It does sound like valves, also like a tight belt or bad bearing in second video, and misfiring in the third. I dont really like to say to much after only hearing it from a recording but it doesnt sound good, check valve timing and compression or get a professional opinion. My first thought was the top end of engine, as in no oil getting there or valves out of sync. Hopefully it isnt any of these but I thought I would give you my opinion before you caused more damage by driving it. Diagnosing faults on cars was my job for years so I wouldnt just say it without cause for concern. I would expect the exhaust to make a sharper ticking noise, hopefully im wrong.
'98 Engine Noise Diagnosis
- Thread starter camino70
- Start date
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- Thread starter
- #22
Thanks for the responses guys, I appreciate it. I liked our '04 kid hauler so much I picked up this budget '98. It doesn't get much attention and I am slow, but I will get there. Hopefully this weekend I can try a few suggestions here and I'll let you know.
I thought if it was as bad as oil starvation, it would have given up the ghost by now.
I thought if it was as bad as oil starvation, it would have given up the ghost by now.
- Thread starter
- #23
To answer some of the above questions/comments:
Regarding the videos, the first video I took several and the posted one I thought captured the sounds the best. The second and third are single videos that I didn't make the appropriate effort to ensure they captured everything well, my apologies for that.
I have:
Recent oil/filter change
Cleaned Throttle Body
Replaced all coil packs and plugs this week
Run SeaFoam this morning = Lotso' Smoke.... but no noticeable difference. I had SeaFoam and old school GM Top End Cleaner in the garage(maybe I'll try GM TEC next?)
Pulled the Oil Filler tube to confirm fresh oil on the top end (Someone PLEASE remind me to use my magnetic tray, I lost one of the nuts somewhere in the engine compartment...it's M6 1.0, PN - 94150-80641)
Replaced S belt, checked each pulley
Searched for exhaust leak to no avail
I have NOT:
Run any fuel injector cleaner, never thought much of it, previous cars I thought had injector issues, I removed and took them to a somewhat local injector guy for flow testing, etc....
Been cognizant of using Top Tier fuel, mostly Kroger fuel near me, I'll start making it a point to use Costco or other top tier fuel
My goal for this weekend:
Compression test
Listen to injectors/disconnect?
The truck wasn't driven much by the previous owner, about 15K miles the past 3 years, not sure if this triggers any thoughts for someone?
Regarding the videos, the first video I took several and the posted one I thought captured the sounds the best. The second and third are single videos that I didn't make the appropriate effort to ensure they captured everything well, my apologies for that.
I have:
Recent oil/filter change
Cleaned Throttle Body
Replaced all coil packs and plugs this week
Run SeaFoam this morning = Lotso' Smoke.... but no noticeable difference. I had SeaFoam and old school GM Top End Cleaner in the garage(maybe I'll try GM TEC next?)
Pulled the Oil Filler tube to confirm fresh oil on the top end (Someone PLEASE remind me to use my magnetic tray, I lost one of the nuts somewhere in the engine compartment...it's M6 1.0, PN - 94150-80641)
Replaced S belt, checked each pulley
Searched for exhaust leak to no avail
I have NOT:
Run any fuel injector cleaner, never thought much of it, previous cars I thought had injector issues, I removed and took them to a somewhat local injector guy for flow testing, etc....
Been cognizant of using Top Tier fuel, mostly Kroger fuel near me, I'll start making it a point to use Costco or other top tier fuel
My goal for this weekend:
Compression test
Listen to injectors/disconnect?
The truck wasn't driven much by the previous owner, about 15K miles the past 3 years, not sure if this triggers any thoughts for someone?
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I sea foamed the intake on mine and it quickly showed me where the exhaust leak was. Might want to give that a try.
- Thread starter
- #25
I think this Tundra's 4.7 sounds like my 4.7:
and he thinks it was fuel/fuel injector related, maybe I ought to take the injector cleaners more seriously:
and he thinks it was fuel/fuel injector related, maybe I ought to take the injector cleaners more seriously:
What color is the exhaust smoke, does it smell strong of fuel. It does sound the same.
- Thread starter
- #27
Normally no smoke, after the sea foam lots of gray smoke, but that has dissipated. I don't smell fuel, but I'll ask another's opinion.
2001LC
SILVER Star
I see it's been recommended you don't drive. You sound like you know your way around a wrench, so make the call.
Sound from videos are very difficult to use for making any determination. The wind sound from the fan or what ever, makes one of the video's sound like the engine is going to blow up. Your first one is best IMHO. In that one, it's really not that bad. But you are hearing something has changed or you'd not be hear.
I don't recall you stating any performance issues or low oil pressure.
As noted earlier, your plugs looked good but a tiny little bit of carbon build up. But (picture) didn't show any indication of issue with combustion chamber (rings or valves) IMHO. The tiny carbon build up is one more clue of minor combustion issue, which weak coil, spark plugs and/or dirty injector could be culprit. Injector get loud, if one's not making noise it's not operating.
