Fixing Front Wheel Bearing Preload

[bicycleagent003]

Hey Team,

I did my front birf's a couple weeks back, and put the truck on stands this weekend to check for play in the front wheel bearings. With both front wheels still on, and using their weight to try and rock the front hubs on the spindle (not being crazy forceful, but trying to get some movement if possible), I found neither side moved when holding at 9 and 3 o'clock. When I held and rocked at 12 and 6, the PS rocked a bit and the DS a very small amount if at all.

So, would you agree I should go back in and tighten the lock nut behind the star washer on each side? If so, should I take the hubs off and start over, or just tighten them each up a bit without removing the hubs? I'm thinking it makes more sense not to remove the hubs and just tighten the lock nut. Do you have a suggestion about how much I should be looking to turn the lock washer, half turn, etc.? I realize this is largely based on feel (I'm using Jonesy's method, no fish scale), but if you've had a similar situation and can offer some guidance on how much I should expect to tighten it I'd appreciate it. This is my first time doing this.

Thanks
Russell

 

[Tools R Us]

I just torque the inner nut to ~30ft/lb, then the outer to 47ft/lb, bend the tabs, done.

 

[Alleycats]

I also do what Tools says above, works good, no play.

 

[Wayne]

I deleted my original post here because it was incorrect information. Sorry, I'll be more technically correct next time.

 

[bicycleagent003]

Thanks, guys.
The advice on this forum is priceless.

 

[rockstate45]

Careful of the final torque on the adjusting nut. It's in INCH pounds, not in foot pounds. If you have the FSM available, check page SA-9 and that's where it has the step by step procedure.

 

[rockstate45]

To better explain, I took a picture of my screen. Hope this helps!

 

[-Spike-]

If I recall correctly (and I often do NOT) Kevin (Tools-R-Us) did some experimenting years ago with preload torque and its effect on rolling resistance on an 80 hub and found that every 1 ft/lb of torque on the adjusting nut equaled approximately 1 ft/lb of rolling resistance for the assembly, in the 10-20 ft/lb range. He researched bearing preloads on other similar and more extreme applications, and concluded that the type and size of bearing used in the 80 hub should have no problem, and in fact benefit greatly, with significantly more preload than Toyota specifies. (In explaining it to me, he referenced one precision application (his shop lathe) that called for something like 90 ft/lbs of rolling resistance on a similarly sized bearing, which ran at higher RPM's than a vehicle would ever achieve) At that time he was recommending 15 ft/lbs of torque on the adjusting nut, being conservative in case there was some unforseen reasoning behind Toyota's specs. I, knowing he often gives conservative advice to other people, asked him what he would set his own bearings at. 20 ft/lbs was the answer at that time, several (5+?) years ago, and so I set mine and several other people's at 20. I've wheeled mine pretty hard since then with no issues, been into the hubs to replace parts and looked at the bearings and spindles and found no problems- and nothing has ever loosened. Apparently, judging by the above post from him, he has upped his recommendation to 30 ft/lbs, which tells me his own bearings are probably at 35.

That being said, Wayne's method scares me a bit. Not the final adjustment nut torque of 43 ft/lbs, as many people have done this because of the confusion brought on by the Toyota FSM, which switches between inch/lbs and foot/lbs, leading many people to torque the adjusting nut to 48 ft/lbs, oddly with no catastrophic failures or dead nuns. Cranking that bad boy to 75 ft/lbs to seat the bearings concerns me, in that the nut isn't all that robust and I would worry about stressing its threads or those on the spindle. I do believe that many loose bearings are caused by not seating the bearings correctly, but the 43 ft/lbs of torque combined with rolling the assembly around several times, rinse and repeat, as laid out in the manual seems to do a fine job and is probably close to the max torque for the adjusting nut. That's just a wild guess though, maybe the adjusting nut can withstand 300 ft/lbs.

