FJ60 Updates- Fuel Injection

[White Stripe]

@White Stripe do you use the 60 dist for timing control or do you program it in the chip?

Not much to go wrong with the 3fe dist supplied by AFI. Glad I did not go with the DUI hei dist.

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Ive just heard a lot of people having problems with the chinese dui distributors as far as the bushings in the shaft wearing out. Is that what AFI supplies or is it a aftermarket dui? The factory toyota japanese distributors seem to never have any problems. I use the fj60 distributor for timing control. Its not as well packaged as a aftermarket dui but does the same thing. The programming is the same.

 

[74fj40]

You may consider just doing the 4:1 tcase fear as opposed to axle regear, you’ll get a slightly lower highrange and a MUCH lower low range.

 

[tclark]

not up on all the aftermarket setups.
why not go with the 3fe setup?
is it cheaper easier going 1 route over another?

This seems to be a much simpler conversion from what I can tell. You can order a complete kit at a reasonable price, and it basically just replaces your carb. Going 3FE means rounding up a bunch of parts, swapping heads, thermostat housings, etc. While still relatively simple it's definitely more involved and you can't just order a complete kit(that I'm aware of).

 

[3_puppies]

Going 3FE means rounding up a bunch of parts, swapping heads, thermostat housings, etc. While still relatively simple it's definitely more involved and you can't just order a complete kit(that I'm aware of).

all depends on who you get the "kit" parts from.

I guess for me, it is still all Toyota, you can get the parts and help if needed is always here, versus an aftermarket kit that if you have a problem, troubleshooting could be an issue.

my question was more for info as to why 1 versus the other.

 

[SteveH]

Is that what AFI supplies or is it a aftermarket dui?

AFI uses a 3F-E distributor and mills of all but 6 of the 'teeth' on the reluctor ring. This provides the trigger for the coil and the EFI and presumably also serves as a crankshaft position sensor. Needless to say, the 3F-E dist. drops right into the Toyota engine.

 

[tclark]

all depends on who you get the "kit" parts from.

I guess for me, it is still all Toyota, you can get the parts and help if needed is always here, versus an aftermarket kit that if you have a problem, troubleshooting could be an issue.

my question was more for info as to why 1 versus the other.

That's what I gave you. I'm with on the upsides of the 3FE, but there's no doubt the AFI or similar would be an easier quicker install for most. Around here these rigs aren't just everywhere and finding one to rob the parts off of can be a pain, and when you do it's often 30yr old stuff.

 

[White Stripe]

I just through put the idea of the 3fe efi because then u also get higher compression.

 

[tclark]

You could do the same with this route if you wanted. It seems that if one were to do the same work to the motor--new cam, compression bump, Chevy valves, etc(on a 2f block of course), then you'd get very similar results with either injection system, but I don't know that for sure. Maybe the 3fe intake manifold would flow better, idk but I bet it's not much difference.

 

[LAMBCRUSHER]

3FE intake and exhaust are near impossible to beat. heck, 3FE exhaust is better than headers AFAIC, due to their being heavy cast iron. they do not hamper flow whatsoever.

Chevy valves work in either 2 or 3F heads; just need to either use 2F rocker with all same length stems in a 3F application, or use the +.100 exhaust valves. PEP has got stainless SBC valve for pennies.

Higher compression is not necessarily our friend here, guys. we haven't got the squish zone for it. besides, pump gas costs enough as it is; no need to strap on the need to spend even more at the pump. you do get a bump in compression due to the longer throw of the 2F, but the real plus to any fuel injection is the rock solid metering.

there is a real upside to not needing to mess with the head or exhaust tract. it should not be dismissed. just as the 2FE should not be dismissed when considering this upgrade. I will concede; it is not the correct route for every application.

DUI is not something I associate with driving in a positive light...

 

[Rusty 72]

I did research the 3FE swap. Its probably better for overall power and fuel economy. Reason I went with AFI. Replacement parts are everywhere, proven reliability and its super easy to install compared to the 3FE.

I will be using @Downey tbi adapter, heated oxygen sensor, vss from dakota digital, 3FE distributor and AFI's custom chip. This is going on a 74 F.5 with Delta cams 250s grind.

 

[ADVFJ80]

Lots of good information coming in! I'm interested in ease of install, and AFI will re-program the chip if there are tuning issues that cannot be resolved. I like the AFI kit, as it seems they've done their homework, built a kit specific for this motor, and from what I can tell- support the product.

