Alignment/caster issues on the 80 series (1 Viewer)

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digitalmarker

digitalmarker

Joined
Jan 5, 2016
Threads
55
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482
Location
Bay Area, CA
Hey everyone,

I have a 1996 land cruiser with a 4" lift kit from Slee, including the front control arm upgrade for caster correction. I got 35" Toyo MTs installed at the same time as the kit.

Since the lift and tires were installed, followed by an alignment, the truck developed a consistent pull to the right side. When driving on a straight road with minimal crown, or flat parking lots, letting go of the steering wheel causes the truck to consistently pull to the right side. When driving on the road or highway, I have to keep the steering wheel 10-15 degrees to the left to offset the pull.

The truck was recently re-aligned by a reputable local shop that specializes in custom alignments for all types of vehicles, including 4x4s. The spec sheet is attached, and according to the Slee guys, the specs are as good as can be and are all within range. However, the pull is still there.

The guys at the custom alignments shop said that they see this issue with lifted 4x4s, and recommended installing a caster offset bearing in the front passenger side knuckle that will add additional caster to that wheel, and will result in the truck driving straight and the steering wheel being centered while driving.

The Slee guys believe this is going to just "mask" the real issue that's causing the pull, which they believe could be a radial pull of the tires (among many other things). To test this, I have moved the wheels/tires around every which way to eliminate the possibility of a radial pull, with no luck. A friend of mine has the exact same setup on the exact same truck, with the exact same tires, and his drives perfectly straight.

As tempted as I am to get the offset wheel bearing installed, knowing that all of my settings are dialed in correctly makes me think that I could simply be applying a bandaid fix to an underlying issue that's causing the truck to pull in the first place.

Any other ideas/opinions out there on this? What else can I check to see if something else is bent (axle, rods, etc?) Or would this become apparent/visible during an alignment?

Any other thoughts/ideas/suggestions are much appreciated - this is bugging the crap out of me and would love to find the right fix.

Thanks in advance!!!

IMG_7270.jpg
 
My opinion would be to go with caster plates from Wits'End (Landtank / @NLXTACY )

That will correct the caster and improve the driveability.
 
I had the OME caster bushings on a 2.5" OME lift. Worthless. My caster was still negative.

Got the caster plates installed. now at -3.75/4 within factory spec. Drives much better. All new OEM bushings everywhere. Awesome, but I'm already used to it. :D
 
So I will be 100% honest, caster is the setting I understand the absolute least out of all alignment settings.

However, I was under the impression that:

1) the front control arms from Slee are what you use instead of the caster plates to address caster issues
2) the caster specs on my readout are within recommended spec according to Slee (they said between 4 and 5 is the ideal range for a 4" lift)

The way the alignment shop described the offset bearing solution to me is that it would disproportionately increase the caster value on the front passenger side wheel while keeping the front driver side wheel at the setting it's at now.

@BILT4ME @CYKBC - are your front driver/passenger caster settings similar/same on both sides?

Also what do you mean by "negative" caster? Mine are not even close to being negative - both are above +4?
 
They say the control arms are recommended for a 4" lift, and required for the 6" lift.

According to them my caster settings are spot on and they think something else is causing my pull.
 
digitalmarker said:
So I will be 100% honest, caster is the setting I understand the absolute least out of all alignment settings.

However, I was under the impression that:

1) the front control arms from Slee are what you use instead of the caster plates to address caster issues
2) the caster specs on my readout are within recommended spec according to Slee (they said between 4 and 5 is the ideal range for a 4" lift)

The way the alignment shop described the offset bearing solution to me is that it would disproportionately increase the caster value on the front passenger side wheel while keeping the front driver side wheel at the setting it's at now.

@BILT4ME @CYKBC - are your front driver/passenger caster settings similar/same on both sides?

Also what do you mean by "negative" caster? Mine are not even close to being negative - both are above +4?
Click to expand...

Iirc factory spec range is +2 to +4. Pls correct me if wrong. I read this when I was searching for a solution when i found out I was neg caster with caster correction bushings.

Mine is now at 3.75 to 4. The variance is within factory spec.

I had some pull to the right but swapping front tires helped. Caster plates helped. There is so much crowning on roads here that I’ve come to accept any slight pulls. I also modified the thing with bigger wheels and tires so I’m ok with not being dead straight on all the time.

I feel your pain though. You’ve done a lot of work so far. I’d find someone you trust to check out the axles.
 
Last edited:
From memory the caster specification is 2 to 4 degrees positive. Yours is 4 and 4.3. That’s plenty close enough that it wouldn’t create significant problems. For reference, mine is 2.2 each side and tracks/drives wonderfully.

There’s something else astray. I agree with Slee - any additional caster correction is only masking the root cause.
 
I have swapped all tires across all wheels.

The TREs are brand new, and so are the calipers.

Recently fully rebuilt the front axle, birfs, etc with all new parts and bearings.

Slee guys said being between 4 and 5 deg caster is perfectly normal for a 4” lift.

