adjusting the valves
- Thread starter swank60
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Swank,
MAF is "theoretically" correct because when a piston is at TDC then both valves are closed, i.e. on their seats and that's where you measure the clearance. However, the trick is making sure both valves are really closed and I always checked this by eye by rotating the engine until both valves on a cylinder quit moving. The problem with this - as pointed out to me by Steve of Steve's Off-Road (Soddy Daisy, Tenn) - is to make sure both vlavles are closed you should use the TDC mark on the crank, adjust the ones that are closed (I'm like PinHead, I have to look it up), rotate 360 deg, and adjust the others. Just going by eye can leave a valve very slightly open.
Steve also suggested setting them 0.001 or 0.002 or so loose as I have heard others suggest. Loose is better than tight to avoid burned valves.
Curious what Mark W or Jim C have to say about this.
Pete
MAF is "theoretically" correct because when a piston is at TDC then both valves are closed, i.e. on their seats and that's where you measure the clearance. However, the trick is making sure both valves are really closed and I always checked this by eye by rotating the engine until both valves on a cylinder quit moving. The problem with this - as pointed out to me by Steve of Steve's Off-Road (Soddy Daisy, Tenn) - is to make sure both vlavles are closed you should use the TDC mark on the crank, adjust the ones that are closed (I'm like PinHead, I have to look it up), rotate 360 deg, and adjust the others. Just going by eye can leave a valve very slightly open.
Steve also suggested setting them 0.001 or 0.002 or so loose as I have heard others suggest. Loose is better than tight to avoid burned valves.
Curious what Mark W or Jim C have to say about this.
Pete
ranger said:
I've adjusted my valves on my 72 both ways... running and not running and they both work about the same. It's kinda cool having your hands in engine while it's running and yes my feeler gauges are all bent at the ends.
Kevin
Not so for an F engine. It's the ONLY way to fly!
I did find out you don't do that with a 22R, however.....
I doubt you would have a problem, none of my F or 2f's sling much oil with the valve cover off/motor running at low RPM's
Yeah. My '65 doesn't bring much oil up either, but I'm afraid to try the 2F in my white truck. It's got a new pump that I honed and tightened up. It makes 60 psi when I turn the engine with a wrench!
...but I'm afraid to try the 2F in my white truck. It's got a new pump that I honed and tightened up. It makes 60 psi when I turn the engine with a wrench!
I would not be concerned about it, even up to 1500+RPM's. The 2F camshaft has two holes drilled in the number three bearing journal that control the oil flow to the rocker shaft mechanism. The only thing that would get you more volume to the rocker shaft would be to increase the size of the oil holes in the camshaft, or cut a radial groove in the camshaft bearing journal. Some light reading on the topic.
I adjust the vavles with the engine hot, not running, and then after the adjustment is completed, run the engine with the cover off to watch/listen to them. Have done it this way since '88. Works great every time.
I would not be concerned about it, even up to 1500+RPM's. The 2F camshaft has two holes drilled in the number three bearing journal that control the oil flow to the rocker shaft mechanism. The only thing that would get you more volume to the rocker shaft would be to increase the size of the oil holes in the camshaft, or cut a radial groove in the camshaft bearing journal. Some light reading on the topic.
I adjust the vavles with the engine hot, not running, and then after the adjustment is completed, run the engine with the cover off to watch/listen to them. Have done it this way since '88. Works great every time.
I was kidding about my pump a little, and know that the flow up is restricted by design. When I went through the F in my older truck I did think about the low pressure oiling to the valve gear and with seeing various oil related problems posted here considered opening up the cam for a boost. I didn't though, mostly because the F engine doesn't seem to have much to spare due to it's pump and the other limitations to the low end bearings. Thought it would be better to leave it as Toyota found adequate and keep my experiments to the old days and smallblocks.
I do them static hot also, and listen with old ears that have listened to engines for too many years now.
John, I was once ISSUED the tool you like though mine said 'Bluepoint' on it. Thought it was useless then, and still do
I've used the method by dividing the valves in half which means if you're adjusting the first valve, then you can adjust the 12th valve, the second, the 11th valve. The valves are numbered 1-12 beginning at the front of the engine.
