1st gen 4Runner vs Fzj80 for adventure rig (1 Viewer)

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Doakster

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Aug 16, 2021
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Silverthorne, CO
I’m at a bit of an impasse. I own a 1st gen 4Runner and a Fzj80 and I’m not sure which one I want to build to go do some crazy adventures.

So here’s what’s up. I really want to start doing some long distance overland/adventure trips. Central and South America type of trips. But here’s the catch, I’m not rich and I don’t have the looks that would get me Instagram famous/ sponsored. So that means I got to budget this thing. Currently I own a running Fzj80 and a non running 1st gen 4Runner. One would think, hey dumbass, go with the truck that runs… well, as many of you know, the LC gets s*** gas mileage and all of its parts are made from unicorn dust(aka expensive as s***).

The 4Runner gives me a unique opportunity to throw a 3RZ in the sucker and actually have some umph and get 20mpg. If I sold the LC I could build the s*** out of the 4Runner ( long travel, 33s, lockers, pop up topper, armor, nice seats).

But the LC in stock form does just as well, just needs a small lift and armor to be considered overland ready. The engine is pretty much good to go since I just put in a short block from Toyota.

I wouldn’t be rocking crawling during these trips, so the solid axle vs ifs is mute. I have a rtt on the LC which is really nice but doing a pop top in the 4Runner would be better incase of emergency. The 4Runner is manual, which I prefer but isn’t a deal breaker. I’ve done a couple overland trips around Colorado in the LC and I’ve been satisfied with how it preformed but I’ve always thought I could have done the exact same thing in the 4Runner for cheaper.

At this point, I’ve been thinking about which one to go with for a couple years and would be happy for someone to call me an idiot and tell me why which one is better from their experience.
 
i personally prefer the 4R. that being said, i would skip the 3RZ. the 5vz v6 is a much better swap. 3rz is notorious for head cracking.
 
gnob said:
i personally prefer the 4R. that being said, i would skip the 3RZ. the 5vz v6 is a much better swap. 3rz is notorious for head cracking.
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This
 
This is a great question and kind of compelling. Value-wise, the 4Runner may well come out ahead when gas is factored in.

I had a Tacoma with the 2.7L 3RZ-FE and did not like it very much. Power band was kind of peaky. The 22RE makes a lot less power, but in ways I prefer it to drive (even though it's very underpowered in a 4Runner, in my opinion).

If you aren't rockcrawling, I would probably prefer the torsion bar IFS over the solid axle. You do get a bit more space with the FZJ80. The 4Runner rear window setup is a liability, though. They definitely can go out or just be troublesome from time to time. Hard to beat the split hatch/tailgate setup of the Landcruisers.

If you wanted to do a totally new suspension setup anyway, then maybe the 3rd gen 4Runner with a long travel setup (as long as it didn't have the stupid LBJ issue) might make sense. That would get you the 5VZFE. I do think the 2nd gen 4Runners are pretty underrated if you don't need the removable/replaceable top.

I know the 4Runner can fit a single mattress in the back, if you want to sleep inside the rig. I'm not 100% sure on the Land Cruiser, but it is definitely a little wider.

I prefer manuals as well. If taking the Land Cruiser, definitely take care of, or be ready for the PHH (Pesky Heater Hose).

What kind of pop top were you thinking?
 
flx said:
How much fuel economy would you need to compensate the cost to build the 4R? Considering fuel price in South America?
Also, how long you need to build your non running 4R versus being ready to leave with the 80?
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I’m not going to leave for another 2 years. So I have enough time to do it right. And the money for the 4Runner build would come from selling the LC. Right now it feels like much of my budget is going to fixing my 300k mile landcruiser. Rebuilt the front axle twice, replaced the way over cost brake booster, the third members are going to need to be rebuilt soon. That said, the 4Runner is in the same shape, just everything is cheaper to work on.

I did a really rough calculation and doing the entire pan American highway in the 4Runner would save me somewhere around 2-3K in gas.

Something I ask myself a lot is, is the toughness of the LC worth the cost?
 
ozarkmud said:
This is a great question and kind of compelling. Value-wise, the 4Runner may well come out ahead when gas is factored in.

