Why do a head gasket as preventative maintenance?

[bhsdriller]

I plan on keeping my cruiser till i die. Mine is using oil at a rate of 1 quart every 3 or 4 tanks of gas. I am going to go ahead and do a top end rebuild that should last me the rest of my life. I have 225k on my truck and don't see putting another 200k on it.

Mine burns about the same but still runs perfect. Just took it to Moab and back ~13 hour drive each way.

I don't mind just adding oil now but it is annoying lol
I'll do a valve job/head gasket eventually

 

[nodor]

Thank you for all the replies.

A car fax report might show some maintenance history.

I have a CarFax that only shows regular oil and oil filter changes. There are some large mileage gaps in between some of them but I suspect it may have just not been recorded. Nothing else major.

If you want peace of mind, replace the whole cooling system, flush but with no pressure, add a ScanGauge or UltraGauge, and watch the temps.

Unknown but clearly poor maintenance history of my 80. Had a new radiator but plenty of crud in cooling system leading me to believe it could have been run hot previously.

This is what concerns me. The fan clutch and radiator were replaced by previous owner. There was however a bunch of crud in the cooling system when I got it. I have flushed the system with ThermoCure and replaced with Toyota red since I've had it. So far it seems to be maintaining the coolant level. I have a ScanGauge mounted at the A-pillar and I watch temps like a hawk. It usually sits around 184-186 and occasionally gets up to 190 when RPMs are low. I have yet to really put the truck through its paces though.

Regular oil analysis may be something you want to invest into

I've done one so far. Only abnormal result was high aluminum. No coolant in the oil.

 

[smritte]

There's a good reason why the factory has a "Preventative Maintenance" list. Do we not change oil hoping the engine will be fine? Most cars have no problem running 120k plus on a timing belt. PM says change at 70k -90k.

Some things like headgaskets are not usually on that list. We know how long they can last and that's what everyone talks about, how far they went not how fast they wore out. Everything has a life span, most will push it until it dies.

My take was this, I did it as soon as I could when I got the truck at 240k. I also knew most of my gaskets and seals were beyond their life span. Resealed the engine. My compression was "within spec". I didn't have to re-ring it but I did and my compression got better and I stopped consuming oil. Timing chain guides were worn also.

At the shop, a customer would run something past its projected life span and brag how well it did. When it breaks they complain its a POS and they shouldn't have to put money into it. Their next complaint is all the other things we need to replace because because those parts are beyond the life span.

Do it and whatever else you can while your in there. Save having to tear it down again later for oil leaks, chain rattle..........

 

[yknot123]

One of the most discussed topics. Reason for joining IH8MUD myself.

Some great points and understanding of Toyota land cruisers. The Benefit of having a community like IH8MUD is that this topic was discussed, documented, supported etc years ago. This has helped many new and old 80 owners continue rolling.

Different view. Our HG leaked and gurgled us home after a long day of skiing and my son driving down from the mountains for the first. Very uneasy feeling when the engine slows down and then hiccups to get going. Lucky being a land cruiser we hiccuped to the alley without overheating. Two months later outside in the winter it ran again.
Best thing to happen at 276 K

I had the great pleasure of working with Onur and bought the complete Head gasket kit. Plus some additional parts Onur is well versed.

My over all take is that not only is the HG a good thing but also all the hose's, filters, belts, etc that make the 80 last 300K.
New baseline on everything at 300k made the truck better than ever.

Head Gasket, hoses, fluids, grease, gas cap o ring, oil cap o ring, all what I have found is worth while to slowly or immediately replace. Basically anything rubber.
Why do this must work? It is easy, cheaper than a car payment, more satisfying, and looks good when you open the hood.
Oh yeah, Dad is gonna get the 80 back from the kids for the next 200k, that's why.

Thanks for everyone's help and input for the IH8MUD community. To the early community a nod of appreciation.

 

[retrofive]

One thing to keep in mind, they did re-design the head gasket for a reason.... so if yours in original.......

 

[flintknapper]

Mine is a 97. Very well maintained. At 260k miles, I noticed a slight miss and a momentary hesitation upon startup one day. Not hugely noticeable, but it did feel abnormal. I commuted daily almost a hundred miles round trip. Drove fine for the whole run home. Ran fine for the next several days. Didn’t think much of it. I have an ultra gauge, so watched the temps like a hawk. Zero cooling issues. About a week later, I went to start my truck while it was in a low clearance underground parking garage. The engine was fully frozen. Turned out I hydro locked #6. HG breached on the fire ring.

