1KZTE - fast crank, no start, new spill control valve didn’t fix it (3 Viewers)

[armstrong486]

Hey guys - 1996 Prado 1KZ-TE
Day 1 - it cranked pretty quick but would start til after 3 tries
Day 2 -started up no problem drove to work, and left work, but when I parked at the post office, it took 20 min of cranking to start.
Day 3 - just does a fast crank but won’t start

Replaced the spill control valve relay
Replaced the spill control valve itself
Still no start, just cranking

Before I replace the injector pump, any ideas?

 

[KiwiBogan]

Are your glow plugs working? And are you using them? This can make a bit of a difference, even in warmer climates.

 

[armstrong486]

Are your glow plugs working? And are you using them? This can make a bit of a difference, even in warmer climates.

That’s what I thought initially when it did it on the cold start. But when it did it again after 45 min of driving, I figured it’s a fuel issue

 

[KiwiBogan]

That’s what I thought initially when it did it on the cold start. But when it did it again after 45 min of driving, I figured it’s a fuel issue

I've read of cases where a fuel line air leak allows the fuel to drain back down to the tanks when the car isn't in use so the engine has to crank a while till the fuel is sucked back up to the injector pump. Specifically the leak occurs at the fuel filter primer pump housing and can be as small as a pin hole.

Maybe check for obvious leaks in the fuel lines first? Pump the manual primer till it's hard, wait a while and come back and see if it's still hard or if it's softened up (suggesting a leak might be present). If there's a leak, maybe replace the fuel filter and primer pump housing (cheap thing to try). I would go and buy some new rubber fuel hose as well just to be sure for in between the filter and the injector pump. The internal lining on old fuel hose can become weak and suck closed blocking fuel delivery. It's rare but if the hoses are 25+ years old, possible.

See how ya go with those things.

 

[aeroelastic]

Mine took a few cranks to start but not 20mins. Found the fuel tank pick up tubes (top of fuel tank) corroded and was leaking air in. So fuel leak back to tank once engine turned off. Worth checking

 

[armstrong486]

Mine took a few cranks to start but not 20mins. Found the fuel tank pick up tubes (top of fuel tank) corroded and was leaking air in. So fuel leak back to tank once engine turned off. Worth checking

I don’t think that’s it. When it did start, it ran perfectly. Perfect idle, perfect driving…it’s something on startup that either works or doesn’t if that makes sense. If it was something that made it run poorly I think I’d be on the right track with that. But at this point it’s not starting at all

 

[aeroelastic]

I don’t think that’s it. When it did start, it ran perfectly. Perfect idle, perfect driving…it’s something on startup that either works or doesn’t if that makes sense. If it was something that made it run poorly I think I’d be on the right track with that. But at this point it’s not starting at all

Mine once started also run freely, with the fuel pipe air leak. Its easy to check, stick your phone pointing at the 3 hoses that come out from top of fuel tank, use flash. Will be obvious if corroded. At least to rule out…

 

[JDM Journeys]

My 70 series also suffered from the rusty pickup. Usually though that manifests in white smoke esp at start until the air is purged...

But... Not a bad idea to eliminate the possibility. Clear fuel line temporarily between IP and fuel filter will quickly tell the tale. Air bubbles are hard to miss...

 

[ibsanou]

Hi all,
My 95 Prado JDM import does the same same thing (cranks till the batteries dies) only when it it below 30 dregres F. I heard I might need an engine or block heater. Anyone here having the same issues during cold weather? Or using some type of heater? And yes my glow plugs are working.

 

[KiwiBogan]

Hmm.... 30°F (0°c) isn't very cold for an engine I don't think? Diesel fuel turns gelatinous at -6°c (probably slightly colder if it's sitting in pipes and a tank?) and oil is usually good for much lower temps. So assuming the fuel isn't turning to gel and the oil is still good, the symptoms sound like the classic sticky spill control valve problem myself and a few other around the web have had.

How long are you glowing your plugs before turning the engine over?