I had a Tacoma with the 2.7L 3RZ-FE and did not like it very much. Power band was kind of peaky. The 22RE makes a lot less power, but in ways I prefer it to drive (even though it's very underpowered in a 4Runner, in my opinion).

If you aren't rockcrawling, I would probably prefer the torsion bar IFS over the solid axle. You do get a bit more space with the FZJ80. The 4Runner rear window setup is a liability, though. They definitely can go out or just be troublesome from time to time. Hard to beat the split hatch/tailgate setup of the Landcruisers.

If you wanted to do a totally new suspension setup anyway, then maybe the 3rd gen 4Runner with a long travel setup (as long as it didn't have the stupid LBJ issue) might make sense. That would get you the 5VZFE. I do think the 2nd gen 4Runners are pretty underrated if you don't need the removable/replaceable top.

I know the 4Runner can fit a single mattress in the back, if you want to sleep inside the rig. I'm not 100% sure on the Land Cruiser, but it is definitely a little wider.

I prefer manuals as well. If taking the Land Cruiser, definitely take care of, or be ready for the PHH (Pesky Heater Hose).

What kind of pop top were you thinking?
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For better or worse I have a bit of an emotional connection with the 4Runner. I’ve owned it for 8 years, lived in it a couple times, traveled a bunch with it, touched just about every bolt on the stinking thing. So as much as I like the 3rd gens, I’m sticking with my 1st. Plus have you looked at 3rd gen prices? I live in Colorado and people think manual 3rd gens are worth their weight in gold. I would have to start selling feet pics to pay for those trucks.

I thought I saw a couple posts from ovrlnd campers on a 1st gen pop top that they did. Not sure if they still do. I’ve seen a couple people that have built toppers for their 1st gens and I’m just dangerous enough with tools that I think I could build my own. I have a GFC rtt if my LC that I really like so I would try to model one off of their design.

You are so right about the 22re. Way underpowered. I moved to the mountains of Colorado a few years ago and I can’t remember the last time I used 5th gear. It spent so much time at 4K revs and I think that’s what killed it. The 3RZ would help it out around here plus I’m trying to stick to the philosophy of “keep it simple stupid.” Keep the original trans, keep the engine bay roomy, and hopefully not break parts in the drive train.

Space is part of the debate. I work seasonally, so for part of the year I live out of my vehicle to keep costs down. I’ve weathered storms in both of them and the LC was much nicer by a huge margin. The rtt was a big game changer, not having to rearrange my stuff every night is such a stress reliever. That said, if I put a pop top on the 4Runner, I think that levels the playing field.
 
Wow, quite the history with yours. I loved my first gen IFS 4Runner while I had it. I had quite the adventure with it, even having never used the 4WD on it. I remember a lot of mountain passes doing 50 or less on the interstate with the 22RE. I think I still miss that one a bit.

How would you compare the engine bay difficulty of the 22RE vs the 1FZ? Do you think a V6 in the 22RE's space would be a lot worse to work on? You can definitely save some money on parts, even on the Land Cruiser, looking through Ebay and the cheaper sellers online like Toyota Parts Direct, McGeorge, Joejoe, etc. But it's just going to be a more expensive rig in general.

I do wonder if the extra engine bay space makes for a more maintable vehicle in the Land Cruiser. Being big enough to work in, while being big enough to fit a large enough motor.

It sounds like your heart is set on the 4Runner. If you do major changes to it, I'd definitely battle test it quite thoroughly, especially say long travel, before your pan America trip.

If you were edging towards the Land Cruiser, you could maybe do part time 4wd as a way to save on gas.
 
