In their crazy scheme to get people to spend more money to boost profits, that sounds about right.
2024 GX/Prado Release and Discussion
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tampacruiser95
Upgrades are coming.
I don't know. If they make it a true off roader, add lockers, but also make it a non gas guzzler, could command a premium. I hope you are right though. Would be great to buy it new and not have to wait for price to drop used.
Past failures are not the way to future success. Also, the Prado (which this car is sold as in other markets) is a cheaper vehicle than the LC300.
LOL...
You are not wrong...
I am just saying that if they price the "US" Prado as its priced in all other markets, which is Mid 30's, I think it has a place in this market to compete against something like a Cherokee. which starts at 37. If they do this wierd thing where they charge the US a 2X premium, they will sell a handful of them a year just like the 200 and theres not going to be any aftermarket support.
Its not capable enough to chosen over a wrangler or bronco and its not comfortable enough to be chosen over something like a defender or a Q8. It occupies this weird no man's land. And thats if they don't manage to totally mess up the cargo area like they did in the sequoia.
I also think that if the 4cylinder is the only option that's going to be an issue. In Kuwait, it cost around a 1000 dollars to upgrade from a 4 cylinder to a 6 cylinder in the current gen prado and you are looking at 42K out the door. Hell you can upgrade for a 4 to a 6 cylinder in the Tacoma for 500 dollars. Locking the TTV6 behind something that they are competing against much higher end vehicles is silly.
45k out the door, with 33's and lockers is absolutly doable.
Outside of appropriating the Landcruiser badge, the Prado, is not going to be offering have any additional or enhanced capability over the domestic 4Runner and Tacoma that occupy the same that same price point. Mounting an Ipad and slapping on some nice seat covers and getting prices into the 60k's doesn't sell enough Prados in the US to generate aftermarket support.
I think there are some really good qualities about the prado, at a certain price point.
I am honestly just very agnostic at this point. If they nail it, ill get inline.
Across the board, the modern trend of going to smaller, turbocharged engines has not really netted any appreciable increase in efficiency. You are looking at maybe 3mpg's on high end under lab conditions. If you live in a city, or a place with hills, or have large tires, there is no advantage.
You can attain better efficiency by going diesel. Diesel 2500's have pretty much the same efficiency as Toyotas Hybrid TTV6's. Light duty Dutys are significantly more efficient.
I really don't understand giving people the option to upgrade the Tacoma from a 4cylinder to a 6 cylinder for 500 bucks, and not do so in the LC.
Thats not going to drive me to the GX, that's going to drive me into something elses.
Lets say that a locked LC maxes at 55k. In order to get the larger engine, i would have to step up into the GX at around for the base "Premium" of 65k, and its not even going to have lockers, or crawl control. I would have to upgrade into the Overtrain which will probably breach 70k.
The LC 250 will be priced above the 4Runner and the 2023 4Runner starts at $40k. You’re smoking something if you think it will start in the mid $30s. It will start above $50k.
Diesel engines, with their expensive high pressure fuel injection systems and complex exhaust treatment systems cost on the order of $4k more than a gasoline engine of comparable power, Add to that extra initial cost the higher cost of fuel (10%+ in many US markets), plus the cost of DEF fluid and more expensive maintenance, and it becomes hard to make an economic justification for buying a light duty diesel in the US.
But regardless of whether or not you agree with the economic arguments against a light duty diesel, the reality is that Toyota simply won’t sell a diesel in the US. Hybrid? Yes. Diesel? No.
I'm not thinking its going to start in the mid 30's, I am saying that's where the 250 makes sense in every non US market on the planet.
The 4Runner and Prado hold the same price point. What is the LC going to offer over a 4runner that warrants a 10k premium. its the same vehicle... No different than GMC Seira and Chevy Silverado.
You are not wrong that there are additional factors the increase the cost of a light diesel but if efficacy is something you want, you have to pay the piper, there is no free lunch.
In the case of a mid grade, 1500 GMC truck, upgrading into a diesel is around 2k and can make 24mpg's. doing so in a 2500 would cost around 10k and get you 15mpg's but you are also doubling the tq over the base engine. Light diesels are only going to offer marginal gains in tq at the benefit of increased efficiency.
