300 Series Announced (1 Viewer)

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If the Lexus LX600 is the next King ready to carry the crown I wonder at what cost. Cars only get more expensive each generation and even more so in this political and economic climate. The current LX570 is already about $100-$105k brand new. So I expect MSRP of the LX600 to start in the $110K range. Add in the F-sport and VIP trims and we're climbing up to $115K - $120K. Lexus is a luxury brand and even if the F-sport is going to be the off-road trim that doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be a cheap and trimmed down model. If you want a TRD Off-Road anything that costs more, not less. It was already hard enough for people to buy a $85-$90K Toyota Land Cruiser, I don't know that a $110K LX600 would change anyones mind. Plus there's a psychological barrier to buying a car that is worth 6 digits.

Honestly I don't think the LX600 is going to be the car that carries Toyota's off road heritage here in the US. A slightly larger 6th gen 4Runner with already a good off-road heritage and nameplate is probably going to be that vehicle. The Sequoia, well, I hate the name and it doesn't have a real off-road following the same way the 4Runner does.
 
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There's been signals of where Toyota/Lexus are headed. And maybe given competitors and market conditions, it's the right business choice. I agree with @Gazziza in regards to the psychological upper bound for a Toyota. Potentially a hard pill to swallow for traditionalists, but following that path is how a company becomes like Harley Davidson. The writings been on the wall with flaccid LC sales and demand that has only seen an uptick with the announcement of LCs demise. There may still be hope that the LC, in Land Cruiser guise, could return to North America one day. It surely wouldn't be hard as they have turn-key product. Maybe after a delay. And things do change. Maybe.

Indications have not been good on the Toyota front. Especially as Toyota has been stoking TRD trims for everything in their line-up. Sequoia got a TRD Pro. Even the Rav4 got a TRD Off-Road trim. LC got a paint and sticker Heritage model.

Strong signals on the Lexus front. There's little doubt their intent is to capture the the high end off-road market with overland tailored packages in F-Sport trim. With enough grit for maybe even some LC die-hards? Won't matter if that's not the current LC owner base (which by sales numbers is tiny), as all the TRD Pro boys needs somewhere to graduate to. Lexus has commissioned no less than 3 builds (2x GXOR, 1x J201) recently to suggest so. With more J201 news exposure recently, doubtedly just chance that it aligned with the LC300 announcement. This all wouldn't happen unless there was some intent in their roadmap. There's more Lexus SUVs with the LQ and LF-Z as more focused tools for road oriented flagships, allows these traditional body on frame models to steer harder towards overlanding.

Traditionalists have the current and used market, which is probably where they'll want to be anyways. Toyota/Lexus didn't become the largest automobile manufacturer in the world by making shortsighted decisions. The Lexus announcements are likely where the real 300-series fireworks will happen.

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I don't think that the 300 (if it were to come to the US as a Toyota product) has enough advancement (from what we've seen) to warrant any higher price tag than the current outgoing 200. We'd love to continue along with the Land Cruiser heritage (we are on our fourth Cruiser) for years to come but I am willing to bet that the misses next vehicle is of European descent on a lease or the new full-size Bronco.
 
ElJayBird said:
<shudder>

Personally can't stand the 'throwback' body styles
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Agreed. Ugly, ugly vehicle. A buddy of mine was considering getting one until he found out about the Bronco's 3500lb tow capacity; that pretty much makes it useless.
 
Lol, I get it, they aren't for everyone, just like some of these Toyota's aren't as well. I had a 72 and a 79 Bronco so for me it's kind of a nostalgic tip of the cap to the older models. Whatever I get next we solely be used as a daily, I could care less what it can tow, I have a diesel 1-ton for those duties.
 
I agree. Ford released this to steal sales from Wranglers. And they would be successful at doing that for me. I'd take the new Bronco over a new Wrangler. Can't speak for reliability, but the 3500lb tow capacity pales in comparison to the fact that you can order one with 400ft-lbs of torque, triple locked, and with 35's from the factory. Also, the same drivetrain in a F150 tows 8500lbs, so I suspect the tow rating has more to do with the dimensions of the Bronco than anything else.


As far as 100k+ LX600s. I think that's where the market is now. Fully optioned Navigators and Escalades are hitting the $120k mark now. Not to mention Range Rovers and the like....At <10k sales per year of the 200 platform in general in USA, neither of these platforms are competing to be the "every-mans" offroader, so i'm not sure what difference 10-20k is going to make in the price.
 
lx200inAR said:
I agree. Ford released this to steal sales from Wranglers. And they would be successful at doing that for me. I'd take the new Bronco over a new Wrangler. Can't speak for reliability, but the 3500lb tow capacity pales in comparison to the fact that you can order one with 400ft-lbs of torque, triple locked, and with 35's from the factory. Also, the same drivetrain in a F150 tows 8500lbs, so I suspect the tow rating has more to do with the dimensions of the Bronco than anything else.


