4 banger LC, thoughts? (1 Viewer)
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One has to remember that as enthusiast, we are a small niche group.
The masses that buy these vehicles could care less about that nice V-8 sound.
If you haven’t driven a modern turbo there is no discernible turbo lag.
In the end, manufactures, build what people are buying affordable vehicles that get good mileage.
Anyone who thinks that gas is an endless resource has their head up their a**
The masses that buy these vehicles could care less about that nice V-8 sound.
If you haven’t driven a modern turbo there is no discernible turbo lag.
In the end, manufactures, build what people are buying affordable vehicles that get good mileage.
Anyone who thinks that gas is an endless resource has their head up their a**
NTTD
Lurker
1. The 250 isn't an "EV".
2. You aren't required to buy it.
3. Let's keep politics out of this before another thread gets closed.
This plus the electric assist should make for great pedal feel.
The bottom line is Toyota has a stellar track record:
- They are famously conservative almost to a fault, taking their time before making changes and bringing new tech to the market. They are known to wait until something is perfected and up to their high standards.
- They are not new to hybrids, or EVs. One could easily say they are "experts". In fact they have opened up thousands of patents royalty free until 2030 and actively consult with other manufacturers who use their technology.
- The "Land Cruiser" name is legendary, synonyms with "quality" & "reliability" as is the name "Toyota". I have every faith that they've done their best to make the 250/Prado great.
Would I beat against Toyota? Hell no.
EDIT: Spelling
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I made this table to better understand potential payload savings from the 250 hybrid's fuel efficiency for remote touring.
It uses three hypothetical payload scenarios (1500, 1600, 1700 lbs) for the 250 in order to (1) calculate effective payload (available payload after fuel weight) for 500 and 1000 mile range fuel weights, and (2) compare that effective payload across the series, given their MPG and payloads, from 80 through 250.
The fuel weight and payload savings of the hybrid are considerable, particularly if battery weight does not toll payload below 1500 lbs or so. We'll see.
It uses three hypothetical payload scenarios (1500, 1600, 1700 lbs) for the 250 in order to (1) calculate effective payload (available payload after fuel weight) for 500 and 1000 mile range fuel weights, and (2) compare that effective payload across the series, given their MPG and payloads, from 80 through 250.
The fuel weight and payload savings of the hybrid are considerable, particularly if battery weight does not toll payload below 1500 lbs or so. We'll see.
| Series/Year | Est. Comb. MPG | Payload | Fuel Weight / 500 miles range | Pounds of Effective Payload after 500 Mile Range Fuel Weight | Fuel Weight / 1000 miles range | Pounds of Effective Payload after 1000 Mile Range Fuel Weight |
| 80/1992 | 11 | 1,930 | 277.27 | 1,652.73 | 554.55 | 1,375.45 |
| 100/2002 | 13 | 1,745 | 234.62 | 1,510.38 | 469.23 | 1,275.77 |
| 200/2020 | 15 | 1,570 | 203.33 | 1,366.67 | 406.67 | 1,163.33 |
| 250/2024 | 27 | 1,700 | 112.96 | 1,587.04 | 225.93 | 1,474.07 |
| 250/2024 | 27 | 1,600 | 112.96 | 1,487.04 | 225.93 | 1,374.07 |
| 250/2024 | 27 | 1,500 | 112.96 | 1,387.04 | 225.93 | 1,274.07 |
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People on TV do all the time. I had more but deleted it as I don't want to get too far into politics either and risk this thread, but the preceding sentence is accurate.
Please refrain from name calling, I would appreciate it. I'm not on here to get nasty.
99% LX570 owner's never take there LX570's off road !!
And no it not going to do what my 80 does with virtually stock suspension a small lift gearing and big tires, nor is a LC200 or LC250
NTTD
Lurker
Absolutely, we're all adults and can have civil discussions without resorting to.
But for clarification in the context of how it was used "troll" was a verb. I believe they were saying you "trolled" yourself.
This definition of "troll" comes originally from fishing.
The EIA has consistently underpredicted electrification uptake rates for the last decade or more. 5+ years ago they were saying we would be at less than 1% EV sales nationally. I think we're almost bumping up on 10% nationally right now. They haven't even factored in new zero emission vehicle percentage requirements from the states that have adopted them which account for 30-38% of total US sales.
