All terrain tire comparison

[Willy beamin]

Lookin' for some @gaijin love here. The Nitto Ridge Grappler in 285/75r17 comes in both C and E load ratings.

E's are rated for 3195@ 80 psi
C's are rated for 2835@ 50 psi

These will be mounted on rock warrior wheels. My truck is heavy, I've done an Australian GVM upgrade so my heaviest legal GVWR is 8,375 lbs. I'll be pushing that weight regularly. Could I get away with C load tires?

Australian GVM upgrade - pardon my ignorance and please enlighten me - this means upgraded suspension to handle the new desired weight limits the vehicle will be used for correct? springs / shocks / bump stops / brakes anything else? I've not heard this phrase used on here as an item checked off on someones build list
thankyou

 

[mcgaskins]

Lookin' for some @gaijin love here. The Nitto Ridge Grappler in 285/75r17 comes in both C and E load ratings.

E's are rated for 3195@ 80 psi
C's are rated for 2835@ 50 psi

These will be mounted on rock warrior wheels. My truck is heavy, I've done an Australian GVM upgrade so my heaviest legal GVWR is 8,375 lbs. I'll be pushing that weight regularly. Could I get away with C load tires?

I would definitely go with the E rated tire. I'm not 100% sure, but from what I could dig up it appears the C rated tire only has a 2 ply sidewalk and the E has a 3 ply. If you're worried about the tire being stiff or riding rough, you will be shocked with nice these ride in E. I actually twice got out of the truck to look at the sidewalls to ensure they really weren't C because they're so compliant and so much better than the (several year old) Toyos they replaced.

 

[gaijin]

Lookin' for some @gaijin love here. The Nitto Ridge Grappler in 285/75r17 comes in both C and E load ratings.

E's are rated for 3195@ 80 psi
C's are rated for 2835@ 50 psi

These will be mounted on rock warrior wheels. My truck is heavy, I've done an Australian GVM upgrade so my heaviest legal GVWR is 8,375 lbs. I'll be pushing that weight regularly. Could I get away with C load tires?

What you can "get away with" is a judgement call you will have to make, but let me share some observations:

- Recommended Cold Tire Inflation Pressure for ANY LT285/75R17 tire on a stock rig is 37psi F/R which results in a Load Limit of 2301LB/tire.

- Standard GVWR is 7385LB, so total tire Load Limit (2301 x 4 = 9204LB) is roughly 125% of GVWR - call this a safety margin of 25%

- With a GVWR of 8375LB (I have to take your word this is a legitimate GVWR), in order to maintain the same 25% safety margin, total tire Load Limt would have to be >2617 x 4 = >10468LB

- To realize a Load Limit of >2617LB/tire, Recommended Cold Tire Inflation Pressure would be 45psi F/R (rounding up to nearest full psi) which results in a Load Limit of 2640LB/tire and a safety margin of 26% - all good.

- This 45psi yields exactly the same Load Limits (2640LB) and safety factors (26%) regardless whether the tire is a C-Rated LT285/75R17 or an E-Rated LT285/75R17 tire. Exactly the same.

So, what are the differences between a C-Rated and E-Rated tire in this size?

The Load Limit for the C-Rated tire maxes out at 2835LB @ 50psi (E-Rated Load Limit is also 2835LB @ 50psi).

The Load Limit for the E-Rated tire maxes out at 3195LB @ 65psi and stays the same 3195LB up to 80psi. Yes, that's correct, even if you increase the pressure above 65psi, the Load Limit of the tire does not increase.

The biggest difference, in my opinion, is the Ply Rating of the two:

The actual number of tread and sidewall plies may vary from one manufacturer to another, but based on industry standard testing, a tire "Rated" at 10 ply is going to be stronger (i.e. durable, puncture resistant, etc.) than a tire "Rated" at 6 ply.

In light of all the above, it makes a lot more sense to me to run the E-Rated tire.

HTH

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

^^^ you sir, are a gentleman and a scholar.

I'll take your recommendation and run a E rated. Why I was a asking was because of previous E rated tires being very stiff and transmitting that through the truck when in gravel. Thanks @mcgaskins for the observation on how smooth the E rated tire feels. Where you able to take a picture of the tire turned at full lock toward the sway bar? If not I'm going to have to buy and test one.

 

[gaijin]

Glad I could help!

