- Joined
- Jul 30, 2003
- Threads
- 69
- Messages
- 2,866
- Location
- Broomfield, Colorado
- Website
- www.gamiviti.com
front bumper/bull bar (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter landarcht
- Start date
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.
sleeoffroad
Supporting Vendor
I wish Slee would take the bottom of his bumper and add the top of a TJM T15. Sort of like this one designed by bamachem.
That is easy to draw, not so easy to execute. The radius on those bends is not something that you get out of a regular tube bender. At least not in a tubing size that is proportional to the bumper. We spent three days bending tube and this is what we came up with. We were not a huge fan of that look. So we would have to invest in custom tubing dies to get a radius on the bends that will look decent.
I have to agree...the tube work on the Blueberry does that bumper no justice.
Why not just weld in Elbow 90's?
sleeoffroad
Supporting Vendor
The amount of work to weld tube together and get it smooth is ridiculous. The bigger issue is strength. Do you just want it to look cool or actually work. Most people want the tubes for hitting bambi. Welding some poo-pipe together is not going to do much. That large tube is probably 3". It takes a massive bender do bend that tube.
I might be able to help you with that if you're interested in outside fab. I'll PM you.
I don't pretend to know everything there is to know about welding...but I used to do it in the military, and when I welded pipe together, the pipe would deform before my welds would break. I don't see strength being the primary issue. 
I do agree though that getting it to look good would be the bigger challenge. If you don't mind the look of welded joints, then fine. But if you want smooth tubing, it probably needs to be one piece. Griding down the welds somewhat compromises the integrity of the joint, but that's not as big of an issue as it looking like total crap - unless you spend an inordinate amount of time on it. Not very cost effective from a manufacturing standpoint.
Bottom line, I see where the issues are for Slee and crew, and they can be tough to get around.
I do agree though that getting it to look good would be the bigger challenge. If you don't mind the look of welded joints, then fine. But if you want smooth tubing, it probably needs to be one piece. Griding down the welds somewhat compromises the integrity of the joint, but that's not as big of an issue as it looking like total crap - unless you spend an inordinate amount of time on it. Not very cost effective from a manufacturing standpoint.
Bottom line, I see where the issues are for Slee and crew, and they can be tough to get around.
sleeoffroad
Supporting Vendor
I am sure it can be welded to be tough enough, however based on other threads on the forum, people would want it for cheap. Those two things are not going to go hand in hand. For a one-off in the garage it is probably ok, but not for production.
Doing that radius of a bend with 2" (.120 wall) tubing is going to be a bear.
This is a list of die available for a tubing bender. Most of the 2" dies are 6" to 7" radius. Cut that out of a piece of cardboard and then see how that changes the design. Larger tubing it gets even worse. That middle tube is probably 3" plus as drawn. Total span is 30" as indicated. If you did get a die with a 7.5" radius, then half the hoop width is going to be taken up with a bend.
An example is the bends around the lights that we made vs the drawing. I would agree that we don't have the smallest die for that size tubing (1.75") but I look at what the smallest size is and I could not come up with a die that would make a dramatic difference in looks.
Baileigh / RMD Tube Bender Dies at Van Sant Enterprises, Inc.
Obviously the resources TJM & ARB have is different to ours and they can probably reproduce that. However I would like to see what size tubing they use.
Doing that radius of a bend with 2" (.120 wall) tubing is going to be a bear.
This is a list of die available for a tubing bender. Most of the 2" dies are 6" to 7" radius. Cut that out of a piece of cardboard and then see how that changes the design. Larger tubing it gets even worse. That middle tube is probably 3" plus as drawn. Total span is 30" as indicated. If you did get a die with a 7.5" radius, then half the hoop width is going to be taken up with a bend.
An example is the bends around the lights that we made vs the drawing. I would agree that we don't have the smallest die for that size tubing (1.75") but I look at what the smallest size is and I could not come up with a die that would make a dramatic difference in looks.
Baileigh / RMD Tube Bender Dies at Van Sant Enterprises, Inc.
Obviously the resources TJM & ARB have is different to ours and they can probably reproduce that. However I would like to see what size tubing they use.
hoser
SILVER Star
And the few big brand bumpers I have seen that use the ~3" front tubing, the tubing is quite thin walled. TJM T3 and ARB Sahara come to mind.
