I dunno - I liked the man with the chips
Agree, Chip was alright.
But not an expo guy, so likely gone.
CSC moving forward (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter LandCruiserPhil
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Agree, Chip was alright.
But not an expo guy, so likely gone.
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Agree, mostly. On the ham thing, I have zero problem with it, played with them heavily many years ago. The problem I have is some act like they are "better" than others because they have them, want to force/regulate others to have them so they have others to talk with. I see them as a whole other hobby, not that it's bad, just that some don't want enjoy or need that hobby. I often have to carry multiple radios, find it a pain, grabbing the correct mike, relaying messages over multiple channels, etc, prefer not to do it.
IMHO, a requirement for ham smacks of exclusivity, is a barrier to entry for newbies. For "club type runs" a CB works fine, often it's difficult to to get newbies to install and have a properly working CB, let alone a ham. Maybe it's about the "type" of newbie prefered? Not something that I will support, but again, it's not about me, it's about the club and that looks like the direction the membership wants to go, so do it, don't need my blessing?
The TRAL experience has been a great lesson in eliminating exclusivity, have become pretty sensitive to it. The first hurdle was working with the Forest Service and the compromises required for their extensive regulations. Then how to accommodate Jeep, motorcycle, quad, side by side, VW and those eccentric Toyota guys, etc, to work as a team. At the last couple of meetings, have discussed how to accommodate, compromise to form alliances with hiker, equestrian type groups. It's easy to see the benefit, but difficult to find the "how"?
Unfortunately the club has likely grown too big, has become a group of "clicks". Too many have forgotten that it was about enjoying common/shared interest and let personalities get in the way. As is said in business; I happily do business with some that I wouldn't choose to break bread with. The toxic posts here have taken the fun out of it, I was hoping Phil would take the job, allowing me to backout, escape without drama.
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Saddletramp
GOLD Star
I would never ask for a Detroit meeting location, we couldn't stand around in the parking lot in the winter. Like other members of the club I have two residences, when I am in Phoenix I try to make the meetings.
Saddletramp
GOLD Star
Seriously Kevin, what do you want for our club? Please tell us without mockery what you think CSC should be about.
ChaseTruck
--
Kevin has explained his view in post #12, but I don't think this matters any longer at this point.
Elections for a leadership position are one thing.
But if it'll come down to picking sides (and I think it doesn't need to come to that...), thanks, Phil, but no thanks, I'm not sure I can handle your style. I'm going with Kevin, whether or not he is CSC President. I hope I get to ride trails together with him for a long time to come.
Elections for a leadership position are one thing.
But if it'll come down to picking sides (and I think it doesn't need to come to that...), thanks, Phil, but no thanks, I'm not sure I can handle your style. I'm going with Kevin, whether or not he is CSC President. I hope I get to ride trails together with him for a long time to come.
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- Thread starter
- #67
Rest assured Michael I will not be in the running under any circumstance.
But I do support an open format where group decisions are made as a whole.
ChaseTruck
--
Why the hell not? Kevin handed you the reigns, and many would have been happy and content. Including me - for what little that is worth.
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And now, Something Completely Different:
Woman: Oh. How do you do?
King Arthur: How do you do, good lady? I am Arthur, King of the Britons. Whose castle is that?
Woman: King of the who?
King Arthur: King of the Britons.
Woman: Who are the Britons?
King Arthur: Well, we all are. We are all Britons. And I am your king.
Woman: I didn't know we had a king. I thought we were an autonomous collective.
Dennis: You're foolin' yourself! We're living in a dictatorship. A self-perpetuating autocracy in which the working class...
Woman: Oh, there you go bringing class into it again.
Dennis: Well, that's what it's all about! If only people would...
King Arthur: Please, please, good people, I am in haste. Who lives in that castle?
Woman: No one lives there.
King Arthur: Then who is your lord?
Woman: We don't have a lord.
Dennis: I told you, we're an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to be a sort of executive officer for the week...
King Arthur: Yes...
Dennis: ...but all the decisions of that officer have to be ratified at a special bi-weekly meeting...
King Arthur: Yes I see...
Dennis: ...by a simple majority in the case of purely internal affairs...
King Arthur: Be quiet!
Dennis: ...but by a two thirds majority in the case of...
King Arthur: Be quiet! I order you to be quiet!
Woman: Order, eh? Who does he think he is?