I'll add my voice to @mcgaskins and confirm that my E-Rated LT285/70R17 tires are not stiff or rough at all (when properly inflated, of course).

 

[RS6tofj80]

agree - I hated my E-rated at first but playing with the pressure in 3-5 lb increments I'm now loving them....

E

 

[steenh]

Hey Gaijin, I don't think I've seen your magic done for the KO2 34-10.5-17 tires (D Rated). Estimated weight including passengers is 6,800.

No rush at all and thanks for being the guru on this...

 

[gaijin]

Hey Gaijin, I don't think I've seen your magic done for the KO2 34-10.5-17 tires (D Rated). Estimated weight including passengers is 6,800.

No rush at all and thanks for being the guru on this...

No problem.

The recommended Cold Tire Inflation Pressure for your 34x10.50R17LT tires is 41psi F/R.

HTH

 

[Markuson]

Australian GVM upgrade - pardon my ignorance and please enlighten me - this means upgraded suspension to handle the new desired weight limits the vehicle will be used for correct? springs / shocks / bump stops / brakes anything else? I've not heard this phrase used on here as an item checked off on someones build list
thankyou

@Willy beamin The AustralianGVM upgrade reference is something I stumbled on in a discussion about the safety issues of running over GVM. After some hunting it popped up that Australia will issue a new GVM sticker with certain upgrades, and those upgrades literally came down to suspension changes you, I and others make with heavier lifts. This was helpful because it helped answer whether the GVM safety factor was mostly just a suspension thing, rather than some other underlying weakness in the LC. According to the Australian regulators...that's exactly it--a suspension thing. There was an Australian company that packaged a GVM upgrade kit.

I'll try to find the link again...but it's in a thread somewhere.

Edit:
Here's one example, but these "GVM Upgrades" are offered by many companies in Australia:
Toyota 200 Series 3800kg GVM Upgrade | West Coast Suspensions

Google "Australia GVM upgrade 200 series" and you'll see a bunch...which all are basically the same. Heavier shocks and coils...and come with a new GVM rating sticker.

 

[mcgaskins]

^^^ you sir, are a gentleman and a scholar.

I'll take your recommendation and run a E rated. Why I was a asking was because of previous E rated tires being very stiff and transmitting that through the truck when in gravel. Thanks @mcgaskins for the observation on how smooth the E rated tire feels. Where you able to take a picture of the tire turned at full lock toward the sway bar? If not I'm going to have to buy and test one.

I've actually been working from home this week and haven't driven the truck, but I have to run some errands in it today so I'll snap pics. I did want to post up that since the tire change my gas mileage has gone up noticeably. Lower rolling resistance, fresh rubber, lighter weight, slightly smaller tire has added up to getting a solid 14.5mpg in mixed driving (60/40 highway/city) which, although I won't brag to my friends about, I feel is pretty fantastic considering my build and how un-aerodynamic it is.

 

[mcgaskins]

^^^ you sir, are a gentleman and a scholar.

I'll take your recommendation and run a E rated. Why I was a asking was because of previous E rated tires being very stiff and transmitting that through the truck when in gravel. Thanks @mcgaskins for the observation on how smooth the E rated tire feels. Where you able to take a picture of the tire turned at full lock toward the sway bar? If not I'm going to have to buy and test one.

As promised. There is plenty of clearance everywhere the last 2 sets rubbed. I'm very happy with this size and the Ridge Grapplers.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

^^^ thanks so much, really thanks.

I currently have a tire that is .5" wider but a .5" inch shorter than yours. I currently clear everywhere except on the right side, from the sidewall lugs (not the tread) rub the sway bar. But it is close to rubbing tread. If that makes sense.

So I'm trying to figure out if being slightly narrower will compensate just enough to not rub tread with the tire going taller, as that 285/75r17 needs only .25" more height clearance. And I'm not going to have the sway bar relocation kit so that my problem.

1st world problems right.

 

[mcgaskins]

No problem. I obviously don't know first hand because I had the KDSS relocation done with larger tires, but with how much clearance I have everywhere I imagine these would clear without it. I honestly wish I went straight to these, but I am glad I scratched the itch of testing 35s. If they weren't so wide and heavy (the Toyos at least), they'd be great, but these are great-er lol.

 

[Brett19648]

Anyone have feedback regarding the Nitto exo grapplers? They're available in 285/70r18. The only AT I've come across offered in that size... in general they seem to have positive reviews, just not much to go on though.