Hybrids can make sense in certain applications, considering the lost in cargo volume, I am not sure if they are the best application for outdoor stuff.
Toyota engineers have not been shy about admitting that it’s about emissions, not efficiency.
The 4Runner TRD Pro is $55,000 in it's current generation. When the 6th gen comes out it will be $60,000 and there will most likely be a Trail Hunter edition that will be $63,000+. The LC250 will never be sold under the 4Runner so I'm expecting $68,000+. The current GX460 starts at $60,000 and the new GX550 will most likely start at $70,000. Maybe $75,000 for the Overtrail.
65-75 LC and 70-85 GX if both V6 IMO. A 4 in the LC would be the most retarded decision of all time.
Sorry, but why do you keep saying this? Looking at Australia they start at $45k USD. In Europe it looks even more. South Africa $66k. Where are these $35k markets?
You want a Land Cruiser to compete with that Italian hunk of crap Fiat Cherokee? Lol. I'd just as soon see Toyota just abandon the whole Land Cruiser line.
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If you’re not happy with these low price estimates check out some of the Reedit groups, they have the LC250 starting at $37.95 if you buy three at Walmart. Welcome to the LC250 Opium den.
Trust your first instincts, always. You were very close at $70K. The LC 250 is not going to be priced below the 4Runner. Trust me. I was on the lot three days ago and ORPs were priced at 53K and Ltd. and TRD Pros were just over $57K. Inflation is swelling prices as we speak. And the LC250 is not going to be priced at a 50% discount compared to EU prices. Should be pretty obvious. Non? Save up and be well. Cheers.
Very interesting that Toyota is releasing both the new FJ70 and LC250 contemporaneously into Japan. They must see very distinct markets for both of them. And when you consider that Japan has a population density six times that of the US, that means they see the FJ70 prospering in urban/suburban environments and not just rural ones.
I know you drive FJ100s and 300s, have you driven the modern FJ70? They are available in your market, right? Would be great to find at least one person in this place who has actually driven one. In any case, I will very keen to hear about the new FJ70 on Tuesday.
Yes, I actually also own a 2013 GRJ79. It is used mainly as a farm truck/to carry camping gear when we head out to the desert in winter.
I don't have any urge to upgrade to a newer model because no update since then really was worth upgrading for honestly, not even the diesel v8 ( perfectly happy with the 1GR).
I look forward to see what they offer for 2024 onwards, I don't think ill be upgrading anytime soon, but I am still very excited for the updates.
I still like the wagons more. However a 79 + wagon really compliment each other, especially on desert trips.
For the Station wagons (80/100/200/300). I would rank 100 as my all time favorite (mainly out of sentimental value and because I think the LC100 is the best looking land cruiser and because it is my favorite manual transmission LC to drive) - followed closely by the LC300 ( which is the best to drive in general (missing a manual only ).
See the 80 series looks old, the 60 series is a classic at this point, but the LC100 still has a relatively modern green house. Any non car guy would find it hard to believe the original is over 25 years old. I love timeless cars. The 80 drives old, the 100 series drives better than many modern cars. I can keep going till tomorrow.
I'll say this though, they keep patching up the 70 series, they eventually will need to replace the 70 from the ground up, the time will come, regulations are getting tougher even in the Middle East, how long can they go updating a almost 40 year old platform? I wonder honestly, but a 170 series would be nice sometime in the next 10-15 years...
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How do you know this? Have you driven one? I’d wager not.
Not gonna lie, it might be difficult convincing the 5.7 guys to go for a 4cyl LC.
The diehard 5.7 guys barely accept the 3.5 twin 6 on the 300/310.
Current Prado is less expensive than 4runner in every market I know of that they're sold together. They're basically the same price but slightly different. But that's both j150 models. And they're the same thing. So pricing the same makes sense. The new LC is a different animal. The new 4runner if it ever exists, might be different - we really have no idea what it'll be. If the old relationship holds then 4runner should be priced basically the same. Always has been between the two.
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