Wire connectors under starter - 1989 FJ 62 (1 Viewer)

[SeattleFJ62]

Hello all, FJ62 starts cold perfectly, and I can hear the relays and fuel pump working. After driving it for more than half hour and then stopping for 30-40 minutes (run into store, etc.) it then doesn't start unless you let it sit for another 30-40 minutes. I've checked the items mentioned on other threads - battery/starter/alternator are all good. I suspect something stemming from these wires/connectors under the starter (lower right corner of the photo), two round and two squarish - they get lots of vibration/engine heat and are the original wires - does anyone know what systems they support? I could not figure it out from the Toyota repair manual. I cleaned them up with electrical cleaner and removed the electrical tape. 3FE engine, stock FJ62.

Thanks in advance for any help!

 

[Seth S]

Does the starter just click once when it’s hot?

 

[cruisermatt]

Those are the NSS and reverse lights. If your engine cranks then they aren’t your issue at all.

 

[SeattleFJ62]

Does the starter just click once when it’s hot?

No, I can hear the relay click and the fuel pump start, but the starter doesn't move - can't even hear the plunger move (and it's a newer starter) - banging the starter with a broom handle doesn't help.

 

[bullsheadcruiser]

Does the starter just click once when it’s hot?

I am actually having the very same problem with my '89 FJ62. Just replaced all the spark plug cables to the distributor cap at a mechanic's suggestion as it was misfiring. The old cable were shot and two of the contacts stayed attached to the plugs when I pulled the boot off. With the new cables it runs super smooth again - aaaaahhhh. My intermittent starting problem is the same as @SeattleFJ62 in that it clicks once and then nothing. I was able to start it earlier today by wiggling this wire but on my second run into town it wouldn't start - just clicked each time. I disconnected and reconnected the wire several times but could still only get the click. One observation is that prior to replacing the spark plug cables I had intermittent starting issues where there was no click from the starter but disconnecting the two bigger connectors showing in @SeattleFJ62 's photo and reconnecting them, it would start just fine. Now I get a click, which I used not to get prior to the new spark plug cables.

 

[Seth S]

I am actually having the very same problem with my '89 FJ62. Just replaced all the spark plug cables to the distributor cap at a mechanic's suggestion as it was misfiring. The old cable were shot and two of the contacts stayed attached to the plugs when I pulled the boot off. With the new cables it runs super smooth again - aaaaahhhh. My intermittent starting problem is the same as @SeattleFJ62 in that it clicks once and then nothing. I was able to start it earlier today by wiggling this wire but on my second run into town it wouldn't start - just clicked each time. I disconnected and reconnected the wire several times but could still only get the click. One observation is that prior to replacing the spark plug cables I had intermittent starting issues where there was no click from the starter but disconnecting the two bigger connectors showing in @SeattleFJ62 's photo and reconnecting them, it would start just fine. Now I get a click, which I used not to get prior to the new spark plug cables.

It is very common for the solenoid trigger wires to age and suffer a greater voltage drop. You can run new wires for this circuit or simply install a new fender mount relay with heavier wires to the solenoid and then use the current starter wires to trigger the new relay.

 

[ToyotaMatt]

Hello all, FJ62 starts cold perfectly, and I can hear the relays and fuel pump working. After driving it for more than half hour and then stopping for 30-40 minutes (run into store, etc.) it then doesn't start unless you let it sit for another 30-40 minutes. I've checked the items mentioned on other threads - battery/starter/alternator are all good. I suspect something stemming from these wires/connectors under the starter (lower right corner of the photo), two round and two squarish - they get lots of vibration/engine heat and are the original wires - does anyone know what systems they support? I could not figure it out from the Toyota repair manual. I cleaned them up with electrical cleaner and removed the electrical tape. 3FE engine, stock FJ62.

Thanks in advance for any help!

View attachment 3039154

this usually solves a bad starter SOLONOID issue .........

ALL my new starters come with a OEM SOLONOID 10ga pigtail

factory fit form and function ........

VintageTEqParts.com

vintageteqparts.com

 

[ToyotaMatt]

 

[John McVicker]

@Seth S in post 6 has your answer. $10 relay, a bit of wiring and your problem is immediately solved.

 

[bullsheadcruiser]

@Seth S in post 6 has your answer. $10 relay, a bit of wiring and your problem is immediately solved.

View attachment 3057097

It looks to me as if my signal wire goes downwards to the connectors/harness underneath the engine. As you suggesting that harness on side the wiper motor is where it ends up?

 

[John McVicker]

That was just a good place to mount the relay.

 

[John McVicker]

The relay is getting its power directly from the battery, so in essence, the starter solenoid is also getting its power directly from the battery instead of the very old, worn out wiring harness. More power directly to the starter solenoid and varoom!

 

[bullsheadcruiser]

This is great, but are you suggesting using a clip like that to make your own solenoid pig tail wire? Are you able to either show or explain how to connect the loose end of the pig tail into the main harness? The harness is wrapped with a mile of tape so I have no idea what is in there. Thanks

 

[bullsheadcruiser]

@Seth S in post 6 has your answer. $10 relay, a bit of wiring and your problem is immediately solved.

