Weak Points for a 200 Series Offroad (1 Viewer)

[ikarus]

I've been researching this quite a bit over the holidays and came up with nothing, which makes me think that it's not an issue. My question is - are there any areas in a 200 series that see more stress, or break under offroad use, or need strengthening?

I'm not looking for the actual offroad abilities of a 200, I have one and it's been great. For context, I also have a 2020 Tacoma 6-speed and I always dreamed of turning it into a lightweight supercharged mid travel desert runner. I was just about to pull the trigger on all the suspension, supercharger etc. last month when I started spending more time on Tacomaworld. Turns out Tacomas that see relatively heavy offroad use are at risk of tearing the radiator mount sheet metal, bending the LCA mounting points, bending spindles, and of course the frame isn't fully boxed. Kinda killed my dream which is a shame because I've really enjoyed this truck but I'm not sure it's the right platform to sink a bunch of money into.

I was pretty disappointed as a Toyota fanboy, and coming from 5 years of no problems other than the self inflicted ones on my 100 (steering racks for 35s+beadlocks).

I have a 200 that I might build instead, or maybe get another one but then my neighbors will think I'm weird hahah

My style of offroading is washboard roads, remote places, occasional obstacles, think Top of the World or Elephant hill type stuff at the most.

Anyway - anything similar in 200s? Any points that regularly need reinforcement or are they just bomb proof?

 

[CharlieS]

Rear lower control arms and lower control arm upper mounts are exposed in some terrain. Front and rear bumpers have crappy approach and departure angles. All fixable with upgrades. Limited to ~34/35" tires and a few inches of lift without more extreme mods.

Biggest liability in my mind is that it is wide and incredibly heavy. If you can live with that, most everything else is good or can be built.

 

[grinchy]

There have been a few broken cvs when a spinning front wheel gets sudden traction.

 

[grinchy]

I’ve never like that the transfer case housing is slightly below the lower frame level, but you never hear of this being an issue.

 

[TeCKis300]

There doesn't seem to be much if any systemic weaknesses in this model. Which is pretty incredible given how hard and heavy we collectively drive these these things. I'm always amazed watching blogs on other Toyota models and they seem to run through a long list of things that should be hardened when modified. I'm not really aware of much for our model.

Monica, Canguro's race rig, is a strong bellwether and has been put through the ringer with so many Baja races, on 37s no less, and probably has seen more abuse singularly than any other rig. Granted they service and replace parts, and some of the suspension is not stock, but so much of it is stock. Parts abuse at race pace, over many races, is at another level and they are able to consistently finish if not win races, which speaks to the durability of the core product.

Toyota has done an incredible job developing the 200-series. A lot of it is validating durability over the long term, and managing stresses and stress risers so that thing don't break over the long term. Frankly, I think there's many more ways to get things wrong modifying, and when incorperating barely developed parts in the aftermarket.

Weight is one of the great equalizers and should be watched carefully as more weight stresses everything. IMO, a really functional, high performing, and high durability rig would be a lightweight build with minimal bumpers if any, no under armor, 35s or maybe 37s with a mild body lift, correct offset and suspension geometry, suspension work with plush spring rates maximizing travel.

Basically building after Monica in many ways. Some notable rigs come to mind like @turbo8 . That's gotta be an incredibly fun and capable rig to bash in. I would love to see more action vids of his rig running in the open.

 

[stonepa]

Land Cruisers in relatively stock suspension form are in no way Pre-runners and are no where near in high speed desert running and jumping similar to a Raptor or TRX. That being said, they are extremely reliable and durable for hard off highway and offroad use. Take a look at most any tough Australian off-road video and they are most always in a 200 (sometimes some sort of 70 series) often in nearly stock form. They get the job done.

 

[TeCKis300]

Land Cruisers in relatively stock suspension form are in no way Pre-runners and are no where near in high speed desert running and jumping similar to a Raptor or TRX. That being said, they are extremely reliable and durable for hard off highway and offroad use. Take a look at most any tough Australian off-road video and they are most always in a 200 (sometimes some sort of 70 series) often in nearly stock form. They get the job done.

Agreed the stock LC suspension is not setup, nor up to task for high speed desert running. The platform is though and pretty much what Monica does in a more extreme way. I'd say the platform is only shocks, springs, and tires away from pretty solid high speed use. At least that's my experience often running with my Raptor friends in the southwest.

AHC is up to task, but needs some sensor lift tweaking to increase ride height and compression travel. Ideally modifying for longer travel as that's where the Raptors have a big advantage to take larger hits. Stability and comfort wise, it's pretty incredible what the 200-series will take and soak up, at least for bumps within its suspension travel capability. I'm hanging with them pretty well in the open, and the kids prefer the comfort of the LX. The older raptors have leaf spring rear axle setups and were not as accurate or good off-road. The latest generation with IFS, 5-link rear, and dynamic damping...an architecture not unlike the 200-series, are better with more stability and comfort.

 

[Madtiger]

I will leave this here:

 

[grinchy]

Why didn’t this snorkel make the market?

 

[ikarus]

Rear lower control arms and lower control arm upper mounts are exposed in some terrain. Front and rear bumpers have crappy approach and departure angles. All fixable with upgrades. Limited to ~34/35" tires and a few inches of lift without more extreme mods.

Biggest liability in my mind is that it is wide and incredibly heavy. If you can live with that, most everything else is good or can be built.