 

[Markuson]

Anyone have feedback regarding the Nitto exo grapplers? They're available in 285/70r18. The only AT I've come across offered in that size... in general they seem to have positive reviews, just not much to go on though.

My impression is the eco grapplers are marketed more for heavy work trucks using rough roads/dirt/gravel. Doesn't mean they won't work for the LC, but it makes me think their rubber is more for durability than performance.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

Here's some Nitto EXO propaganda, mounted on a FJ and JKU.



Regardless, it's still just a cool video.

While I'm at it, here's some Nitto Ridge (and trail/mud) Grappler propaganda.



Again, just plain awesome though.

 

[Markuson]

Good find. When my wife and I drove the Dalton Highway all the way to the Arctic Ocean in Alaska, the road was really bad, and was notorious for taking out tires. I watched a guy pop both his left tires at once from a hunk of metal, and he only had one spare. Maybe these EXOs would be a good choice for that road...

I highly recommend driving the route to Prudho Bay (*not the mud they found!). You can basically follow the entire line of the pipeline on the service road they call the "Haul Road."

If I show this video to my wife...she'll be ready to go back. We actually went three summers in a row some years back. Seriously considering driving there next summer all the way from San Diego. Wanna go??

PS. I've pretty well decided Ridge Grapplers are next for me.

 

[FatHero]

I have a set of 35x12.5 Toyo Open Country II's mounted on Rock Warrior wheels. They've been sitting in my garage for a almost a year now. They rub on both the stock UCAs and the KDSS arms.
There're still sitting in the garage because I haven't fully committed to jumping thru all the necessary hoops to run them.
Probably, the easiest thing to do to eliminate both rubbing points would be to install a set of wheel spacers, but I'm sure that'll just move the rubbing to somewhere else.
I need get off the fence and either install them or pass them on to the next guy.

So height wise they fit perfect. The problem is the width - at full lock doing u turns in the lot it runs pretty good on the KDSS I was pretty bummed because I think it's about the perfect tire otherwise, but I don't want rubbing. In CO and UT where I wheel there are a lot of tight turns, so I don't want to increase my turning radius by not being able to crank it fully. Looks like I need to decide among the 285/75/17 options.

View attachment 1417149

I have the OME medium duty lift and TRD 17" wheels - no kdss relo and stock UCA. I have the KO2 in 35x12.50x17 on the way. Is the rubbing too bad to use in daily driving? I'm hoping to get the mods within a couple of months, but have the tires on the way now. So is the rubbing on the sway bars only at full-lock? The shop will do any trimming needed (and I have ARB bumpers so most of the front fender shouldn't be to much of a problem) but the other mods will need to wait. Opinions please.

 

[TonyP]

I have the OME medium duty lift and TRD 17" wheels - no kdss relo and stock UCA. I have the KO2 in 35x12.50x17 on the way. Is the rubbing too bad to use in daily driving? I'm hoping to get the mods within a couple of months, but have the tires on the way now. So is the rubbing on the sway bars only at full-lock? The shop will do any trimming needed (and I have ARB bumpers so most of the front fender shouldn't be to much of a problem) but the other mods will need to wait. Opinions please.

You basically won't be able to turn more than few degrees until it'll start digging in into the swaybar. Save yourself some time and order the relocation kit and UCAs now.

That's in addition to the semi-large amount of plastic trimming.

 

[mcgaskins]

I have the OME medium duty lift and TRD 17" wheels - no kdss relo and stock UCA. I have the KO2 in 35x12.50x17 on the way. Is the rubbing too bad to use in daily driving? I'm hoping to get the mods within a couple of months, but have the tires on the way now. So is the rubbing on the sway bars only at full-lock? The shop will do any trimming needed (and I have ARB bumpers so most of the front fender shouldn't be to much of a problem) but the other mods will need to wait. Opinions please.

Your biggest issue will be rubbing on the KDSS bar and frame under close to full lock and full lock. If you're going to be parallel parking a lot or turning tight on a regular basis, you will definitely rub quite a bit, but for most daily uses it shouldn't be an issue. I test fitted the 35x12.50x17 KO2 and it rubbed bad enough on full lock I switched to 285/75/17 Ridge Grapplers and haven't looked back. Extremely happy with the tire and the specific size, though it would be great if the tire were even taller with the same width.