4 banger LC, thoughts? (1 Viewer)

[Phillyd2]

I've said it before and I'll say it again - we love our Hybrid Toyota. It's a work of automotive art, just like Toyota's SUVs. Why would they not combine the two?

They did combine them.

A Land Cruiser should have catered to a much different driver than a Highlander, so concerned about MPG. That ship too has sadly sailed.

Frustration aside, hats off and sincere kudos to Toyota for understanding the real market. They came and saw how Jeeps, Broncos and TRDs were really used and by who and then went from there. From a fellow business owner, nothing but respect.

 

[OldCarSmell]

I think the term “4 banger” leads people the wrong way in thought relative to this vehicle and many others. The original and proceeding 4 cylinder engines that the term was used to (lightly) mockingly describe just don’t compare to current 4 cylinder engines (of this variety). The technology is advanced to a degree that the fact that each have 4 cylinders leads one to think they’ll perform similarly when that is patently untrue. I know everyone is reckoning with the change and wondering how it’ll play out - none of us know at this point - but I wonder what another term could be to capture the performance of these newly designed engines? I put this challenge to all the Mudders out there reading!

 

[Land Caesar]

Even on dedicated trips to Moab, only a very small percentage of total miles is on actual trails.
There are plenty of high mileage Hyundais out there.
Being able to move something from point to point is not the same as towing well.
We are all sure they will sell every single one that they produce.

Talking points and blind loyalty aside, none of that was ever the point of the objections and/or unease.

Not arguing, just discussing.

As an Example… A Guy who has a new Trd pro 4runner today, uses his Vehicle for family travel, or Hard trails, maybe overlanding. He grabs a Small camper on the wknds, Maybe a trailer of mulch or stone for Landscape work at home and uses it as a SUV should.

Yet as a modded Trail rig he gets 15mpg and travels out to Colorado or Moab for A fun get away, on Far hiways, has fun and then back home to the 9-5 Monday grind. That’s a lot of fuel.

If a person can do all that, with more Torque, better Pulling power… enough HP and slightly larger interior……..

WHY is that a bad thing?

That makes pretty good sense to me, and considering what the next likely Decade of fuel cost per gallon may be at, I think Toyota actually gave what we asked for.

If those who don’t like it, don’t buy it… Ok

As they can get the 6cyl GX Lexus.

Problems solved.

 

[Phillyd2]

The LC is coming with the engine it’s coming with. End discussion.

My issue now is with those trying to convince us that it was the best possible option and that we should be thrilled at our good luck. I’m just hoping with Good Enough.

 

[Land Caesar]

I’m just Pissed off there is no Tailgate! What the Hell?

And that 1958 Better have a Roof Rack!

 

[OGBeno]

I think the term “4 banger” leads people the wrong way in thought relative to this vehicle and many others. The original and proceeding 4 cylinder engines that the term was used to (lightly) mockingly describe just don’t compare to current 4 cylinder engines (of this variety). The technology is advanced to a degree that the fact that each have 4 cylinders leads one to think they’ll perform similarly when that is patently untrue. I know everyone is reckoning with the change and wondering how it’ll play out - none of us know at this point - but I wonder what another term could be to capture the performance of these newly designed engines? I put this challenge to all the Mudders out there reading!

Well said.

I‘m leaning towards something like “Dynamic 4“/“Dynamic T4” “T4 NexGen”

 

[MeWantLC]

I will forever call it, 4-banger, affectionately of course... Because, it is funny. And because reminds me of a nice derriere of someone I used to know back in Grad school

 

[MeWantLC]

I think that most likely, I will spur the cash for the Toyota Extra Care, Platinum coverage with $0 deductible for 10 year / 125k mileage, if the offer it or even longer if it exist. I was thinking today... This car would probably out last me for the next 30+ years, as someone said above 450k miles, then I am good too go: about 10k per year, 300k or so in 30 years. Yep, seems ok for a 4 banger.

 

[Rednexus]

They did combine them.

A Land Cruiser should have catered to a much different driver than a Highlander, so concerned about MPG. That ship too has sadly sailed.

Frustration aside, hats off and sincere kudos to Toyota for understanding the real market. They came and saw how Jeeps, Broncos and TRDs were really used and by who and then went from there. From a fellow business owner, nothing but respect.