For a hooped bumper, I like the Opposite Lock X-Rox bulbar. A little less 'refined' but that's okay. It's modular so it should be easier/cheaper to ship.
For a hooped bumper, I like the Opposite Lock X-Rox bulbar. A little less 'refined' but that's okay. It's modular so it should be easier/cheaper to ship.
As an FYI, the below is what we can do with an automated tube weld ("orbital weld"). This is 2" 0.065 304 Stainless. Pic quality isn't that great but you get the idea. I believe it can do up to .106 wall. Not sure about .120, but that's probably overkill. The picture is a raw, unground, unpolished weld.
^^Thats Killer!
I love the look of the Opposite Lock bumper but shipping from Au is not cheap...
I love the look of the Opposite Lock bumper but shipping from Au is not cheap...
hoser
SILVER Star
This might be a way to save on shipping...
https://forum.ih8mud.com/diesel-jdm-parts/523430-container-space-australia.html
https://forum.ih8mud.com/diesel-jdm-parts/523430-container-space-australia.html
As an FYI, the below is what we can do with an automated tube weld ("orbital weld"). This is 2" 0.065 304 Stainless. Pic quality isn't that great but you get the idea. I believe it can do up to .106 wall. Not sure about .120, but that's probably overkill. The picture is a raw, unground, unpolished weld.
Well ya had to go and bust out the fancy automated stuff now, didn't ya.
I'm guessing the structual rigidity would be sound enough to hold up to bending operations? Or does the machine have the ability to weld around pieces that are already bent?
Cool stuff, by the way.
Well ya had to go and bust out the fancy automated stuff now, didn't ya.
I'm guessing the structual rigidity would be sound enough to hold up to bending operations? Or does the machine have the ability to weld around pieces that are already bent?
Cool stuff, by the way.
The head needs about a 1/2" tangent for the collets to grip on, more for the larger sizes. It's a single-pass full-pen weld, so bending is no problemo. We actually do an ID purge so the weld looks as good on the inside as on the out, obviously not necessary for bumper material but critical for use in process chems and gasses.
- Joined
- Jul 30, 2003
- Threads
- 69
- Messages
- 2,866
- Location
- Broomfield, Colorado
- Website
- www.gamiviti.com
Agreed, cool info on the fab skilz!
and hey FWIW, I'm going to back off from the BIO deal posted earlier, current plan is to hold out for a TJM. So if anyone wants to snipe me on that one please go ahead.. I may swing back the other way, who knows.. it's a tough call.
and hey FWIW, I'm going to back off from the BIO deal posted earlier, current plan is to hold out for a TJM. So if anyone wants to snipe me on that one please go ahead.. I may swing back the other way, who knows.. it's a tough call.
Christo, would this be something that you could do with less of a hassle?
sleeoffroad
Supporting Vendor
Those upper corners are still an issue, as is the bottom one. The outside tubes need to be 1.75" DIA to make it look proportional. Also, we do not have a "landing pad" that size on the outside edges. The tube ends up in front of the light. That coupled with the center sections that have to be lazered and then the flat pieces folded over it will not be cheap to reproduce.
And what do you end up with? An ARB copy other than the bottom.
And what do you end up with? An ARB copy other than the bottom.
But the bottom is 1/2 of the bumper. If it is too difficult to do, then it is too difficult to do. I just like the Slee bumper combined with some sort of extended upper tube work. Nothing wrong with a little brainstorming!
sleeoffroad
Supporting Vendor
I am not saying it can't be done, but I am saying at what cost. Also for us we have to look at the production cost and the repeatability. One a one-off when you are prepared to loose money (ie guy in the garage doing his own work, and time is not charged for), I am sure it can be done. There are a couple of issues with translating that drawing into practice. Most of them is related to how far the bumper sticks out. There is no way that size upright will fit on a a Blueberry bumper.
This will give you an idea on how much space there is to land the tubing as well as to the upper support.
Here is a comparison shot.
The other issue is where it would be located. On the LX it would be straight in front of the light since it would have to line up with the tow point.
This will give you an idea on how much space there is to land the tubing as well as to the upper support.
Here is a comparison shot.
The other issue is where it would be located. On the LX it would be straight in front of the light since it would have to line up with the tow point.