(Credit to Monty Python)
Woman: Oh. How do you do?
King Arthur: How do you do, good lady? I am Arthur, King of the Britons. Whose castle is that?
Woman: King of the who?
King Arthur: King of the Britons.
Woman: Who are the Britons?
King Arthur: Well, we all are. We are all Britons. And I am your king.
Woman: I didn't know we had a king. I thought we were an autonomous collective.
Dennis: You're foolin' yourself! We're living in a dictatorship. A self-perpetuating autocracy in which the working class...
Woman: Oh, there you go bringing class into it again.
Dennis: Well, that's what it's all about! If only people would...
King Arthur: Please, please, good people, I am in haste. Who lives in that castle?
Woman: No one lives there.
King Arthur: Then who is your lord?
Woman: We don't have a lord.
Dennis: I told you, we're an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to be a sort of executive officer for the week...
King Arthur: Yes...
Dennis: ...but all the decisions of that officer have to be ratified at a special bi-weekly meeting...
King Arthur: Yes I see...
Dennis: ...by a simple majority in the case of purely internal affairs...
King Arthur: Be quiet!
Dennis: ...but by a two thirds majority in the case of...
King Arthur: Be quiet! I order you to be quiet!
Woman: Order, eh? Who does he think he is?
(Credit to Monty Python)
The club is what it is and it's served most of us very nicely thank you.
We're now on post 70 and I've yet to see a compelling arguement for change nor do I see any constructive purpose for this entire thread.
Cdaniel
Undocumented Mechanic-I Am Not CDAN
WTF happend in here? Did someone drop a reality show grenade or what? I don't get to as many meetings as I would like, but now I'm thinking I'm lucky to have missed the chemical weapon attack.
Didn't happen at the meet. I did hear something about sharing a case of tainted suppositories originally destined for the state hospital...........
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Hmmm....This whole thing is crazy!!! I may not be a "founding" member but I was around pretty early on when there were only a few handfuls of us.
I was also around when the last "Vote" happened and it was I and Kevin that threw our hats in and I was happy to bow out to Kevin in the interest of what was best for the club. As it turns out, with my schedule that was for sure the correct option. I would be happy to support Phil as Pres, and know that Kevin is super busy these days. Once a club reaches a critical mass it needs strong leadership and most likely, unfortunately, more structure. It appears from this thread we just might have reached that critical mass. The important thing is to keep the structure in line with the vision that has made this club SO great and well respected.
JMHO
I was also around when the last "Vote" happened and it was I and Kevin that threw our hats in and I was happy to bow out to Kevin in the interest of what was best for the club. As it turns out, with my schedule that was for sure the correct option. I would be happy to support Phil as Pres, and know that Kevin is super busy these days. Once a club reaches a critical mass it needs strong leadership and most likely, unfortunately, more structure. It appears from this thread we just might have reached that critical mass. The important thing is to keep the structure in line with the vision that has made this club SO great and well respected.
JMHO
Hmmm... very interesting indeed.
And unfortunate....
BMAN did you end up keeping your 60?
I attended a couple meetings and runs back about 3 years ago and honestly if I had the opportunity CSC was the only club I ever had any interest in joining. The format is perfect as is. BS about cruisers and go have some fun. Lots of options for runs and if it doesn't fit your style just wait for the next one. I am working out of state but my 60 is still in AZ at my house so maybe this winter I can make it out again. If any part of the club gets more structured it would be nice if it was done independently of the nice open format now enjoyed. Maybe a group that is interested in planning more structured runs and holding regular meetings but still allow everyone to post up runs and attend events.
I attended a couple meetings and runs back about 3 years ago and honestly if I had the opportunity CSC was the only club I ever had any interest in joining. The format is perfect as is. BS about cruisers and go have some fun. Lots of options for runs and if it doesn't fit your style just wait for the next one. I am working out of state but my 60 is still in AZ at my house so maybe this winter I can make it out again. If any part of the club gets more structured it would be nice if it was done independently of the nice open format now enjoyed. Maybe a group that is interested in planning more structured runs and holding regular meetings but still allow everyone to post up runs and attend events.
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- www.tontorecreationalliance.org
Again, this is IMHO (in my humble opinion), as in; not speaking for anyone else. Can drop the PM's about; this is not about you, it's about the membership. I get it, but see myself as a member, just like everyone else.