They are totally different vehicles.
One is BOF, one is unibody. One has a transverse engine, one is longitudnal. One has an electric motor at the IFS rear axle, one has a 9.5" with an elocker that is driven by a driveshaft. Ine has a CVT, one has gears. One has a TC, one does not. Complete apples to oranges.

IMO the LC stays very true to the Prado form, only the swapped out the 1GR/1UR for the hybrid turbo 4. Everything else is the same formula they've used since the 120 series came out in 2002.

 

[Phillyd2]

They are totally different vehicles.
One is BOF, one is unibody. One has a transverse engine, one is longitudnal. One has an electric motor at the IFS rear axle, one has a 9.5" with an elocker that is driven by a driveshaft. Ine has a CVT, one has gears. One has a TC, one does not. Complete apples to oranges.

IMO the LC stays very true to the Prado form, only the swapped out the 1GR/1UR for the hybrid turbo 4. Everything else is the same formula they've used since the 120 series came out in 2002.

I wasn't comparing the vehicles.

 

[Land Caesar]

They are totally different vehicles.
One is BOF, one is unibody. One has a transverse engine, one is longitudnal. One has an electric motor at the IFS rear axle, one has a 9.5" with an elocker that is driven by a driveshaft. Ine has a CVT, one has gears. One has a TC, one does not. Complete apples to oranges.

IMO the LC stays very true to the Prado form, only the swapped out the 1GR/1UR for the hybrid turbo 4. Everything else is the same formula they've used since the 120 series came out in 2002.

The 112” wheel distance

That’s not typical of a Prado

 

[Jetboy]

The Highlander and LC crossover a lot of their uses. RAV4 is probably closer in cargo and passenger volume. But in general they share a lot. I'm not sure that's bad. It's a spectrum and they are naturally going to crossover. As far as engines go, buyers want the same thing in a Highlander they do in a LC. Smooth, quiet, efficient, and powerful.

 

[Rednexus]

The 112” wheel distance

That’s not typical of a Prado

I said "true to Prado form", not the dimensions are equal to a Prado .

I wasn't comparing the vehicles.

Fair enough, but they are 100% targeted at different kinds of drivers. Folks who buy a Hybrid Highlander buy it as a reliable family hauler that happens to get awesome MPG and retain it's resale value. That's why we have ours over something like a CX-9 or Ascent. I strongly pushed my wife to get a end-of-the-line 2023 GX460, which would have been <$10K more, but she insisted on the Highlander as she doesn't like the driving dynamics of my GX (objectively, the Highlander handles far better in normal driving and is more car-like).

That is not at all the target demographic of the new LC - it will still have the truck/SUV like driving dynamics and will still be 8 mpg short of a Highlander (which is better than the 16 mpg short of a GX460). It'll still have the big compromises for inside space inherit with a BOF, solid axle vehicle, relative to a unibody crossover. Suburban moms don't like any of those things.

I also personally think the EV mode will be great for slow-speed crawling and provide better control/low-end torque. The more I think about it the more I like the idea of a hybrid off-roader for things like MPG/range and being able to run more electric accessories. But that doesn't change how much I love my 16 year-old GX with a modified V8, and I have zero intention of getting rid of it.

 

[Land Caesar]

I said "true to Prado form", not the dimensions are equal to a Prado .

Fair enough, but they are 100% targeted at different kinds of drivers. Folks who buy a Hybrid Highlander buy it as a reliable family hauler that happens to get awesome MPG and retain it's resale value. That's why we have ours over something like a CX-9 or Ascent. I strongly pushed my wife to get a end-of-the-line 2023 GX460, which would have been <$10K more, but she insisted on the Highlander as she doesn't like the driving dynamics of my GX (objectively, the Highlander handles far better in normal driving and is more car-like).

That is not at all the target demographic of the new LC - it will still have the truck/SUV like driving dynamics and will still be 8 mpg short of a Highlander (which is better than the 16 mpg short of a GX460). It'll still have the big compromises for inside space inherit with a BOF, solid axle vehicle, relative to a unibody crossover. Suburban moms don't like any of those things.

I also personally think the EV mode will be great for slow-speed crawling and provide better control/low-end torque. The more I think about it the more I like the idea of a hybrid off-roader for things like MPG/range and being able to run more electric accessories. But that doesn't change how much I love my 16 year-old GX with a modified V8, and I have zero intention of getting rid of it.

My 40 was awesome, 80 was really tough… 100 made me appreciate the 200 series I drove plenty of.