 

[ibsanou]

Hmm.... 30°F (0°c) isn't very cold for an engine I don't think? Diesel fuel turns gelatinous at -6°c (probably slightly colder if it's sitting in pipes and a tank?) and oil is usually good for much lower temps. So assuming the fuel isn't turning to gel and the oil is still good, the symptoms sound like the classic sticky spill control valve problem myself and a few other around the web have had.

How long are you glowing your plugs before turning the engine over?

The glow plugs light is off in 5 seconds or less.
Do you have the part number of the spill control? I can try that.

 

[JDM Journeys]

Assuming your glow system is in good order, the 1KZ-TE should start at much colder temps without any assist, even if it has a little more smoke than usual until it's been going for a bit.

I'd leave it glowing longer. After the light goes out, add some more time on with the key forward before you crank it. Count the seconds and you'll find the optimum glow. When its colder, the light is not on long enough, in my experience.

With a strong battery, synth oil and new glow plugs, I could start mine in -30*C without being plugged in. It wasn't always happy with me, but it always started. But I usally counted five seconds or so (depending on temps) after the light turned off before starting.

Winter diesel's gel point is quite a bit lower. A cetane additive is also a good idea. And changing the fuel filter in the fall has always served me well....

 

[KiwiBogan]

The glow plugs light is off in 5 seconds or less.
Do you have the part number of the spill control? I can try that.

The glow plug light isnt an accurate indicator of when it's ready I don't believe.

Try 10 seconds (minimum) with the glow plugs. 5 seconds is barely enough I find and it's summer where I am ATM (with a newly rebuilt engine). Maybe even two lots of 10 seconds just to troubleshoot if 10 seconds isn't enough. If you're battery isn't cranking strong after glowing the plugs for 10 seconds, your battery might be getting tired or is not strong enough (not enough CCA's). Could also be the battery is being effected by the cold. I've heard freezing temps can suck the life out of lithium batteries but don't know if that effects lead acid batteries the same?

I don't have a part number for the SCV but it's the cylindrical looking thing screwed in at the top/ back of the inj pump with two wires coming out the top of it. Have a look at this:

 

[JDM Journeys]

Yep, cold affects your cranking amps for sure. And if you have a bad cell, it usually shows up at the worst time. LOL.

Here's an example of battery versus cold. Of course this depends on your battery chemistry etc, but call it a "generalization".

If you're someone who needs empirical data to know how long you should glow, throw a multimeter on the system and watch how long it glows, and then "afterglows". This varies with temp too. If you have an assistant watching the light at the same time, then you'll get an even better idea of what the Kiwi and the Canadian are saying...

 

[KiwiBogan]

Yep, cold affects your cranking amps for sure. And if you have a bad cell, it usually shows up at the worst time. LOL.

Here's an example of battery versus cold. Of course this depends on your battery chemistry etc, but call it a "generalization".
View attachment 3552888

If you're someone who needs empirical data to know how long you should glow, throw a multimeter on the system and watch how long it glows, and then "afterglows". This varies with temp too. If you have an assistant watching the light at the same time, then you'll get an even better idea of what the Kiwi and the Canadian are saying...

Ahh interesting! Thankfully very rarely do we get frosts where we are in the Winter, so I haven't had to deal with it. Gets very close to 0°c overnight in the Winter though. And come to think of it, my cranking does sound laboured, though I just thought it was the oil becoming a bit higher in viscosity due to the cold. Be interesting to run some tests with this. Maybe wrap the starter battery with an old towel or blanket, make it a hot chocolate in the morning (jokes ) but see if wrapping it up with something improves the starting performance. A lot of folk from colder climates would be interested to know the results I reckon.

 

[JDM Journeys]

I've always opined that dumping heat around a battery is much better served by injecting it straight into the chemistry so rather than blankets I've used a low amp trickle charger when real cold (in addition to water jacket heater). Less draw and works better from what I've seen.

But you know what they say about opinions.