Lets use one of your lines:
This group was formed because most were not happy with the structured/political environment in the other local option. It's ironic/sad/even funny, that they have now gone almost fully free form, only have meetings on the trail, dropped all of their membership requirements, etc, as we attempt to kill our self going more political?
The good? This group has always excelled at providing a conduit for Cruiser heads to get together and share experiences. Anyone is equally able to setup trail runs, etc, has always worked well. This is mainly due to this forum and the Sonic Cruises. Some don't like the Sonic Cruises, oh well, you can't please everyone but, there is no denying it has been hugely successful, long term and many enjoy them. It's very simple, if you don't like them, don't attend, but why spoil a good thing for those who do?
The bad? Political, one of the founding principals was to limit it to the minimum possible. We suck at it, for proof; this is what the, 6th, 8th, an even dozen, of this type of thread since the club started, all equally stupid?
So why do it? I don't see the long line of candidates stepping up to be officers and rightly so, it's a thankless job. The club would function just fine without "officials" don't see why we need some that are "higher/better" than the rest? The only slight reason would be to manage the assets.
So why have assets? The biggie is cash, why do we need it, what productive use have we made of it, can't think of anything significant? The others are the grill, t-shirts/stickers and the web page. Someone will take care of the grill, always have? T-shirts/stickers, plenty have the ability to have them made, run it as a side biz, pocket or donate the proceeds. Web page, I don't use it, don't care, but, isn't a huge amount, if we want to keep it, could prepay long term, then cry for donations when the time comes? The biggest asset that drives this group is this forum, and it's free.
If it were my decision, would get an asset accounting from Phil, a debut accounting from Jackson for the web page. Sell off the t-shirts/stickers, donate the excess $$ to a worthy cause like TRAL or whatever is decided (so something more productive could be done with it than sitting in the bank bag) suspend dues and retire the officers. Yep, we would just be a group that shares a Cruiser/wheeling addiction, but why would that be bad, it is what we do well? This worked very well for a previous group that I was involved in, the most visible example in the off road world is AZ Virtual Jeep Club, they are huge and have been a long term success.
Lets use one of your lines:
This group was formed because most were not happy with the structured/political environment in the other local option. It's ironic/sad/even funny, that they have now gone almost fully free form, only have meetings on the trail, dropped all of their membership requirements, etc, as we attempt to kill our self going more political?
The good? This group has always excelled at providing a conduit for Cruiser heads to get together and share experiences. Anyone is equally able to setup trail runs, etc, has always worked well. This is mainly due to this forum and the Sonic Cruises. Some don't like the Sonic Cruises, oh well, you can't please everyone but, there is no denying it has been hugely successful, long term and many enjoy them. It's very simple, if you don't like them, don't attend, but why spoil a good thing for those who do?
The bad? Political, one of the founding principals was to limit it to the minimum possible. We suck at it, for proof; this is what the, 6th, 8th, an even dozen, of this type of thread since the club started, all equally stupid?
So why do it? I don't see the long line of candidates stepping up to be officers and rightly so, it's a thankless job. The club would function just fine without "officials" don't see why we need some that are "higher/better" than the rest? The only slight reason would be to manage the assets.
So why have assets? The biggie is cash, why do we need it, what productive use have we made of it, can't think of anything significant? The others are the grill, t-shirts/stickers and the web page. Someone will take care of the grill, always have? T-shirts/stickers, plenty have the ability to have them made, run it as a side biz, pocket or donate the proceeds. Web page, I don't use it, don't care, but, isn't a huge amount, if we want to keep it, could prepay long term, then cry for donations when the time comes? The biggest asset that drives this group is this forum, and it's free.
If it were my decision, would get an asset accounting from Phil, a debut accounting from Jackson for the web page. Sell off the t-shirts/stickers, donate the excess $$ to a worthy cause like TRAL or whatever is decided (so something more productive could be done with it than sitting in the bank bag) suspend dues and retire the officers. Yep, we would just be a group that shares a Cruiser/wheeling addiction, but why would that be bad, it is what we do well? This worked very well for a previous group that I was involved in, the most visible example in the off road world is AZ Virtual Jeep Club, they are huge and have been a long term success.
Kurtis, still have it. Still for sale. And I agree with a lot of what Kurtis said. This club was built on the disorganization. That was what brought us clowns together.
Good to hear from ya Bman, show your ugly mug sometime!!