I wanted more modern for family to be comfortable.

After buying them a New Sienna I’m in the market… and was going to the 200 series

Yet the new 250 fits my needs better.

 

[Phillyd2]

Many comments here tell a different story about the target audience.

Regardless, will that hybrid battery be able to run other things that many typically used a duel battery system for? Fridge for days with the engine off? Air compressor? Winch?

 

[Rednexus]

Many comments here tell a different story about the target audience.

Regardless, will that hybrid battery be able to run other things that many typically used a duel battery system for? Fridge for days with the engine off? Air compressor? Winch?

Yes - the battery looks to be ~160 amp/hours, or equivalent to ~3 group 34 AGM batteries. And it recharges driving down a hill or just by idling the engine. No need to add-ons like solar panels, expensive aftermarket battery and controller, big alternator, etc. They hybrid battery could provide all of that. It would definitely be nice to power your fridge simply by using your brakes on a hill instead of wasting that energy by warping rotors and wearing out pads.

 

[Land Caesar]

Yes - the battery looks to be ~160 amp/hours, or equivalent to ~3 group 34 AGM batteries. And it recharges driving down a hill or just by idling the engine. No need to add-ons like solar panels, expensive aftermarket battery and controller, big alternator, etc. They hybrid battery could provide all of that. It would definitely be nice to power your fridge simply by using your brakes on a hill instead of wasting that energy by warping rotors and wearing out pads.

As stated I’ve had many cruisers and recently bought a New Hybrid Sienna.

Brakes are definitely prolonged in life with less money spent on them… as Electric motors assist

That hybrid system charges in many ways, not just braking. Not just cruising down hill.

The battery charge display can really show all the ways it charges. Like up inclines, or when foot is off pedal.

Camping Within The 250 could be nice with HVAC running off a little 4cyl occasionally.

2400 watts is pretty freaking awesome for RTT’s and enclosed awnings.

Many cool ideas will come from the Hybrid Cruiser out on the Trail

 

[Rednexus]

It seems there is a big difference in how the LC250 is being received between those who own hybrid Toyotas and those who do not own one. Hybrid owners realize how great - and frankly simple/reliable - Toyota's hybrid technology is and all of the benefits (if properly executed) it can bring a 4x4/overlanding vehicle. Again - from having owned both our Hybrid and my old V8 GX, I'm now pretty excited for a hybrid LC250 as a potential replacement vehicle in the (long term) future. Time will tell how they eventually work out (and how the bugs are worked out), but it is promising to me.

 

[Jetboy]

Yes - the battery looks to be ~160 amp/hours, or equivalent to ~3 group 34 AGM batteries. And it recharges driving down a hill or just by idling the engine. No need to add-ons like solar panels, expensive aftermarket battery and controller, big alternator, etc. They hybrid battery could provide all of that. It would definitely be nice to power your fridge simply by using your brakes on a hill instead of wasting that energy by warping rotors and wearing out pads.

The open question I have is whether Toyota did it the way Ford does that you can put in a generator mode that manages battery and automatically idles as necessary to generate when the battery is low. If not - borderline inexcusable miss by Toyota. It would be incredibly lazy to not have integrated that option.

 

[Land Caesar]

It seems there is a big difference in how the LC250 is being received between those who own hybrid Toyotas and those who do not own one. Hybrid owners realize how great - and frankly simple/reliable - Toyota's hybrid technology is and all of the benefits (if properly executed) it can bring a 4x4/overlanding vehicle. Again - from having owned both our Hybrid and my old V8 GX, I'm now pretty excited for a hybrid LC250 as a potential replacement vehicle in the (long term) future. Time will tell how they eventually work out (and how the bugs are worked out), but it is promising to me.

This^^^^


I’ve been back and forth with what’s my next Toyota.

I was headed towards a Tundra… and maybe a FWC, yet Always loved my 3 Land Cruisers.

Recently Loaded to the utmost of maximum with my Awd Hybrid Sienna… as if it was a 300 series… I went on a trip and really really enjoyed the 33mpg I got over 500miles average one way and 31 Mpg on way back.


If I can get a Cruiser that is Similar type of Performance, with a more Heavy duty Suv Vehicle plus 2400 watts of power at the tap

Oh ya! I’m definitely aware of the possibilities that the 250 has.

Took a bit of research and thought on my part to accept the new 4 cyl 250

Yet compared to a 100 series HP and Torque , it’s impressive.