Gearing has nothing to do with suspension.
The Suspension design has not been altered.
But whatever.
I haven't seen any info on payload for the LC250 yet.
I'd love to understand how payload is determined. Does anyone have any reliable knowledge on how it is set?
It's hard for me to figure this one out. It doesn't seem to be tire related - the oem 116T tires are good for 5500lbs per axle. Starting at 2500lbs on each axle still leaves 3k lbs of headroom if the load was entirely on the rear axle. My Tundra has a payload of only 1330lbs and my last 4Runner had 1700lbs of payload. But in real use the Tundra is significantly far more capable of hauling heavy stuff. I wouldn't think twice about a 2500lb pallet of block or a yard of sand in the Tundra. That would be too much for the 4Runner. I tend to think the LC200 also would haul significantly better than the 4Runner despite a low payload rating. I'm just not sure what the actual limiting factor or formula is.
I'd love to understand how payload is determined. Does anyone have any reliable knowledge on how it is set?
It's hard for me to figure this one out. It doesn't seem to be tire related - the oem 116T tires are good for 5500lbs per axle. Starting at 2500lbs on each axle still leaves 3k lbs of headroom if the load was entirely on the rear axle. My Tundra has a payload of only 1330lbs and my last 4Runner had 1700lbs of payload. But in real use the Tundra is significantly far more capable of hauling heavy stuff. I wouldn't think twice about a 2500lb pallet of block or a yard of sand in the Tundra. That would be too much for the 4Runner. I tend to think the LC200 also would haul significantly better than the 4Runner despite a low payload rating. I'm just not sure what the actual limiting factor or formula is.
Thank you for making that clarification delicately.
If you've lifted it, it isn't stock.
Your Right it's far for stock, the point was the basic suspension design has not been altered, solid axle swapped, three or fore linked
Children !
We all like/ some love (I cannot love an inanimate thing, personally)/enjoy our 40's, 70's, 80's, 100', 200's, and even 300's (other parts of the world not USA)... we got it !
Would the 4 banger be enough? I'd say ,YES.
Would the LC250 Landcruiser (cough, Land cruiser Prado, cough) sell like hot cakes in the USA? I'd say, YES.
It is not a front solid axel. It is not triple locked. It wont be, probably, tank feel like the 100 and 200.
We love our V8's (I do too, LC200 onwer three times, C63 owner twice, BMW M3 E90 once), but unless towing big time, the LC250 would be just fine.
Would I rather have a 27 MPG efficient V8? Oh Lord knows, YEAH ! But, it ain't going to happen, it will be a (1) little 4 banger (2) "envenenado" (like we used to say when I was a kid back in my country when you would turbo charge a poor 4cy car) Turbo and to help emissions and MPG when you start the car, (3) Hybrid ! Like some have said, I trust Toyota and pray that they don't let us down in the quality department, so it will be enough ! I wish some of you here have had the opportunity to drive Prados in other countries where they sell the LC too, and compare them. The Prado IS capable, VERY capable, but it ain't a LC... the closest Prado to a LC, was/is the GX470 and 460 here in the States, and yet... It is / was not a LC. So, the LC250 WILL not be a LC200 sucessor, but... the 4 banger WILL be enough to take families with gear into great adventures, whichever and whatever they are and take them !
Remember to be kind to each other, like I tell my growing kids every day, the world needs kindness everywhere !
Cheers,
G
We all like/ some love (I cannot love an inanimate thing, personally)/enjoy our 40's, 70's, 80's, 100', 200's, and even 300's (other parts of the world not USA)... we got it !
Would the 4 banger be enough? I'd say ,YES.
Would the LC250 Landcruiser (cough, Land cruiser Prado, cough) sell like hot cakes in the USA? I'd say, YES.
It is not a front solid axel. It is not triple locked. It wont be, probably, tank feel like the 100 and 200.
We love our V8's (I do too, LC200 onwer three times, C63 owner twice, BMW M3 E90 once), but unless towing big time, the LC250 would be just fine.