View attachment 3057097

Thanks and from the look of it Seth S's suggestion that you posted such a clear picture of is the way to go. I see the black wire is a ground but where to the others go to exactly? Where does the black cable cover shown go/come from? Sorry to be dim but I'm very much an amateur if you couldn't tell already! Do I pick up a relay at an Advance Auto or Napa type place?

 

[ToyotaMatt]

This is great, but are you suggesting using a clip like that to make your own solenoid pig tail wire? Are you able to either show or explain how to connect the loose end of the pig tail into the main harness? The harness is wrapped with a mile of tape so I have no idea what is in there. Thanks

- you would simply CUT OFF the current 40+ year old Female spade connector ONLT 1-2" inches back to be clear NO MORE , the large 12-14ga OEM black wire white tracer stripe to be klear from your key switch directly , the HOME RUN

- my pigtail is a Upgrade / update 10ga AWG so it's better conductor


- i know some folks are hell bent on soldering everything ?


- but , ALL my repair pigtails come with these :

- 3-M crimp / adhesive lined , marine grade heat shring BUTT connectors , NOTHING is better quality then these hands down , water proof when cured , and a mechanical bond from glue and super conductor tinned copper core .....


- heat with hair dryer or low temp. heat gun ONLY


-

 

[ToyotaMatt]

Tech step by steps below :​

 

[ToyotaMatt]

 

[John McVicker]

Thanks and from the look of it Seth S's suggestion that you posted such a clear picture of is the way to go. I see the black wire is a ground but where to the others go to exactly? Where does the black cable cover shown go/come from? Sorry to be dim but I'm very much an amateur if you couldn't tell already! Do I pick up a relay at an Advance Auto or Napa type place?

You are are at the mercy of my fading memory as I did this 7 yrs ago and have since sold that Cruiser so I can’t a look. Buy the relay @ Napa or similar, don’t get a cheap one. The black cover is just that, not necessary but a good idea for protection & to be tidy.

If memory serves this is how I wired mine. Use whatever color you want, but do use the gauge suggested. My picture shows 4 different colors of wires. Yellow, red, green & black. A 4 pin relay is numbered 30, 85, 86, 87.

Unplug your wire from the starter solenoid. That’s your trigger, it gets power when you turn the key to start. 14g is fine this wire will connect to 86. Then attach a new 14g wire to that same attachment point you unplugged & connect to 87. Then run a new 12g wire to positive side of you battery & connect to 30. Then a new 14g wire to ground & connect to 85.

In my picture it is as follows.

30. Yellow 12g WITH A IN LINE FUSE to positive side of battery. USE THE IN LINE FUSE.
85. Black 14g to a good ground
86. Red 14g connect to the WIRE you unplugged (trigger)
87 Green 14g connect back to the ACTUAL solenoid

So there is always power to the relay via yellow wire and why you MUST have an in line fuse. This power will go nowhere until you trigger it with the key via 86 and then it opens up 87 and gives FULL power DIRECTLY from the battery to the starter. Varoom!

Here is a pic I picked up online. It’s describing Lights…in your case it will be your Starter.

There you go. It sounds intimidating for a novice but it’s actually very simple. Good luck.

 

[Spook50]

This is an issue of heat soak in the starter. I've had this problem several times. The solenoid has such tight internal clearances that even the slightest metal expansion from heat causes it to temporarily seize, preventing the starter from engaging. A weak battery can also compound this issue. In my case the problem went away completely when I replaced my 8 year-old Optima back in 2017, and then started coming back last summer when the battery I replaced it with ran low and reached the end of its life. Now with a high CA rated AGM battery I've had no problems in the few hot days we've had so far this summer. When it would happen with me I would have no choice but to open the hood and cool the starter before it would engage again. Carrying a handheld fan helped some.

On the starter side of things, a rebuild and thorough cleaning will very likely fix the issue, but a new starter would be a more sure-fire long term solution; however only on an older starter. With yours being fairly new I suspect your primary issue is power coming to it. First fix I would do is a cable upgrade. Did it on my rig nearly 15 years ago and it was a big help. New ground cables and new primary positive lead to the starter.

 

[Seth S]

This is an issue of heat soak in the starter. I've had this problem several times. The solenoid has such tight internal clearances that even the slightest metal expansion from heat causes it to temporarily seize, preventing the starter from engaging. A weak battery can also compound this issue. In my case the problem went away completely when I replaced my 8 year-old Optima back in 2017, and then started coming back last summer when the battery I replaced it with ran low and reached the end of its life. Now with a high CA rated AGM battery I've had no problems in the few hot days we've had so far this summer. When it would happen with me I would have no choice but to open the hood and cool the starter before it would engage again. Carrying a handheld fan helped some.

On the starter side of things, a rebuild and thorough cleaning will very likely fix the issue, but a new starter would be a more sure-fire long term solution; however only on an older starter. With yours being fairly new I suspect your primary issue is power coming to it. First fix I would do is a cable upgrade. Did it on my rig nearly 15 years ago and it was a big help. New ground cables and new primary positive lead to the starter.

First time I experienced a starter click with a hot car was with my 1975 Saab 99 because the starter was located under the headers. I replaced the starter over and over again each one warranted and it solved the problem for a few months and always came back. In the end an old school Saab tech set me up with the fender mount starter relay and I never had another hot start problem again.