At one point you removed the S-belt and noise stop for a moment, I assume on start up. Could this be a momentary stuck fuel injector?
I purchase about 4 tanks of gas from my King Scoopers, I'll not do that again. It cost me much more in 44k to clean out the gunk, fuel filter and time than I saved in gas $$. High test Shell or Conoco is about I'll buy in my area anymore.
I think your weekend plans a is good one. But I'd do it a little different, and have some fun ,,,Foot ball... Go Bronco's.
Here's what I'd do: Check each fuel injector as discussed. Assuming you suspect one or more. Then add some 44K or equivalent cleaner, to 1/2 a tank of high quality 91oct gas. Run until cleaning agent get into system, the let rest (soak). Then take a HWY drive (1/4 tank) to some great spot, let engine cool down a bit while having lunch or watching ,,,,FOOT BALL....GO BRONCO'S..sorry. Then drive home, let rest ~hour and recheck fuel injectors. If sounds is a little better, have fuel injectors cleaned. Just make sure you find a good shop to do it. If you do the on vehicle injector cleaning you'll also get fuel pressure test in the deal. Off vehicle you'll get condition & flow tested. Follow up with one more can of 44K in full tank of high test.
If not happy then move to next step. But get a second opinion form a mechanic that works on Toyota high millage 2UZ-fe regularly. He may say sounds is normal.
Sound from videos are very difficult to use for making any determination. The wind sound from the fan or what ever, makes one of the video's sound like the engine is going to blow up. Your first one is best IMHO. In that one, it's really not that bad. But you are hearing something has changed or you'd not be hear.
I don't recall you stating any performance issues or low oil pressure.
As noted earlier, your plugs looked good but a tiny little bit of carbon build up. But (picture) didn't show any indication of issue with combustion chamber (rings or valves) IMHO. The tiny carbon build up is one more clue of minor combustion issue, which weak coil, spark plugs and/or dirty injector could be culprit. Injector get loud, if one's not making noise it's not operating.
At one point you removed the S-belt and noise stop for a moment, I assume on start up. Could this be a momentary stuck fuel injector?
I purchase about 4 tanks of gas from my King Scoopers, I'll not do that again. It cost me much more in 44k to clean out the gunk, fuel filter and time than I saved in gas $$. High test Shell or Conoco is about I'll buy in my area anymore.
I think your weekend plans a is good one. But I'd do it a little different, and have some fun ,,,Foot ball... Go Bronco's.
Here's what I'd do: Check each fuel injector as discussed. Assuming you suspect one or more. Then add some 44K or equivalent cleaner, to 1/2 a tank of high quality 91oct gas. Run until cleaning agent get into system, the let rest (soak). Then take a HWY drive (1/4 tank) to some great spot, let engine cool down a bit while having lunch or watching ,,,,FOOT BALL....GO BRONCO'S..sorry. Then drive home, let rest ~hour and recheck fuel injectors. If sounds is a little better, have fuel injectors cleaned. Just make sure you find a good shop to do it. If you do the on vehicle injector cleaning you'll also get fuel pressure test in the deal. Off vehicle you'll get condition & flow tested. Follow up with one more can of 44K in full tank of high test.
If not happy then move to next step. But get a second opinion form a mechanic that works on Toyota high millage 2UZ-fe regularly. He may say sounds is normal.
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2001LC
SILVER Star
One more thought, you've not needed to add any coolant, ever, have you?
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The problem with recordings from cell phone microphones is that they seem to cancel out some frequencies and boost others. I left the car industry to work in the construction industry a few years back and I make small video clips to show progress on jobs every now and then, on playback you would think the noise would be unbearable but in real life you dont really notice it.
Removing the s belt can change the sound as a misfire would increase the torsional vibration of the crankshaft and the s belt and timing belt will get affected by it. This alone can cause alot of noise, and if your crankshaft pulley is abit worn then it can make it more dramatic, even the valve train could get noisey with vvti I suppose as the cam pulleys would be affected.
I dont believe what you hear stood next to the truck is what some of your recordings sound like on playback on my phone as it sounds dramatic. Every clip sounds different.
I asked if you could smell fuel as if the injector was stuck open the fuel would be flooding the cylinder.
Removing the s belt can change the sound as a misfire would increase the torsional vibration of the crankshaft and the s belt and timing belt will get affected by it. This alone can cause alot of noise, and if your crankshaft pulley is abit worn then it can make it more dramatic, even the valve train could get noisey with vvti I suppose as the cam pulleys would be affected.
I dont believe what you hear stood next to the truck is what some of your recordings sound like on playback on my phone as it sounds dramatic. Every clip sounds different.
I asked if you could smell fuel as if the injector was stuck open the fuel would be flooding the cylinder.