I even saw a diagram indicating the proper way to divide up the valves though I can't put my finger on the diagram right now.
Good luck!
I even saw a diagram indicating the proper way to divide up the valves though I can't put my finger on the diagram right now.
Good luck!
Top dead center of the compression stroke you can adjust valves 1,2,3,5,7,9
Top dead center of the exhaust stroke you can adjust valves 4,6,8,10,11,12
Or, you can rotate the engine and adjust any that are free and not under tension. However with this method, if someone in the past has set things really tight, you may not be able to find the tight valve since you do not really have a reference point for the ones that should be loose, like when using the method described in the Factory Service Manual, and the other diapers out there.
Valve clearances hot:
Intake .008”
Exhaust .014”
Good luck!
-Steve
Top dead center of the exhaust stroke you can adjust valves 4,6,8,10,11,12
Or, you can rotate the engine and adjust any that are free and not under tension. However with this method, if someone in the past has set things really tight, you may not be able to find the tight valve since you do not really have a reference point for the ones that should be loose, like when using the method described in the Factory Service Manual, and the other diapers out there.
Valve clearances hot:
Intake .008”
Exhaust .014”
Good luck!
-Steve
so what are the clearences?
For a cold engine?
For a cold engine?
Dave I can't quite make out the text - could you repost a larger pic?
Hey, I give to the Helen Keller society...
I did my first valve adjustment today. Read up on it here, read the FSM, and the Landcruiser Bible has a good description of what to feel for when measuring with the engine running at slow idle. I did the FSM 2F Engine Manual hot engine running to measure, stopped engine to adjust technique. At first, I went one valve at a time. As I began to get the "feel" of it, I would check 2 or 3 with it running, then adjust them slightly with it stopped.
The valves were pounding the feeler gauge at first, but when I held it lightly in my hand, it allowed the gauge to vibrate and absorb the shock while I gently slid the gauge to test the fit.
There was some oil splatter, but nothing major.
And after putting it all back together, it still runs!
The last valve adjustment was a few years and about 50K miles ago. Most of my exhaust valves were a litlle tight. The intakes were close to spec.
The valves were pounding the feeler gauge at first, but when I held it lightly in my hand, it allowed the gauge to vibrate and absorb the shock while I gently slid the gauge to test the fit.
There was some oil splatter, but nothing major.
And after putting it all back together, it still runs!
The last valve adjustment was a few years and about 50K miles ago. Most of my exhaust valves were a litlle tight. The intakes were close to spec.
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
Holy thread, back from the dead. Congrats Hank.
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Quick question, im going to be doing the valvues on my 90 3fe in a few days and cant find the book. As far as i remember the exaust clearance is a 14 feeler gauge and the intake is an 8 feeler gauge. Or do i have that backwards? Ive always done it the TDC way in the past thats how i was tought to atleast, never had any issues doing it that way just had to go through the valvues twice after a reheat.
Here's the bit from http://www.birfield.com/~morgan/tech/valves.html, which no longer is active.
Jim Chenoweth on Valve Adjustment:
No, you do not adjust valves with the engine running. Sounds like a good way to break tools, fingers, rocker arms... Adjusting valves w/ engine running applies to some silly hydraulic cammed American engines. Run the engine to operating temperature. Remove air cleaner & valve cover. Use a long 3/8 ratchet with a 14MM socket and crack all the adjuster lock nuts loose. With the key off, put vehicle in 4th gear, 2-hi. Now rock vehicle while watching the timing window on bellhousing. You can easily move the engine in small increments by bumping the weight of the vehicle against it in fourth gear. When the engine gets to the TDC mark (the line, not the ball) you can adjust half of the valves. Then bump vehicle (forward or backward, doesn't matter) to rotate the crank 360, back to the TDC mark. Adjust the other valves. The two groups of valves are 1,2,3,5,7,9 and 4,6,8,10,11,12. Check the Haynes manual to verify these numbers. When you think you're all done, double check all lock nuts for tightness, this will tell you if you forgot to adjust any (Now you know why the FIRST thing you did was break them all loose.) Now you can start the engine (If you can plug all the disconnected vacuum fittings) and listen to how quiet things are, even w/ the valve cover removed.