Engine swaps are not off the table, just pushed down the road a ways. I use my rig quite a bit in the summer, and don't want to end in a months long project. As it is, FI, gears/lockers, armor, axle rebuilds are going to eat up my weekends in the foreseeable future.

 

[ADVFJ80]

I think one thing I would recommend is rather than use the AFI distributor I would convert the FJ60 distributor to work with the EFI. The FJ60 factory distributor is very high quality. If you do get the AFI kit, I'm in Denver, I would give you 100 bucks to let me download the AFI EFI program. I want to see what the difference is between my diy programming and afi's programming. I get 16MPG with 35s with my fj40 at 70mph with tbi fuel injection. Above tree line I have no fuel issues, on steep inclines in Moab it runs perfect.
As far as gears, anything lower than 4.11s will kill your highway rpms unless you have a 5 speed. The other option would be to throw on a 3fe head and EFI and turn your 2f into a 2fe.

If you can download the data off of OBDI without compromising anything, you can download it for free. Just gotta get to Gypsum!

 

[White Stripe]

If you can download the data off of OBDI without compromising anything, you can download it for free. Just gotta get to Gypsum!

Thanks man. But I need my desktop computer to do it. It has a chip reader that can read the program.

 

[ADVFJ80]

Thanks man. But I need my desktop computer to do it. It has a chip reader that can read the program.

Ah, I'm not sure I'll have it down that way anytime soon.

 

[ADVFJ80]

I am wrapping up an AFI conversion on my '78 FJ40 (2F). Same issues with vapor locking, hot soaking, stalling, etc. in Colorado for 15 years. So far, the AFI kit has made sense, but you will discover a few things that complicate matters (gas pedal and cable fit-up, wiring lengths, etc.). Not AFI's fault; it's just the nature of such kits.

I will bookmark this and try to remember to report back when finished. I live at 7000' and my FJ40 used to run great when gasoline was more engineered for carburetors, but I literally can't use/drive my FJ40 when temps are above 60F.

Please do link! If you're documenting in a build thread, I'll see if I can find that. I did notice that AFI is offering longer harness lengths at the time of order. Thirty inches is the length included in the base price, and you can purchase lengths up to 96"! I was leaning towards the 48" option. It'd be nice to see how yours comes together.

Thanks,
Randy

 

[SteveH]

Thirty inches is the length included in the base price, and you can purchase lengths up to 96"! I was leaning towards the 48" option. It'd be nice to see how yours comes together.

I don't have a build thread - and might write a Toyota Trails article on the installation. On advice of another Mud guy, I ordered the next-longer harness (48", I think) - to be sure the oxygen sensor wire was long enough. This seems wise. There are a few other wiring issues (wires too short) due to the generic nature of the harness, but it's coming together.

 

[ADVFJ80]

Thirty inches is the length included in the base price, and you can purchase lengths up to 96"! I was leaning towards the 48" option. It'd be nice to see how yours comes together.

I don't have a build thread - and might write a Toyota Trails article on the installation. On advice of another Mud guy, I ordered the next-longer harness (48", I think) - to be sure the oxygen sensor wire was long enough. This seems wise. There are a few other wiring issues (wires too short) due to the generic nature of the harness, but it's coming together.

Got it. I thought you meant harness to ECU distance, but understand that it just the wiring harness in general. Good to know, thank you!

 

[447xpro]

This seems to be a much simpler conversion from what I can tell. You can order a complete kit at a reasonable price, and it basically just replaces your carb. Going 3FE means rounding up a bunch of parts, swapping heads, thermostat housings, etc. While still relatively simple it's definitely more involved and you can't just order a complete kit(that I'm aware of).

Cruiserparts.net has a kit for $2775

 

[samchappel]

Hi Randy - just curious if you went through with the fuel injection conversion and how your truck runs now. We (my fj60 and myself) recently moved from sea level on the east coast to CO - and aside from power, I’m having an issue getting it to pass emissions. I’ve been given the run around by shops out here trying to address this!

 

[lehiguy]

I'm trespassing in the 60 forum for old time's sake. Coincidentally I was just thinking today about my old FJ60 and all the money I wasted on the boat anchor 2F. I eventually did put in a 350 and I giggled every time I drove it. I should have done it right from the start. There is no upgrade that will get the 2F to perform like a 350 but there are 1000 ways to empty your wallet trying.