I use to use spit... or my fingers or a spray bottle of water... but now I use an infrared gun (cheap harbor freight) and take the temp at each exhaust port/exhaust manifold connection... this will tell you 100% if it's a fuel, spark or upper combustion chamber issue... with that noise you would think you could lay your hands on it and feel where it's coming from... next I'd remove the skid pan and listen/ feel the bottom end from your recording it could be a bad valve or a rod knock...
- Thread starter
- #32
I can't hear a difference in injectors using a stethoscope.
Only added a bit of coolant after replacing the tee's, otherwise no noticeable coolant loss.
I don't think I'm going to get to the compression test today.
I do have an infrared temp gun, I'll try that too.
It may be intuitive for some to hear or feel the root cause of the noise, unfortunately I'm not in that group yet. I think it's coming from the drivers side top end, but that's as far as I think I can tell.
Again, I'd like to thank everyone for their input, it is greatly appreciated.
Only added a bit of coolant after replacing the tee's, otherwise no noticeable coolant loss.
I don't think I'm going to get to the compression test today.
I do have an infrared temp gun, I'll try that too.
It may be intuitive for some to hear or feel the root cause of the noise, unfortunately I'm not in that group yet. I think it's coming from the drivers side top end, but that's as far as I think I can tell.
Again, I'd like to thank everyone for their input, it is greatly appreciated.
2001LC
SILVER Star
I'm going to assume you checked difference across the valve covers and everywhere you could.
I'd stop at a few Toyota shops and just ask if it sounds normal to them, without saying much else.
I'd stop at a few Toyota shops and just ask if it sounds normal to them, without saying much else.
- Thread starter
- #34
I'm embarrassed to say that I have NOT done a compression test. I moved onto a few things I thought I could make progress on with the suspension. I took it to a local shop that specialized in Toyota that came highly recommended by a close friend for an alignment. When I made the appointment I spoke with one of the guys and asked if they had time, if they'd mind listening to the top end, to which they obliged.
Unfortunately they recommended a timing belt and all the goodies that go with it, at which point they would inspect the variable timing gear (I forget the exact verbiage used, but mention of oil pressure affecting timing was made...) on the drivers side which they think may be causing the racket. Now correct me if I am wrong, but I didn't think the '98 had variable timing or am I confusing terminology and parts?
After the suspension work, I was driving around with the windows down (and the engine cover off, because I hate taking it off/putting it on....) listening to any sounds that are new or different and I noticed the top end noise seems to dissipate under differing rpms and/or loads. It also doesn't seem to be in exact relation to rpm, the noise almost seems to follow behind the rpms? Is there anything that's not directly driven that could be making the noise?
I'm thinking the next step may be to setup an appointment on the other side of town with one of our trusted vendors.
Unfortunately they recommended a timing belt and all the goodies that go with it, at which point they would inspect the variable timing gear (I forget the exact verbiage used, but mention of oil pressure affecting timing was made...) on the drivers side which they think may be causing the racket. Now correct me if I am wrong, but I didn't think the '98 had variable timing or am I confusing terminology and parts?
After the suspension work, I was driving around with the windows down (and the engine cover off, because I hate taking it off/putting it on....) listening to any sounds that are new or different and I noticed the top end noise seems to dissipate under differing rpms and/or loads. It also doesn't seem to be in exact relation to rpm, the noise almost seems to follow behind the rpms? Is there anything that's not directly driven that could be making the noise?
I'm thinking the next step may be to setup an appointment on the other side of town with one of our trusted vendors.
Sounds like you need to see ACC's new shop to me.
2001LC
SILVER Star
VVTi in 06-07 only, so no variable timing gear.
- Thread starter
- #37
Thanks, that's what I thought. The shop (albeit not a great one, that thought I had VVTi) thought the sound came from the front, top end of the drivers side too. What else is there that could cause noise?
2001LC
SILVER Star
In order of likelihood: Nothing it's normal, Fuel injector(s), Exhaust leak, Fan, Value gap, Weak tensioner(s), Air compressor, Power steering pump, Water pump and T-belt damaged. We've talked about most all it could be. Again I'd take to shop that specialize in these 100's or Toyota Dealer. Depending on shop it will cost from $0 to $150 to diagnose.
I just pickup a 01, during inspection I heard a tick. While hood up it was hard to hear, other than a faint tick like lifters or fuel injectors. Once the rig was driven away from me, while I stood near by. I could hear very clearly and exhaust leak. Interestingly exhaust manifold has been replaced in pasted.
I just pickup a 01, during inspection I heard a tick. While hood up it was hard to hear, other than a faint tick like lifters or fuel injectors. Once the rig was driven away from me, while I stood near by. I could hear very clearly and exhaust leak. Interestingly exhaust manifold has been replaced in pasted.
That's the same exact sound my '99 with 145k miles is making. What ended up being the final verdict?
- Thread starter
- #40
Sorry CA, no verdict yet. It's my budget truck and I'm slow. Mine takes about a minute or two before the noise shows up, then doesn't go away.
I haven't done a compression test or arranged any shop diagnosis yet.
I haven't done a compression test or arranged any shop diagnosis yet.