How can you check the axles, and what specifically do you check? If an axle is bent, wouldn’t that show up during the alignment in camber or toe numbers, since the whole thing would be twisted?
 
Last edited:
What about track bar? Adjustable or not? Will pull front axle one way, rear opposite.
 
Yes both panhard rods (I guess also called tracking bars?) are adjustable and came with the slee kit.

My understanding is that their purpose is to locate the position of axles under the vehicle side ways (left to right). Based on what the shop told me the axles are properly positioned and are on the same plane.

How could I test/measure if these are an issue?
 
digitalmarker said:
Hey everyone,

I have a 1996 land cruiser with a 4" lift kit from Slee, including the front control arm upgrade for caster correction. I got 35" Toyo MTs installed at the same time as the kit.

Since the lift and tires were installed, followed by an alignment, the truck developed a consistent pull to the right side. When driving on a straight road with minimal crown, or flat parking lots, letting go of the steering wheel causes the truck to consistently pull to the right side. When driving on the road or highway, I have to keep the steering wheel 10-15 degrees to the left to offset the pull.

The truck was recently re-aligned by a reputable local shop that specializes in custom alignments for all types of vehicles, including 4x4s. The spec sheet is attached, and according to the Slee guys, the specs are as good as can be and are all within range. However, the pull is still there.

The guys at the custom alignments shop said that they see this issue with lifted 4x4s, and recommended installing a caster offset bearing in the front passenger side knuckle that will add additional caster to that wheel, and will result in the truck driving straight and the steering wheel being centered while driving.

The Slee guys believe this is going to just "mask" the real issue that's causing the pull, which they believe could be a radial pull of the tires (among many other things). To test this, I have moved the wheels/tires around every which way to eliminate the possibility of a radial pull, with no luck. A friend of mine has the exact same setup on the exact same truck, with the exact same tires, and his drives perfectly straight.

As tempted as I am to get the offset wheel bearing installed, knowing that all of my settings are dialed in correctly makes me think that I could simply be applying a bandaid fix to an underlying issue that's causing the truck to pull in the first place.

Any other ideas/opinions out there on this? What else can I check to see if something else is bent (axle, rods, etc?) Or would this become apparent/visible during an alignment?

Any other thoughts/ideas/suggestions are much appreciated - this is bugging the crap out of me and would love to find the right fix.

Thanks in advance!!!

View attachment 1842717
Click to expand...
Mine is similar to yours readout, except all stock height
Whats your thrust angle read out

20181127_202840.jpg
 
Alignment looks good, I would suspect a dragging brake.

I imagine the slee arms came with new bushings, but are your rear bushings in good shape? If overly worn, that could be causing some slop too. I'm still thinking it's a brake issue though.
 
Last edited:
A friend had this same issue once, turned out to be his steering damper.
I suppose you could try removing it to rule it out.
 
I would expect the alignment shop to catch this, but... I have seen the frame mounting holes for the front control arms elongated from a hard hit, or multiple hard hits. This results in the control arm shifting backwards some (I have seen 1/8-1/4 inch). This gives you an axle that is not straight under the truck.

Worth a quick check.

Mark...
 
Maybe you have a slightly bent axle housing on the passenger side like me and its causing excess camber and slightly more bearing load leading to a less responsive and poorly tracking tire. The axles being out a fraction of a degree of caster on each side is normal to compensate for road crown and the overall angles look good. A caster bearing set isn't exactly optimal or good if you use it off-road much, the bearing race gets pretty thin. You may also have a out of round spindle on the right side also, that tiny bit of spindle slop could be causing a slight undulation in the tire causing it fo walk to the right.
 
LandCruisinMy93 said:
Maybe you have a slightly bent axle housing on the passenger side like me and its causing excess camber and slightly more bearing load leading to a less responsive and poorly tracking tire. The axles being out a fraction of a degree of caster on each side is normal to compensate for road crown and the overall angles look good. A caster bearing set isn't exactly optimal or good if you use it off-road much, the bearing race gets pretty thin. You may also have a out of round spindle on the right side also, that tiny bit of spindle slop could be causing a slight undulation in the tire causing it fo walk to the right.
Click to expand...


I, too, have a slightly different caster on my RF, as the PO hit a guardrail in the past life and it sheared off at least one of the knuckle studs. I later had two more fall out, and the last one only holding by three threads!:eek:

SO, I know on mine the RF is different. That being said, my truck has driven straight and beautiful up until I installed my 2.5" lift. Now mine pulls to the right. However, I also know that ALL of my suspension bushings are shot and I did NOT loosen any of my control arm bolts or any of that when I did my lift because I knew I was going to be changing my bushings.

So, I am dealing with mine.

That again being said, I have a brake pulling on one corner or another and it was affected by the adjustment of my LSPV arm in the rear, so I think it is a rear caliper dragging.

So, take a look at your LSPV adjustment and maybe see if any of your caliper (or rotor) temps are way high.
 
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