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@Doakster

Saving money is great and it makes sense, when that is your highest priority for your "adventure trips". But it sounds like your trips will be through parts of the world that are extremely remote and IMHO, those are places that you want to be riding in a rig that is overbuilt from the tires to the steering wheel. Lift kits and armor are attractive and may help for day trips and weekend "gnarly stuff" runs here in the "Lower 48", but are not so advantageous as they may seem for over-landing on existing roads. Remember, the 80 Series is a vehicle designed to hold up, stock, with minimum maintenance in those very parts of the world you'll be traveling through. That's not to say you can just head out on these adventures without some prep work. Every nut, bolt, joint and spec of every kind must be addressed and have your confidence to be ready. Any areas of doubt will not only weigh heavy on your mind, but can also leave you exposed to failure. Some armor can be of use for the unexpected, but keep it to a minimum, it adds up weight fast. Say, an ARB bull bar and winch. I'd go for an 8K winch with a snatch block to keep it as light as possible. Avoid skid plates and sliders since they add weight and the protection they provide shouldn't be needed as much as the weight savings. These next 2 items are worth their extra weight: I would add an auxillary fuel tank in the OEM spare spot, to avoid having to deal with jerry fuel cans. And a rear bumper with a spare swing-out that has a quality spindle and secure latch so the spindle doesn't carry the weight of the spare when latched. For over-landing, a lift would be IMHO, pretty much useless. I would imagine your springs are getting tired, so I'd get, for example, the OME stock height springs and shocks which will add an inch of lift, but with added bumpers and aux fuel tank, you should be about stock height. As far as tires, the stock 31s" will work fine, but I would go with 255/85/16 which are about 33" and will give you slightly better off road performance and not affect the stock gearing too much, negatively. Your fenders should clear 33" tires fine at stock height. AT vs MT is a matter of personal choice. Serious mud, you'll be glad for MT's, but the rest of the time you'll be glad for AT's, mainly for wear and noise. You'll be getting into the 3rd members for prep, rebuilding axles and that would be a perfect time to install 4.56 gears, which would bring it back to a stock feel for gearing (with 33" tires) and I would also install Harrop E-lockers both front and rear at that time (if you don't already have the "magic" dial and OEM E-lockers). Select-able E-lockers are the perfect traction adding option for the full time 80 series and some of the roads you'll experience, will need all the help you can muster. Also, if you don't have the CDL switch, I would highly recommend it along with the pin 7 mod. With both these installed, you can run CDL locked or unlocked in either high range or low range.
 
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I have an '83 Trailblazer, which is the precursor to the 1st gen 4runner, and I also have a '93 FZJ80. I love driving the 5 speed 22R. But the FZJ80 is much more comfortable during long trips and has considerably more interior space and cargo carrying capabilities than the '83. The '93 is also more capable with factory lockers. So as much as I like the '83, I prefer the '93 for overlanding.
 
You do have eclectic reasons behind all this but ill take a stab at it:

80 series would be better for long distance and the cargo capacity for the big trips BUT mpg is a problem as well as their current values make selling it off attractive. 80s are legendary for their reliability and were the go-to overlander before overlanding was cool for a reason.

1st gen would be more cramped for storage etc.. but will be more nimble and probably fly under the radar a little better. Swapping engines and doing big trips might be a bit of a risk the further you go from factory, every bolt/wire connection is crucial to get right but if you do it yourself you can rapid troubleshoot.

The earlier comment about something newer is well based in logic. You could conceivably sell the 80 and be in 2nd gen Tacoma or 4th gen 4runner territory with money for mods depending on the condition of your 80. I have a 2nd gen runner I don't mind camping out of at all and had an 80 for a while but its offroad/cost limitations led me to build a solid axle 2nd gen that checks all my boxes.

gnob said:
i personally prefer the 4R. that being said, i would skip the 3RZ. the 5vz v6 is a much better swap. 3rz is notorious for head cracking.
Click to expand...
So I'll 3rd this.
 
Doakster said:
The 4Runner gives me a unique opportunity to throw a 3RZ in the sucker and actually have some umph and get 20mpg. If I sold the LC I could build the s*** out of the 4Runner ( long travel, 33s, lockers, pop up topper, armor, nice seats).
Click to expand...
I'd keep the old 4Runner (or sell both old rigs and get a newer one) and not build the crap out of it. You won't need long travel or 33's. Keep it simple, take Gnob's advice on the engine swap.
 