Bottom line, Kevin doesn't toss out advice he isn't absolutely confident of, and much research and experience is behind it. Few people know just how much work Kevin has actually done on these vehicles and others like them- I'd guess he has done hundreds of axle reseals as he's been the local go-to guy for Landcruiser maintenance for years, and has worked on vehicles in general for most of his life.

 

[Hornd]

I performed it like the Duiser Youtube Video stated.
It think it's important to ensure the bearing is fully seated so I tightened with 1 nut and washer then back the two off completely.
Now grab the 54mm socket with your hands and tighten like you are holding an apple, tight but no tight enough to crush an apple.
Add the tabbed washer and second nut and torque to spec.
I give it a sample spin each way to ensure no horizontal or vertical play yet still can rotate freely.
I have done boat bearings in this same manner for years with zero failures.


**I used Timkin bearings with Timkin Tub of Red Grease. Timkin thou not Japanese, is a proven name. They bought the Needle Bearing division of Koyo.

 

[Alleycats]

I go 20 ft/lbs on the inner nut, then the lock washer, and then 46 ft/lbs on the outer nut. Although if you replaced the wheel bearing/races you have to first seat those properly before using this method.

 

[SmokingRocks]

What about bigger tires? I've heard the preload should be more for 35, 37s ect. Anyone run tighter on their bearings?

 

[jkdowty]

If you aren't getting any play left and right (3-9) but are receiving play top to bottom (12-6) that leads me to suspect loose trunnions... I did wheel bearings on mine a few months back and had the same issue, turns out my trunnions had grooves worn in the bearing races and they were causing all my headache. This may not be the same for yours but it was the case with mine, no left to right play(3-9) but I had top to bottom
(12-6). I did the trunnions and now she is solid as a rock...

 

[-Spike-]

What about bigger tires? I've heard the preload should be more for 35, 37s ect. Anyone run tighter on their bearings?

Sorry, I always assume everyone runs 37's. Large tires are the primary reason we add preload to our bearings around here.

 

[Notch]

If you aren't getting any play left and right (3-9) but are receiving play top to bottom (12-6) that leads me to suspect loose trunnions... I did wheel bearings on mine a few months back and had the same issue, turns out my trunnions had grooves worn in the bearing races and they were causing all my headache. This may not be the same for yours but it was the case with mine, no left to right play(3-9) but I had top to bottom
(12-6). I did the trunnions and now she is solid as a rock...

This was my first thought also.

 

[bicycleagent003]

Thanks, my trunnion bearings are brand new Koyos. All should be ship shape there. I have heard others report their wheel bearings needed a little tightening after the initial install, I think that's all I'm experiencing.

 

[jtwopark]

I just torque the inner nut to ~30ft/lb, then the outer to 47ft/lb, bend the tabs, done.

X2 BUT I added a couple of ft/lbs for just in case measures!.....

 

[mod5csi]

I just torque the inner nut to ~30ft/lb, then the outer to 47ft/lb, bend the tabs, done.

Huh, wish I had known about this before. Tools did some research on this I read? Can someone point me to that?

 

[Kernal]

After many attempts with the fish scale method and based on advice from the forum (Tools, Landtank, etc) I tossed the fish scale and torqued the inner (adjusting) nut to ~ 20 ft lbs. Outer (locking) nut to 47 ft lbs. The front bearings are still snug 50,000 miles and six years later running on slightly larger than stock tires.

 

[-Spike-]

Huh, wish I had known about this before. Tools did some research on this I read? Can someone point me to that?

He doesn't elaborate often in the forums, he told me and showed me in person. I don't know if he's ever explained his bearing theories here.

 

[mod5csi]

He doesn't elaborate often in the forums, he told me and showed me in person. I don't know if he's ever explained his bearing theories here.

Better to keep it simple I suppose. Ive been finding more information and others anecdotes, I like the procedure.

I will try it on the Wife's IFS 4R first. It uses the same bearings, spindle, and FSM torque specs, as the 80 series.