another franken turbo thread 2h CT26 (1 Viewer)

[gerg]

If your exhaust gasketis not metal reinforced then it stands a good chance of blowing out all together.

Plumbing your oil return to your lifter access cover might work, but even the bend going horizontal might cause the oil to back up into the turbo housing. If the tube diameter is like an inch then it might be ok I guess. I can see the attraction of not pulling the oil pan, I hate it too, but it might be necessary, I would monitor the turbo outlet blow by.

Do a search on 2h or 12ht ring land failures. Old pre cups are also a worry. If you have access to a borescope (5mm or so) you can put it down the injector hole and look directly at the pre cup for cracks.

 

[o8ko8k]

im reading posts about using High temp RTV on the gaskets. Reccomendations?

https://forum.ih8mud.com/40-55-series-tech/416484-exhaust-manifold-sealant.html
http://www.4wdaction.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=78853
https://forum.ih8mud.com/diesel-tec...7-remflex-exhaust-gaskets-toyota-diesels.html

seems odd that the copper maxes out at 700F yet my egt's hit 1200F. Seems like a no go to me, but i suppose the block never gets that hot....

oh and did i mention, i just kinda jam'ed em back on, didnt really clean em up or nothing. I may have to rethink this....


EDIT: ya never mind... I just disassembled the manifold and CYL1 gasket blew out today on my test trip up the "hill". i was whistling dixie all the way home. it was metal reinforced and still went out the side. =( I think ill just get a set of fresh gasgets and clean everything up and put back together. Upon disassembly, some of the screws had worked loose and the other gaskets were starting to show leeks (soot stains on the block).

Joy...

 

[gerg]

If one or more of the manifold bolts loosen and exhaust get past it then over time I doubt anything short of titanium would last. Exhaust can "jet" just about anything away given enought time. Bolt it up tight with a metal reinforced exhaust gasket and It will last.

 

[o8ko8k]

Well the manifold gaskets came in the mail and i have them installed now. WOW. I must have been leeking there pretty bad too.

Im now seeing 4psi at 1500rpm if i really honk on it, and i hit 14psi at 2500. Im afraid to go to 3000rpm now. I was driving it b4 between 2000 and 3000, now i find myself driving it between 1500 and 2200. 8-12PSI right at 2000rpm is an on demand thing. EGTs dont go above 900F unless i start hitting 2500rpm and 12+ psi. Cruising EGTs are about 600F, they were about 900F b4 (but i've set the fuel screw back a bit too).

QUestion: at hwy cruise, the boost never totaly goes away (sits at like 4-7psi) is that ok? DO i have something setup wrong?

Question2: i have a very short down pipe on off the turbo houseing right now. 3" -> 2.5" and its only about 24" long. I hear LOTS of turbo whistling esp when i let off the accelerator peddel. IS that ok? thats not surge right?

I suspect that noise was there all along, it was just running down the 2" tail pipe i had and baffling into the muffler so i couldnt hear it.

I plan to run 2.5" all the way back to the tail tomorrow with some parts and pieces and see if the noise subisdes.

<EDIT> oh and my fuel economy apears to have gone up about 3mpg!!!

 

[Hulsty]

Whistle is fine, and boost all the time is normal, only time boost will be zero pretty much is when there is no load on the motor, ie idle, gear changes it will drop down.

 

[o8ko8k]

It's not the under load whistle that concerns. It's the pshhhhh when I take foot off throttle. Sounds like a ricer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=uHJZYz43dW8

[Video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=uHJZYz43dW8[/Video]

 

[Tapage]

It's not the under load whistle that concerns. It's the pshhhhh when I take foot off throttle. Sounds like a ricer.

guess we will require video to tell ..

 

[blis]

It's not the under load whistle that concerns. It's the pshhhhh when I take foot off throttle. Sounds like a ricer.

Dont worry, it's perfectly normal... Even my stock motor does that (with short and fat exhaust )

 

[o8ko8k]

while i was under the truck today slaving away routing a 2.5" exhaust all the way back, i noticed oil leaking from the front of my engine on the exhuast side. My only guess is my slobber tube for the crankcase vent isnt enough.

i had half the mind to worry about my engine seals, but they were leaking long b4 i started any of this so whats a little extra for a time.

im piping the rocker cover vent (im guessing this is connected to the bottom end somewhere too) into the air filter side of the turbo to give it some suction, im hoping this will help keep the oil from spewing out my front seal.

This is all experimental mind you. i cleaned the engine and will try again and inspect to see if i had the right reason for the oil that is freeing itself from my engine.


YA THAT WORKED! no more oil leaks from the front. ixnay on the slobber tube "a"

 

[o8ko8k]

Here are some photos of recent changes to the setup....

Here is the new crank case vent input into the vacuum side of the intake


rough place where oil was leaking from b4 i moved the Crankcase Vent to the intake side (it was previously in slobber tube mode) Slobber tube mode wasnt sufficent to prevent leaks, intake vacuum was enough to to the trick...


Here is the turbo oil return bung this is a 5/8ths tube for the return.