To each their own, but I’m of the opinion that past 250k miles, you’re living on borrowed time. But really, to expect a HG to last more that 250k miles seems ambitions. Everything has a service life. 250k miles seems pretty reasonable to me.

Agree with this. An engine doesn't have to overheat to 'pop' a head gasket. I got my Land Cruiser when it was 3 years old and have maintained it very well. It has never overheated. I agree that the cooling should ALWAYS be kept in tip-top shape and that overheating is good way to contribute to the demise of the gasket, but the OEM gasket is going to fail at some point.

Yes, mine went 316K before needing replacement, but that tends to beat the odds if you look at typical failures and mileage.

 

[Irish Reiver]

I did my '96 with 265K last month and also did all of the "while your in there" jobs. This truck had little service history so now I have a truck that has for all intent and purposes is fully restored and good for another 250k miles. The actual HG portion of the process is reasonably simple so for grins and giggles i just pulled the head of the '94. It only has 186k on the clock but i remember something about the 93 & 94's having a modification to the HG due a less than stellar version being fitted at the time of build.
The 94 had no additional jobs (all done previously) so pretty affordable and now this truck is also good for another 250k of worry free driving.

 

[spmarfatia]

someone spoke that during the production, HG was changed.

when speak of different versions of HG, anyone knows which models had the newer/changed version?

 

[DARKNESS]

I waited for mine to fail. It wasn't terrible. Just noticed it slowly losing coolant. I would guess the odds of a catastrophic failure are low if you keep an eye on it. The problem I had was mine is a daily driver so it was a pain to find someone I trusted to do it quickly. The guys who do a good job have decent waiting lists. Looking back I probably should have just done it preemptively.

 

[nodor]

I waited for mine to fail. It wasn't terrible. Just noticed it slowly losing coolant. I would guess the odds of a catastrophic failure are low if you keep an eye on it. The problem I had was mine is a daily driver so it was a pain to find someone I trusted to do it quickly. The guys who do a good job have decent waiting lists. Looking back I probably should have just done it preemptively.

I see you're in Golden, CO. I will be moving to the Denver area in July. If I choose to have it done as preventative maintenance after the move anyone you would recommend that can do it quickly? The truck is my daily driver and if I have it done now where I currently live chances are it won't be ready by the time we're moving.

 

[ajordan1975]

I wouldn't worry till it needs it unless you have a lot of money just burning a hole in your pocket...

 

[subzali]

I see you're in Golden, CO. I will be moving to the Denver area in July. If I choose to have it done as preventative maintenance after the move anyone you would recommend that can do it quickly? The truck is my daily driver and if I have it done now where I currently live chances are it won't be ready by the time we're moving.

You could probably get on Robbie's aka Adventure Offroad schedule, but I understand it's a long wait list. Once he has your truck though it's possible it could be done fairly quickly. Might depend some on machine shop wait times.

 

[Irish Reiver]

I wouldn't worry till it needs it unless you have a lot of money just burning a hole in your pocket...

Do you use that theory for all your other maintenence needs? Bit short sighted i think.

 

[desmocruiser]

I have a 1997 80 series with 271k miles on it and to my knowledge, original head gasket. I purchased the truck not long ago with 265k miles. The previous owner had it for a little over a year and did not have any maintenance history prior to him purchasing it. All fluids have been drained and refilled. Radiator replaced. Oil leaks fixed including oil pump, crank seal, valve cover gasket, and distributor. It has a slow leak from the oil pan arch seal. I get an occasional P0401 that I haven't spent much time chasing down yet. Other than that it runs great. Have a recent oil analysis that shows high aluminum but otherwise completely normal. Have yet to do a repeat analysis to see if the high aluminum is consistent. Planning to have it compression tested soon.

My question is, assuming the compression testing is normal, is there any reason to consider a head gasket replacement and rebuild as preventative maintenance? Or just keep driving it until I'm forced to do something? Also how might I be able to tell if the head gasket has been replaced previously since there's no detailed maintenance history prior to the previous owner?

My concern is that I will be using the truck for long trips and may have it in places where it may be impossible to get a tow truck to. I've read a few threads and there doesn't seem to be a general consensus. I would like to wait if its reasonable to do so. I guess what I'm looking for is reassurance, or for enough people to tell me I should so that I change my mind.

The debate of whether to do as PM or not has been going on for some time, really comes down to what you are willing to pay for piece of mind or risk during your adventures.