As far as 100k+ LX600s. I think that's where the market is now. Fully optioned Navigators and Escalades are hitting the $120k mark now. Not to mention Range Rovers and the like....At <10k sales per year of the 200 platform in general in USA, neither of these platforms are competing to be the "every-mans" offroader, so i'm not sure what difference 10-20k is going to make in the price.
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nah…for me, if i wanted something like Bronco, i would gladly take Wrangler Rubicon 392 over ANY Bronco. True heritage. Excellent resale value. 0-60 in 4.5 sec. Triple lockers. Disconnects. FULL-time 4wd (huge for me!). FOX suspension. Aftermarket support second to none.

As for design, LC lags behind basically everyone. My LC has as much design flare as a Highlander. :( Heck the new Highlander design puts to shame LC200 and LC300!
 
Madtiger said:
nah…for me, if i wanted something like Bronco, i would gladly take Wrangler Rubicon 392 over ANY Bronco. True heritage. Excellent resale value. 0-60 in 4.5 sec. Triple lockers. Disconnects. FULL-time 4wd (huge for me!). FOX suspension. Aftermarket support second to none.

As for design, LC lags behind basically everyone. My LC has as much design flare as a Highlander. :( Heck the new Highlander design puts to shame LC200 and LC300!
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Ill say, I wasn't factoring in the 392, but that's not a super realistic comparison. The Rubicon 392 ($75k) cost 25% more than the most expensive factory Bronco you can spec, and with the exception of the big motor, has similar options, triple locked, auto 4wd transfer case, Bilstein suspension, front disconnect (hydraulic instead of electric), 35s (Rubicon only has 33s). The Bronco is IFS, so I suppose that's probably a deterrent for the most offroad hungry buyers.

I don't put a lot of stock in "heritage" but i know that 1st and 2nd gen broncos sells for a lot more than an old jeep does. Switches a little when you get to 3rd gen broncos.
 
I find these negative comments interesting. Ive been driving Land Cruisers since 1987. Every new model results in the same comments. For me, the 300 GR spec would be the perfect next step, especially if they release a hybrid version. For my uses, i need solid 4WD and long term reliability and durability. And an ability to tow 5k pounds at a minimum. I don’t rock crawl. I drive dirt/mud/snow fire roads in the mountains, long stretches of washboarded gravel, often far north or south of the US border. So it can’t break down on me. It needs to look generic and local and be able to be fixed anywhere. And i need to get 15-20 years of hard use out of my LC. A Bronco or a Wrangler will not work. Neither will a Defender or a G- Wagen. Its toyota all the way for me.
 
Different strokes for different folks, it's awesome that we have a free and open market that allows us so many possibilities and options. The only two things the Jeep has over the Ford is the aftermarket and a solid front axle, the Hemi doesn't factor because it's not standard, cost a lot more and will be a much smaller production. No other off-road vehicle will ever come close to the Jeep aftermarket so thats a moot point and the straight axle while preferred off-road for rock crawling and durability with larger tires certainly takes a back seat to IFS for daily driving and high-speed off-road performance. While they are very similar in a lot of ways they are also still not a head-to-head comparison. The Bronco will likely cut into Wrangler sales but I don't see it hurting the Jeep image or their loyal fan base for the most part.

My next vehicle will solely be used as a daily for around town and light weekend travel, I don't need it tow a lot or carry a ton of people and gear. The Bronco would be a perfect fit for this role but I have to actually drive one and see how they do over the next year or so before I ever get serious about one. The aftermarket is already clamoring to bring products to market for the platform and some are already releasing parts and they aren't even on the streets yet. Sadly, for now, the 300 Series in Toyota garb is but a pipe dream in this country and unless it begins to grow on me and is offered in the stripped down GR trim I doubt I'll see myself in one anytime soon. Now the misses might be interested in upgrading at which point the 200 becomes mine (yay) but again it'll have to be sold here first for that to even be a possibility.
 
I guess Toyota marketing dept forgot they aren’t releasing the ‘22 in the U.S. Here’s an ad for a discount on a 2022 Land Cruiser.

BuyaToyota.com

Buy A Toyota - Cincinnati
www.buyatoyota.com
 
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Madtiger said:
nah…for me, if i wanted something like Bronco, i would gladly take Wrangler Rubicon 392 over ANY Bronco. True heritage. Excellent resale value. 0-60 in 4.5 sec. Triple lockers. Disconnects. FULL-time 4wd (huge for me!). FOX suspension. Aftermarket support second to none.

As for design, LC lags behind basically everyone. My LC has as much design flare as a Highlander. :( Heck the new Highlander design puts to shame LC200 and LC300!
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Haha. I love when someone jumps in with mostly irrelevant thoughts, completely full of themselves, and misses so bad.

The 392 wrangler was built to overshadow the bronco release, but is way more expensive and won't be cross shopped. So go ahead and get your big bad way too expensive wrangler....the bronco guys won't care.

Now back to how Toyota shat the bed with almost every decision made concerning the 300.
 
onemanarmy said:
Haha. I love when someone jumps in with mostly irrelevant thoughts, completely full of themselves, and misses so bad.

The 392 wrangler was built to overshadow the bronco release, but is way more expensive and won't be cross shopped. So go ahead and get your big bad way too expensive wrangler....the bronco guys won't care.

Now back to how Toyota shat the bed with almost every decision made concerning the 300.
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You sure 392 won’t take any bronco customers? Hmmm, someone is completely full of themselves. And it ain’t me.
 
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