I’ve had both, and still have an 86 4-runner (22RE). Probably one of the best motors ever made. That said, I can in no way imagine making that a long term adventure rig. Some do, and that’s awesome, but I would need a little more comfort and maybe space. I think newer platforms are going to be good in many cases. Part availability etc….. (though 22RE parts are still pretty accessible). I’m in the process of getting a first gen Tacoma with a shell and downgrading my 4Runner to date-nite show off truck. The taco will be outfitted for trips and camping. I agree with some earlier posts. I don’t think you need armor everywhere. I do advocate for mild lift and 33s. A winch is nice and will be going on my rig maybe one day, but primary concerns should be mechanical maintenance up to date, great tires, and comfort of storage and sleeping. A Chinese diesel heater will be installed in the bed of the Tacoma.

If I picked between the 2. LC all the way, I miss my LC so much. But selling both and finding a platform that hits all your checkboxes could be an idea. For me, it’s almost always going to be a truck with a cap. But that’s just preference. I’d love a really nice 60 …. Just for the coolness factor. The 4 runners are awesome, but living out of one for a while wouldn’t be for me personally.
 
I had an 85 4Runner before I bought my 80. I kept both for a while before getting tired of not having enough garage space and ended up selling the 4Runner. Having driven both across the country and doing multiple camping trips I have zero regrets sticking with my 80. Driver fatigue on long trips in my 4Runner was real, but I suppose an 86+ with IFS might solve part of that.
 
Honestly, it depends on what you are going for. For most people, they'd be best off just buying a stock, off-the-shelf vehicle new (or lightly used) and ensuring they simply keep the weight down with gear, and go off for the adventure. Budget-wise, you'll probably be better off as well, when everything is considered. But of course you'll see countless people "overlanding" in Defenders, huge trucks (Mann/Steyr), or even UNIMOGs. Do they do it for reliability? Though they may hide behind that pretense, it's usually because they either have a personal affection for that vehicle, some childhood dream of traveling the world in a ______, or perhaps more likely because they need the exposure on social media to help fund their travels.
Honestly, the more time you spend building, preparing, etc. for your trip the less likely you are to simply go for your trip. Find something that's a happy medium - a compromise, essentially, as everything in life is a compromise - and travel.

---

I'm saying all this in a privileged position, having two beautiful 70-series. Both were purchased at prices I was comfortable with, and both are very low-mileage, rust-free, expedition-ready vehicles. On Ali, I did install a rooftop tent for luxury, but otherwise my setup is entirely stock. I could choose a less expensive rooftop tent or even a ground tent and still have all these epic adventures. On Ozzi, very much the same applies. In both cases I spent very little time preparing for travel, and much more time traveling. :) That's the ultimate goal.
 
Sell your 4runner and use it for gas money
 
building your rig is half the run. That said, the above is a great point. A newer Tacoma with a camper shell would be hard to beat IMO unless you are hauling multiple people. I’m biased. I just got a 2001 taco with a camper shell and love it. Even then with 33” tires and a fiberglass shell and small 2” lift I was only getting 18.5 on the highway. Probably a few things I could do to change that. But the point stands….. gas is a factor. That wasn’t your question though. I regret selling my 80 every time I see one. It was honestly perfect other than the fuel consumption and my constant fear of the HG going (FZJ). I will likely keep this taco forever and finish fixing up and sell my 4-runner to finance a 60 project. But just for fun and tooling about. NOT for cross country travel. But some people do and love it. I’m 43 and need comfort.
 
Explorer4Hire said:
building your rig is half the run. That said, the above is a great point. A newer Tacoma with a camper shell would be hard to beat IMO unless you are hauling multiple people. I’m biased. I just got a 2001 taco with a camper shell and love it. Even then with 33” tires and a fiberglass shell and small 2” lift I was only getting 18.5 on the highway. Probably a few things I could do to change that. But the point stands….. gas is a factor. That wasn’t your question though. I regret selling my 80 every time I see one. It was honestly perfect other than the fuel consumption and my constant fear of the HG going (FZJ). I will likely keep this taco forever and finish fixing up and sell my 4-runner to finance a 60 project. But just for fun and tooling about. NOT for cross country travel. But some people do and love it. I’m 43 and need comfort.
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4runner is small. Lot more to the 80. Before you start your overland, take on a second side hustle to save up some gas money.
 
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