What Tranny behind 4BDT in FJ40 and other questions..

[twoturtlesracing]

Rhino just responded to a question I had in his thread linked to above about R150/R151's His answer:

no problem buddy,,,

the overall length is 42" (back of the isuzu to the driveshaft mounting surface of tcase)
the tranny itself is 26" with AA bellhousing and adaptor

everything i read says the 151 has a lower first gear and maybe slightly beefier bearings, otherwise they are the same tranny. the 151 is hard to find since it was only used in two models and sought after for the lower first gear. outside the USA the 150 was used in the turbo diesel land cruiser II, prado, hilux, surf ect. so i figured it was worth a try since they work overseas just fine and are cheap and easy to find.

the higher first gear is better on the road and since i have the doubler when needed its not an issue.

Great info! I'm going to go see what that looks like under my 40...

Anyone know off hand what the length of a 4bd is from fan to Rear mounting surface?

 

[longbow]

I think that is the combo that "Rhino" on here is running in his. He has an FJ55 with a 4BD1T with that adapter combo with I think an R151. I would contact him and see how it has held up over time. I don't think that tranny is as strong as some of the others listed above, but if I remember right, he has had good luck with it. I just don't know about the long term survival of it.


Don

Well, that was fast Rhino! He beat me to the response on this one!

 

[twoturtlesracing]

Also had another great Idea for making this work in a 40 with the H41/H42... One could use a Ranger overdrive and get a 27% overdrive...

 

[folsom50]

4bd fan to back of the flywheel housing is 33.5"
Flywheel housing including the starter "bump" is 20.5" wide the stock starter sticks out even farther.
The 40 frame rails are approx. 24" wide. It'll be pretty tight on the left side even with the starter clocked.

 

[twoturtlesracing]

4bd fan to back of the flywheel housing is 33.5"
Flywheel housing including the starter "bump" is 20.5" wide the stock starter sticks out even farther.
The 40 frame rails are approx. 24" wide. It'll be pretty tight on the left side even with the starter clocked.

THANK YOU! Great info for this thread!

 

[folsom50]

Don't take this as gospel, but I've heard complaints that the ranger causes drag on the h41/2 syncros that makes it lose it's smooth shifting we love.

 

[twoturtlesracing]

Don't take this as gospel, but I've heard complaints that the ranger causes drag on the h41/2 syncros that makes it lose it's smooth shifting we love.

Yeah, probably not my first choice, but would be great for someone that already had a ranger overdrive and GM V8 looking to convert to diesel. However, if I found a used one at the right price, I might jump on it!

 

[folsom50]

I've considered it myself. From all the research I've done, it does seem to be about the easiest route.

 

[twoturtlesracing]

Wanted to throw the pricing of an R150 rebuilt by Marlin out here for kicks and giggles: They start at $999 and also have an available 4.31:1 first for an additional $650. That'd be pretty cool!

 

[longbow]

I don't know how well the Ranger works behind the 4BD1T. "dohcdelsol93" used one behind his when he did his conversion into his 60 and had a bunch of problems. He eventually sold it, but I don't know if the Ranger was the cause of final sale. I remember him mentioning something about sloppy shifting and things never feeling right with the whole thing.

Don

 

[Dirtgypsy]

I think the 150 sounds interesting. One thing to consider is the weight difference your 40 has against the other vehicles. I would think the 150 would be a fine option for you. The ratio with the 4.11 and 35 to me would be spot on. You have a lot of hills in Colorado as opposed to AZ. A single adapter from Tim would be more appealing as well. 40 has a short wheel base and keeping the transmission as close to stock will keep drive lines at happy angles.

Good luck with the build it sounds fantastic!

Clint

 

[twoturtlesracing]

I think the 150 sounds interesting. One thing to consider is the weight difference your 40 has against the other vehicles. I would think the 150 would be a fine option for you. The ratio with the 4.11 and 35 to me would be spot on. You have a lot of hills in Colorado as opposed to AZ. A single adapter from Tim would be more appealing as well. 40 has a short wheel base and keeping the transmission as close to stock will keep drive lines at happy angles.

Good luck with the build it sounds fantastic!

Clint

Thanks for stopping by Clint! I'm honored to see the main inspiration of this swap stopping by!

 

[twoturtlesracing]

So I took the tape measure and the measurements RHINO posted out to my 40 tonight... Not a pretty site! I would not have much of a driveshaft left if I did the 150 and adapters as Rhino did. That's just to much to fit into a 40!

Ok... On to the next options... I'm going to have to sleep on it...

The 4bdt is almost exactly the same length as the 2F. I need to see if I can get some measurements on that new GM bellhousing to see how short I can make all of this...