This is what i chose to do with my water temp sensor from my 3-in-1 Pyro, water, boost gauge. It is tapped into the turbo housing water jacket so i can measure turbo unit temps vs engine temps. After having the digital gauge running in parallel with the stock water temp gauge, i mentally calibrated it. thus i no longer felt i needed to use this sensor as the stock gauge was working well.. Turbo water jacket temps like to hang out at about 177F - 200F. At idle it likes to climb up a bit to about 210F or so. ENgine shutdown, this temp will approach the the final EGT temp. THus the whole wait for the EGT temps to drop b4 engine shut off is a good idea. i think 50/50 radiator fluid boils at 236F. not sure what the pressure values that were used in this calc are that was just a quick google number (236F). But i was waiting for egts to hit 300F b4 shut down, i think ill do it at 250F now...



im working on a 2.5" exhuast all the way back (muffler removed). Here is the progress...




Here is the video of the 3-in-1 diesel gauge complete with sound
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=uHJZYz43dW8

 

[blis]

Dont worry, it's perfectly normal... Even my stock motor does that (with short and fat exhaust )

For the reference, here's a video of my hj61 so you can listen to the beatiful sounds

https://www.dropbox.com/s/llhw502fdqvtatb/VIDEO0004.3gp

 

[No. 3]

o8ko8k,
Thanks for the thread- I have a long overdue turbo install ahead I am ashamed to say how long the parts have been sitting. I have a couple of questions though- where did you get your flanges- were they off the rack or fabricated. (If I can keep out of my friend's busy water jet machine it would be great) and the silicone hoses, where did they come from? I know that they are available on ebay but I am always skeptical of ebay quality on stuff that isn't oem or known secondary supplier made. Thanks and next after tracking down a battery issue (damn the HJ60's batteries!) this weekend the turbo project starts! Best,
Jeff

PS: Where in AZ are you? I lived in Tempe for a year and a half in the mid-eighties. The pool skating (and pipes!) and backpacking/hiking were great! The Cesspool and many other pools live in fond memories...
PPS: I dig the elbows, they provide an awesome "parts around the house" aesthetic that I love.

 

[o8ko8k]

o8ko8k,
Thanks for the thread- I have a long overdue turbo install ahead I am ashamed to say how long the parts have been sitting. I have a couple of questions though- where did you get your flanges- were they off the rack or fabricated. (If I can keep out of my friend's busy water jet machine it would be great) and the silicone hoses, where did they come from? I know that they are available on ebay but I am always skeptical of ebay quality on stuff that isn't oem or known secondary supplier made. Thanks and next after tracking down a battery issue (**** the HJ60's batteries!) this weekend the turbo project starts! Best,
Jeff

PS: Where in AZ are you? I lived in Tempe for a year and a half in the mid-eighties. The pool skating (and pipes!) and backpacking/hiking were great! The Cesspool and many other pools live in fond memories...
PPS: I dig the elbows, they provide an awesome "parts around the house" aesthetic that I love.

This is the place i got the silicon couplers
http://www.siliconeintakes.com/

But this was a rare case where i didnt buy off ebay. I bought the turbo off ebay too (yes it was risky and in hind sight, i dont know that i would do that again). But i have had no problems with the turbo cept that the internal waste gate actuator (not to be mistaken with a boost controller) was faulty. im only at about 2000Km on the turbo and engine since. I set the replacement boost actuator to 10Psi. which i get at 2000rpm and above.

Most of the metal for the intake and exhaust was from local auto parts store (2.5" exhaust pipes).

The flanges were purchased off ebay. I only needed two flanges. The CT26 flange was a bit of a trick to find and the triangle one was pretty standard and only ran me about 13 bucks shipped. (in hind sight i could have used one off the old exhuast system had i thought about it but i didnt.).

The elbow is a cast steel threaded 90 degree pipe from home depot (8.99$). i did mix cast with rolled steel so a good peening was in order and my trusty air hammer did the trick (so far) for the welding workmanship. Peeinng also helped removed the slag off the inside to avoid a mini slag ball bearling breaking loose and flying into the exhuast turbine. NOTE: galvanized plating will melt at normal Exhaust temps so if you go with galvanized pipe, stripp it with muratic acit or vinegar b4 u use it.

I will also comment that MANY MANY retail companies sell product on ebay as a way of getting around their "MAP" or Minimum Advertised Price agareement with their wholesalers. I wont speak of the business ethics pertaining to this matter but it does happen and it isnt uncommon.

im in the phoenix area.

 

[gerg]

That looks like its start to come along for you. Now jsut keep that boost down and dont be tempted to go higher. Did you do some reading on the ring land failures? It is a must for your motor, that and pre combustion cups as well.

Your rerouting of the blow by tube is how manufactures do it, but it will pump alot of nasty crap into your enigne. I routed mine via an oil resistant hose that dumped it where my exhaust outlet is. Keeps the stink away and keeps that crap out of your turbo, intercooler, throttle plate, intake valves etc.... That gas that is vented is not just oil, its combustion blow by that usualy is corrosive, especially in the pressence of mositure, and you wount want that on a nice soft aluminum compressor wheel, or anything else for that matter.

g

 

[o8ko8k]

That looks like its start to come along for you. Now jsut keep that boost down and dont be tempted to go higher. Did you do some reading on the ring land failures? It is a must for your motor, that and pre combustion cups as well.