My opinion is if you are going to open up that Pandora's box, just open up the wallet and do everything connected to, some are even doing short blocks as for many, these trucks are lifers!

If you want to know more about your trucks history, go to Toyota.com, sign up, and register your VIN and you will see the original build specs for your rig as well as most of the services performed at the dealership.

Good luck, enjoy, awesome rigs!!!

 

[DARKNESS]

I see you're in Golden, CO. I will be moving to the Denver area in July. If I choose to have it done as preventative maintenance after the move anyone you would recommend that can do it quickly? The truck is my daily driver and if I have it done now where I currently live chances are it won't be ready by the time we're moving.

Robbie is the gold standard. He has a decent wait, at least when I checked, but if you got on his list now I bet you'd be ok by July. I used a guy named Ben who works out of his garage in Castle Rock. He did a great job and turned it around pretty quick for me. I seem to remember both of them were hesitant to do head gaskets as PM. They were both good to talk to though, doesn't hurt to reach out and get opinions. They've seen the inside of alot of 80's.

 

[NeverFinis]

The headgasket discussion is always an interesting one to me. On most other vehicles, headgaskets, main bearings, and everything in between would be toast by 300k. No question. So I think there needs to be a little more perspective when people here say LCs notoriously blow headgaskets. By that metric, every vehicle notoriously blows headgaskets because most don't even make it past 200k without cooling system failures, etc.

I strongly disagree. People need to understand that modern cars are extremely reliable and not like they were up through the 90s. If you got a car to 100K miles in the 70s, that was considered fantastic, if you got an 80s car to 150K miles, that was decent...we have come a long way since then.

200K miles is easy for a well maintained vehicle made in the last 20 years. My wife's 2007 Ford Fusion went to 350K before we traded it in and we only traded it in because I was able to buy a new $43K Volt for $20K. That Ford Duratec V6 engine at 350K ran just like the day we bought it. Didn't burn oil. HG never needed to be done. Just changed oil, filters, spark plugs and coolant. It never even had a check engine light its entire time!

My current commuter car is a 2010 Ford Focus with 180K miles. Engine runs just as well as the day I bought it. Plugs were done at 100K miles, and they are due to be replaced at 200K miles. I have yet to do any engine work on any Ford that I have owned in the last 20 years with 800,000 miles spread across them all. I think I have had one check engine light in those 800,000 miles and it was a bad sensor on a 2000 Ford Taurus.

I don't even know what a Ford head gasket looks like. much less a Ford crank or rod bearing.

I can tell you what a Toyota Head Gasket of a 1FZ-FE or a 22RE looks like though. I have torn down both engine families multiple times.

I have put about 500,000 miles on older Toyotas and I have had multiple HG failures all between 90K and 125K miles (4Runners and LX450).

Yes, FZJ80/LX450 does have a HG problem. It is ok to admit that... A ton of other makes had HG problems in the 90s as well.

I am redoing my 1996 LX450, and I will be doing a complete engine rebuild, including a new HG, but if it was possible , I would replace the 1FZ-FE with a 7.3L Godzilla motor in a heart beat, if it could fit... lol

 

[subzali]

Robbie is the gold standard. He has a decent wait, at least when I checked, but if you got on his list now I bet you'd be ok by July. I used a guy named Ben who works out of his garage in Castle Rock. He did a great job and turned it around pretty quick for me. I seem to remember both of them were hesitant to do head gaskets as PM. They were both good to talk to though, doesn't hurt to reach out and get opinions. They've seen the inside of alot of 80's.

Ben Ashcraft is a solid option too. Both he and Robbie are long-time Rising Sun guys.

 

[bencallaway]

What size lift do I need to fit 35’s?

Seriously though, only you can answer the question as it’s based on your own tolerance. You can do it yourself for under $2k. The popular cruiser shop in Atlanta wants something north of $8k to do it for you last I heard, don’t quote me on that.

Mine went at 225 about 45 minutes from home. It wasn’t a big deal to limp it home but it wasn’t fun either. I was in the camp of people talk too much about hg’s on mud but I get it now. There’s an active thread here now about a guy who had his throttle body and upper intake off and the consensus was to go ahead and do the HG. Couple more hours and the head was off. It’s not a tough job.

Do it if you want. Don’t if you don’t. There’s your answer.

 

[midfat]

 

[ajordan1975]

Do you use that theory for all your other maintenence needs? Bit short sighted i think.

HG’a are something that obviously can, but doesn’t always fail. If everything is running well. Enjoy it till it needs to be replaced.