Forgive me for thinking out loud.

 

[handcannon]

Not sure if you've done this yet, but move the rear axle back a ways. Yes, it's a bit of work, but you will get a longer driveshaft that way, and longer wheelbase.

Don

 

[doug720]

So I took the tape measure and the measurements RHINO posted out to my 40 tonight... Not a pretty site! I would not have much of a driveshaft left if I did the 150 and adapters as Rhino did. That's just to much to fit into a 40!

Ok... On to the next options... I'm going to have to sleep on it...

The 4bdt is almost exactly the same length as the 2F. I need to see if I can get some measurements on that new GM bellhousing to see how short I can make all of this...

Forgive me for thinking out loud.

The 4BD2 is shorter by around 7 inches overall than a 2f. One of the reasons I mentioned the IDS/H55 is you could leave your drivetrain in the stock location, and move the engine forward. That is what I did in my Isuzu/60 swap. The ring moves the engine appox. 1" forward and you make a spacer to move the radiator back, which makes room for the inter-cooler.

Just idea's to throw out.

Doug

 

[twoturtlesracing]

Not sure if you've done this yet, but move the rear axle back a ways. Yes, it's a bit of work, but you will get a longer driveshaft that way, and longer wheelbase.

Don

Don, I actually moved my axle back a couple of inches when I went SOA with 60 springs. Probably don't want to go much further just for looks sake- otherwise that would be a good solution.

Sent from my iPhone/ IH8MUD app

 

[twoturtlesracing]

The 4BD2 is shorter by around 7 inches overall than a 2f. One of the reasons I mentioned the IDS/H55 is you could leave your drivetrain in the stock location, and move the engine forward. That is what I did in my Isuzu/60 swap. The ring moves the engine appox. 1" forward and you make a spacer to move the radiator back, which makes room for the inter-cooler.

Just idea's to throw out.

Doug

Doug, folsom50 mentioned the Isuzu being around 33 1/2" long and when I compared that to my 2F it seemed just almost as long... I need to look up the l/w/h specs from "Isuzu 4BDT swap?!" and post them in here for exact lengths, but if it is about 7" shorter that helps a lot! And I certainly want to have room for an IC!

I really do like your suggestion of the H55 and adapter ring. Don't I still need a Chevy to Toyota adapter though?

Also, if I go with that setup, I also have to figure in the cost of a split case because the h55 will not mate to my tcase. Which also means I lose my parking brake as it is on the back of my tcase, and finding parking brake drums for split cases is like finding pots of gold at the end of the rainbow, and worth more than that pot if you DID happen to find them. I would also have to change driveshaft flange/flanges- doable, but just another cost and step.

All that said, it still might be my best option. Any chance you know the length from the back of the Isuzu to driveshaft flange on your split case?

Sent from my iPhone/ IH8MUD app

 

[handcannon]

Depending on how comfortable you are with going a little deeper into fabbing, there are a couple other possibilities for E-brakes.

GM has a few newer vehicles with drum style E-brake inside the hat of a disc rotor. I've seen someone somewhere here on Mud modify the mounting flange on the axle tube so he could bolt the GM brake backing plate on in place of the Toyota plate.

The other one I think would take more "engineering". Someone outside the USA, maybe the Phillipines?, put some Subaru calipers with built in E-brakes (similar to Eldorado calipers) on his 40. I did some looking into this. You'd need to come up with a mounting plate like is used to put the GM disc calipers on, except the caliper mounting points are different than the GM caliper. I'd want to make sure the caliper from that small a vehicle would have enough clamping pressure for a 40.

Something like this would allow you to use the parts you mention in your previous post.

Don

 

[Dirtgypsy]

I can almost guarantee that the 150 and H55f are going to give you the same length or pretty darn close. Double check the measurement from rhino because I am sure that his length is due to the doubler that he is running. The distance from the AA chevota bell housing to the mating surface of my split case output shaft (AA bell, H55F, split case) is 32 1/4". That is a pretty tidy fit. The IDS and similar dual flywheel adapters only add 3/4 of the overall length. Also a 13BT and 4bd1t is almost identical in size and weight. They fit just fine in 40's with H55Fs and split cases.

Clint

 

[folsom50]

I finally got a chance to do some more measuring last night and can see where there might be some issues with a 4bd2t in a 40. Nothing major, but still could cause some problems that need worked around. A couple nice things, the radiator off the stepvan is almost exactly the same width as a 40, so the IC is about a perfect fit. It also looks like a person can just flip the 40s fan shroud over.

I need to figure out nv4500 lengths.