Would I rather have a 27 MPG efficient V8? Oh Lord knows, YEAH ! But, it ain't going to happen, it will be a (1) little 4 banger (2) "envenenado" (like we used to say when I was a kid back in my country when you would turbo charge a poor 4cy car) Turbo and to help emissions and MPG when you start the car, (3) Hybrid ! Like some have said, I trust Toyota and pray that they don't let us down in the quality department, so it will be enough ! I wish some of you here have had the opportunity to drive Prados in other countries where they sell the LC too, and compare them. The Prado IS capable, VERY capable, but it ain't a LC... the closest Prado to a LC, was/is the GX470 and 460 here in the States, and yet... It is / was not a LC. So, the LC250 WILL not be a LC200 sucessor, but... the 4 banger WILL be enough to take families with gear into great adventures, whichever and whatever they are and take them !
Remember to be kind to each other, like I tell my growing kids every day, the world needs kindness everywhere !
Cheers,
G
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Not sure if this is a repost. But it's worth a look if you're curious about more info about the new T4 engine. The truck engine has a lot of differences - roughly 1/3 of the parts are different between the truck version and car version that's discussed here. However, interesting stuff I didn't know - example, the T4 uses vacuum waste gate instead of the electric one used on the TTv6 that has been a it problematic. Interesting look from a pretty practical knowledgeable mechanic. There's a lot to like about the design. And - it makes me wish even more that Toyota had made an inline 6 that uses this design over a v6. Also - the ability to possibly completely bypass the turbo under low load - and a hybrid that means it may rarely need the high turbo output - might result in a very long turbo life. If it runs only 30% as many revolutions as a turbo in a typical motor - that might mean 450k mile service life. I already knew it didn't have an EGR at all - that's a big plus he talks about. T4 hybrid might be the longest lasting powertrain of the bunch. The more I learn, the more I like it.
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Thank you for the share. It has been shared before but that does not matter.
He seems to be pretty knowledgeable and straightforward. I like him. Whether or not he is mechanically 100 percent correct, I cannot assess but he seems to be decent mechanic.
I hope like you that the 4 banger is good....
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Let’s hear all this “I hate the 4cyl Turbo Hybrid” talk when gas is at $5 per gallon !
Or “This Hybrid crap isn’t reliable” when you see a Prius cruising by you that has 300-500k miles on em.
Or…..
When a 250 is in Moab next year hitting all the obstacles all day with a 1/4 of a tank of gas gone and then drives back home.
Look I was against it at first, then I Thought about my 40,my 80,my 100 and my New Sienna Hybrid. A lot.
My lowly 4cyl non turbo hybrid tows 3,000lbs fine. I’m sure twice the power will tow 5,000lbs fine also.
I believe this Land Cruiser 250 will be more robust than the Outgoing 4runner.. and more nimble than the 200 series…. Plus More modern and fuel efficient than most any other Rig out there.
Some just like the taste of Haterade!
Or “This Hybrid crap isn’t reliable” when you see a Prius cruising by you that has 300-500k miles on em.
Or…..
When a 250 is in Moab next year hitting all the obstacles all day with a 1/4 of a tank of gas gone and then drives back home.
Look I was against it at first, then I Thought about my 40,my 80,my 100 and my New Sienna Hybrid. A lot.
My lowly 4cyl non turbo hybrid tows 3,000lbs fine. I’m sure twice the power will tow 5,000lbs fine also.
I believe this Land Cruiser 250 will be more robust than the Outgoing 4runner.. and more nimble than the 200 series…. Plus More modern and fuel efficient than most any other Rig out there.
Some just like the taste of Haterade!
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Even on dedicated trips to Moab, only a very small percentage of total miles is on actual trails.
There are plenty of high mileage Hyundais out there.
Being able to move something from point to point is not the same as towing well.
We are all sure they will sell every single one that they produce.
Talking points and blind loyalty aside, none of that was ever the point of the objections and/or unease.
There are plenty of high mileage Hyundais out there.
Being able to move something from point to point is not the same as towing well.
We are all sure they will sell every single one that they produce.
Talking points and blind loyalty aside, none of that was ever the point of the objections and/or unease.
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