam is eliminated, and drawing makes steel stonger-aligns the molecules or sump'm. My metallurgy consultant sez DOM is FAR stronger than standard tubing. FYI
OK one more thing. All Pro is Lifetime Warranty. Sonoran Steel doesn't mention that. I don't know if that makes them any stronger but it does mean you'll only buy them once. I guess I just sold myself unless contrary opinions henceforth prevail. Also AllPro has the bracket sliders I want to get. One stop shopping.
Lemme outta here.
b
The 'flex' joint in the Sonoran Steel item could be a plus, but the greasable feature in the AP is nice too. If, that is, you ever grease them. AP Pro is .281 wall DOM* vs .250 at SS. I don't know the diameter of the SS, AllPro is 1.75 and looks like maybe wider than SS.
The adjustable feature has undefined value for me. My lift is 3" but it seems like it could be a plus. Weakness at the adjuster should not be an issue. Bending stress is maximal at the center of the strut, at the ends only shear is a factor, in this case a non-issue, I'm sure the bolt into the strut can handle that.
Decisions, decisions.
The Extreme at AllPro is way cheaper, has new urethane bushings, and has the same wall thickness DOM tubing as Sonoran Steel. At less than half the price.
That's where I'm tending now unless someone thinks greasability and adjustability, or ball joint flex are a valuable consideration.
I read posts in the FJC forum until I got bleary eyed. I saw no conclusive input. Apprently this failure is not that frequent, albeit it looks like it would be. Someone said the trail teams run stock LCAs, never have problems. Maybe they don't wheel quite the same as I do. I'm sure hacked TRAC helps.
Enough of all this.
b
*DOM (drawn over mandrel) tubing is clearly the way to go. The welded seam is eliminated, and drawing makes steel stonger-aligns the molecules or sump'm. My metallurgy consultant sez DOM is FAR stronger than standard tubing. FYI
OK one more thing. All Pro is Lifetime Warranty. Sonoran Steel doesn't mention that. I don't know if that makes them any stronger but it does mean you'll only buy them once. I guess I just sold myself unless contrary opinions henceforth prevail. Also AllPro has the bracket sliders I want to get. One stop shopping.
Lemme outta here.
b
Bill - I think you nailed all the points well. It has made me look closely at the AllPro also. Like you said, one stop shop with the links and skids, out the door for half the price of the Sonoran. And, with that lifetime guarantee, good deal!
Actually, there is a thread regarding the Rubithon last year and I think that at least one was bent by the trail team and one broke (by the "amateur") and I have read many other reports of bent ones which broke when tried to straighten. So, I think its a valuable upgrade, one that I have to thank those that referenced the Allpro links, they look to be the best choice in value and strength...
Actually, there is a thread regarding the Rubithon last year and I think that at least one was bent by the trail team and one broke (by the "amateur") and I have read many other reports of bent ones which broke when tried to straighten. So, I think its a valuable upgrade, one that I have to thank those that referenced the Allpro links, they look to be the best choice in value and strength...
Bill - this one is your fault, pulled the trigger on the AllPro "extreme" LCA's with the skids...couldn't turn down the lower price over the Sonoran as well as the "lifetime guarantee". The sale price BMThiker mentioned pushed me over the edge...
Keep the change.http://images.ih8mud.com/images/smilies/cheers.gif
I think the AP Extreme should serve my needs. If they bend I'll move up a notch, save my bushings out of the broken one.
After all the post this afternoon I studied a little more and there may be some value in the AP Ultimate in strength and possibly the stock bushings are higher quality but I don't know if the benefit is worth a) the hassle of pressing out the bushings and moving them and b) not having a spare and c) one hundred simoleans.
What mine actually did was bend up far enough to crack, then the ride home they fatigued and broke half in two. The good new is you can limp home under that situation. The bad news is I didn't even know I'd done it until I was driving out. One more rowdy obstacle might have broken the other one and wrapped my axle.
b
I think the AP Extreme should serve my needs. If they bend I'll move up a notch, save my bushings out of the broken one.
After all the post this afternoon I studied a little more and there may be some value in the AP Ultimate in strength and possibly the stock bushings are higher quality but I don't know if the benefit is worth a) the hassle of pressing out the bushings and moving them and b) not having a spare and c) one hundred simoleans.
What mine actually did was bend up far enough to crack, then the ride home they fatigued and broke half in two. The good new is you can limp home under that situation. The bad news is I didn't even know I'd done it until I was driving out. One more rowdy obstacle might have broken the other one and wrapped my axle.
b
Like the man said: "It's not breakage, it's an upgrade opportunity."
I've meant to mention; my new bumper proved its worth in another way Sunday besides getting to snatch Hollie's hummer out of a fix. At one point Tim's 40 choked and rolled back into me. His left quarter made brisk contact with my left tow point. Net outcome of the kiss; a dent as big as your head in his quarter, two small flecks of yellow paint on my bumper. Jason builds a tough bumper. If I'd had my stock bumper I'd have left Gulches with tupperware dangling and possibly a broken bezel and maybe headlight.
side note: this is why 4-5 car lengths is good offroad 