The intake valves are set at .008", and the exhaust valves at .014". You use a feeler gauge for this work. The tools you'll need to set the valves are a 14mm wrench, a big flat-head screwdriver and the aforementioned feeler gauge. I've been told that the gauge should feel "snug" - some friction on the metal as you slide it in and out. There's a neato tool from snap-on just for this task that combines the wrench & screwdriver, so you only need two hands (instead of two-and-a-half) to set the timing.
Sometimes the act of tightening the locking nut on the valve adjuster (wc?) will cause it to move along the rocker shaft laterally, creating a false tightness. Make sure that the rocker is centered on the rocker shaft after you tighten it.
Also, the valve cover gasket occasionally comes loose, and reinstalling with this thing loose and not properly seated will cause some nasty oil leaks, blue smoke from under the hood, nervous looks from your wife and green faces on your kids. Not that I'd know. In my experience the valve cover gasket for a 2F from Toyota is rubber or nylon rubber. When mine came loose, I gave it a visual inspection, then cleaned it and the rim of the valve cover gently with a rag and some brake cleaner. I reassembled it with black RTV (between gasket and cover), put it on the tailgate and let a spare tire sit on it overnight.
While you're doing the valves you might as well check idle and fuel mixture settings on the carb and the distributor timing.
[ Back to Tech ]
Morgan Fletcher <morgan@hahaha.org>
Last modified: Thu Apr 20 15:56:02 PDT 2000
Jim Chenoweth on Valve Adjustment:
No, you do not adjust valves with the engine running. Sounds like a good way to break tools, fingers, rocker arms... Adjusting valves w/ engine running applies to some silly hydraulic cammed American engines. Run the engine to operating temperature. Remove air cleaner & valve cover. Use a long 3/8 ratchet with a 14MM socket and crack all the adjuster lock nuts loose. With the key off, put vehicle in 4th gear, 2-hi. Now rock vehicle while watching the timing window on bellhousing. You can easily move the engine in small increments by bumping the weight of the vehicle against it in fourth gear. When the engine gets to the TDC mark (the line, not the ball) you can adjust half of the valves. Then bump vehicle (forward or backward, doesn't matter) to rotate the crank 360, back to the TDC mark. Adjust the other valves. The two groups of valves are 1,2,3,5,7,9 and 4,6,8,10,11,12. Check the Haynes manual to verify these numbers. When you think you're all done, double check all lock nuts for tightness, this will tell you if you forgot to adjust any (Now you know why the FIRST thing you did was break them all loose.) Now you can start the engine (If you can plug all the disconnected vacuum fittings) and listen to how quiet things are, even w/ the valve cover removed.
The intake valves are set at .008", and the exhaust valves at .014". You use a feeler gauge for this work. The tools you'll need to set the valves are a 14mm wrench, a big flat-head screwdriver and the aforementioned feeler gauge. I've been told that the gauge should feel "snug" - some friction on the metal as you slide it in and out. There's a neato tool from snap-on just for this task that combines the wrench & screwdriver, so you only need two hands (instead of two-and-a-half) to set the timing.
Sometimes the act of tightening the locking nut on the valve adjuster (wc?) will cause it to move along the rocker shaft laterally, creating a false tightness. Make sure that the rocker is centered on the rocker shaft after you tighten it.
Also, the valve cover gasket occasionally comes loose, and reinstalling with this thing loose and not properly seated will cause some nasty oil leaks, blue smoke from under the hood, nervous looks from your wife and green faces on your kids. Not that I'd know. In my experience the valve cover gasket for a 2F from Toyota is rubber or nylon rubber. When mine came loose, I gave it a visual inspection, then cleaned it and the rim of the valve cover gently with a rag and some brake cleaner. I reassembled it with black RTV (between gasket and cover), put it on the tailgate and let a spare tire sit on it overnight.
While you're doing the valves you might as well check idle and fuel mixture settings on the carb and the distributor timing.
[ Back to Tech ]
Morgan Fletcher <morgan@hahaha.org>
Last modified: Thu Apr 20 15:56:02 PDT 2000