Your rerouting of the blow by tube is how manufactures do it, but it will pump alot of nasty **** into your enigne. I routed mine via an oil resistant hose that dumped it where my exhaust outlet is. Keeps the stink away and keeps that **** out of your turbo, intercooler, throttle plate, intake valves etc.... That gas that is vented is not just oil, its combustion blow by that usualy is corrosive, especially in the pressence of mositure, and you wount want that on a nice soft aluminum compressor wheel, or anything else for that matter.

g

Ive read about the ring and land issue common in 2h engines. Reinforced pistons and so forth. Maybe i've missed the punchline. what further mitigating actions can i take to avoid this failure short of rebuilding the engine? Im keeping the boost level low and keeping the fueling conservative as well. can i go in through the bottom and change out the pistons with reinforced lands, ceramic coated, etc?

As for the precups, my only defense im aware of there is cooling or get a different engine that doesnt have precups. Ive flushed the cooling system, replaced 1/2 of the hoses, raplaced the fan clutch, and added an alluminum radiator to replace the stock one. Short of ripping the engine down and cleaning out the water jacket with a wire brush and changing out the water pump for a new one, im about played out on this angle too.

I guess im just paranoid at this point. YOu have mentioned twice now about the ring/land/precup stuff so im worried ive missed somthing....

i did not figure the exhuast will create enough (venturi) vacuum needed for the crank case but thats a good idea. I did the slobber tube because i didnt want that crud going into the turbo either, but i felt forced to when engine started bleeding oil under boost. kinda damn'ed if i do and damn'ed if i dont. I thought i had picked the lesser of the two weevils. I appears there is a third weevil...


I would love to have the time and $$ right now to do this kind of rebuild... <DROOL>
https://forum.ih8mud.com/diesel-tech-24-volts-systems/601319-2h-ring-failure-causes-2.html

or

https://forum.ih8mud.com/diesel-tech-24-volts-systems/469846-my-2h-trashed.html

 

[gerg]

The punch line comes when your motor gives up the ghost. I too have a pre cup engine (3b) but mine has reinforced ring land stock. Keeping your egts low will help keep the pistons alloy as strong as possible until you choose to swap them out or do a full rebuild. Running good coolant mix with water wetter or something like that to help avoid vapor locking parts of your head are a very good idea. If I were you I would tune to something like 950F max egt which would be quite conservative and will not maximise your power, but will give you alot less isoltaed hot spots in the head especially the exhaust runners.

Changing the pre cups would be a good idea turbo or not as well as a good mls head gasket.

I didnt put the puke tube in the exhaust, although I want to eventually. I simply ran a hose beside it. You can make a simple venturi out of pipe and weld it into the exhaust pipe and it will indeed suck the blow by out. The venturi is created when the pipe is cut at a 45 degree angle and the open part of the cut is facing away from the flow. It creates a very small low pressure zone.

I just wanted to remind you as its all fun to turbo an old motor, but its not too far from feeding grampa crack and watching him run around the block all day. Instead, keep the egts low and feed him tons of nice cold red bull and you might get a few more miles out of him.

 

[o8ko8k]

I just wanted to remind you as its all fun to turbo an old motor, but its not too far from feeding grampa crack and watching him run around the block all day. Instead, keep the egts low and feed him tons of nice cold red bull and you might get a few more miles out of him.

OMG ROFL. too funny! ya and then wondering why he crokes from a heartattack.

I hear ya. ya i guess my worry is this will happen sooner than later. if i get another 100,000km out of this thing b4 a rebuild, im happy. if not, i will miss grampa dearly. .

the way im tuned now, i have to hold 10psi (max boost for me) for a long while to get above 1000F.

 

[Wheelingnoob]

I have seen a few 2H's recently and local have the crazy ring issue pop up. One was at 360k kms with not turbo and one was at 600k kms with a turbo for the last 100k kms. Its a total crap shoot, one one can say for sure when it will happen just that it will.

We have an extra short block waiting to be build for my brothers 2H whit Alfin pistons and 12HT piston squirter's. His auto engine ran fine for 20k kms with turbo at 340kms and the 5spd motor it has not with 380kms is running strong with turbo on for 5k kms. Like has been said before its not a if its a when.

 

[Tapage]

You guys are showing no faith in 2H .. and you should !

 

[No. 3]

Thanks for the silicon fitting lead. Precups, fear them. One of mine ****ped out in the Sierras after a week in Saline Valley on the way home to SF. And by ****ped out I mean broke up and fell into the cylinder. Not much you can do but replace them preventatively. Be sure that you have a GOOD diesel machine shop do this- the head i got from $OR under duress was turds and I had the whole thing torn apart and redone. It was not cheap and far from where I live.... Precups!