Agreed. I don't love the weight, that's why I liked having a relatively lightweight Tacoma. But at the end of the day if I just have to trade a thousand pounds or so for some added durability I'm all about it.

There have been a few broken cvs when a spinning front wheel gets sudden traction.

Good point, I'm fairly careful with front diffs and wheelspin as a habit after years of wheeling a 100.

There doesn't seem to be much if any systemic weaknesses in this model. Which is pretty incredible given how hard and heavy we collectively drive these these things. I'm always amazed watching blogs on other Toyota models and they seem to run through a long list of things that should be hardened when modified. I'm not really aware of much for our model.

Monica, Canguro's race rig, is a strong bellwether and has been put through the ringer with so many Baja races, on 37s no less, and probably has seen more abuse singularly than any other rig. Granted they service and replace parts, and some of the suspension is not stock, but so much of it is stock. Parts abuse at race pace, over many races, is at another level and they are able to consistently finish if not win races, which speaks to the durability of the core product.

Toyota has done an incredible job developing the 200-series. A lot of it is validating durability over the long term, and managing stresses and stress risers so that thing don't break over the long term. Frankly, I think there's many more ways to get things wrong modifying, and when incorperating barely developed parts in the aftermarket.

Weight is one of the great equalizers and should be watched carefully as more weight stresses everything. IMO, a really functional, high performing, and high durability rig would be a lightweight build with minimal bumpers if any, no under armor, 35s or maybe 37s with a mild body lift, correct offset and suspension geometry, suspension work with plush spring rates maximizing travel.

Basically building after Monica in many ways. Some notable rigs come to mind like @turbo8 . That's gotta be an incredibly fun and capable rig to bash in. I would love to see more action vids of his rig running in the open.

I love to hear it. I need to take a closer look at Kurt's Monica thread and read up on their journey. And yes, with other trucks there's just a laundry list of things to preemptively fix before you even get to the standard items that could fail like CVs, steering racks, etc.

Agreed on the weight, on my last build I was all-in on bumpers, armor etc. and I doubt I'll do it again. If I pick up another 200 I'll most likely add some 34s and sliders, maybe a skid or two and call it good. That'll get you down 90% of the trails here in Utah if not more - and the remaining 10% you have to decide if it's worth the hassle or the damage. Lately I've just been hiking and biking more because I don't feel like sitting down for 4 hours crawling a trail that can be hiked in 1 hour. ha. Only if there's an amazing destination at the end that makes it all worth it.

I always felt like I had way too much weight way out back on my 100 - bumper @200-250 lbs? + 100 lb spare + 2 jerry cans @80 lbs - almost 400 lbs plus cargo. I'm no engineer but I believe it acted like a lever and under certain conditions it produced some bad bouncing and even loss of traction off road when climbing up loose rocky trails.

Land Cruisers in relatively stock suspension form are in no way Pre-runners and are no where near in high speed desert running and jumping similar to a Raptor or TRX. That being said, they are extremely reliable and durable for hard off highway and offroad use. Take a look at most any tough Australian off-road video and they are most always in a 200 (sometimes some sort of 70 series) often in nearly stock form. They get the job done.

For sure. I'd probably add some tuned Kings or Foxes just to make the high speed desert runs a little better. But I won't be trying to pretend to be an LT truck, I'd rather adjust my driving style and chill out a little if I get durability instead.

Why didn’t this snorkel make the market?

View attachment 3207586

I believe it did, looks like the stock Toyota snorkel:

 

[tbisaacs]

I've been researching this quite a bit over the holidays and came up with nothing, which makes me think that it's not an issue. My question is - are there any areas in a 200 series that see more stress, or break under offroad use, or need strengthening?

I'm not looking for the actual offroad abilities of a 200, I have one and it's been great. For context, I also have a 2020 Tacoma 6-speed and I always dreamed of turning it into a lightweight supercharged mid travel desert runner. I was just about to pull the trigger on all the suspension, supercharger etc. last month when I started spending more time on Tacomaworld. Turns out Tacomas that see relatively heavy offroad use are at risk of tearing the radiator mount sheet metal, bending the LCA mounting points, bending spindles, and of course the frame isn't fully boxed. Kinda killed my dream which is a shame because I've really enjoyed this truck but I'm not sure it's the right platform to sink a bunch of money into.

I was pretty disappointed as a Toyota fanboy, and coming from 5 years of no problems other than the self inflicted ones on my 100 (steering racks for 35s+beadlocks).

I have a 200 that I might build instead, or maybe get another one but then my neighbors will think I'm weird hahah

My style of offroading is washboard roads, remote places, occasional obstacles, think Top of the World or Elephant hill type stuff at the most.

Anyway - anything similar in 200s? Any points that regularly need reinforcement or are they just bomb proof?

Big fan of your 100 series build

 

[04UZJ100]

Big fan of your 100 series build

Same. And the 200 series section is missing some of your photographic skills too @ikarus

 

[ikarus]

Big fan of your 100 series build

Same. And the 200 series section is missing some of your photographic skills too @ikarus

Thanks guys, I miss it! Thought about getting a 105 now that they're legal but I'm leaning 200.

 

[Madtiger]

Thanks guys, I miss it! Thought about getting a 105 now that they're legal but I'm leaning 200.

top_10_used_overland_vehicles



Click link above and PLAY...go to time stamp: 41:33

“The 200 series is the strongest Land Cruiser ever produced by Toyota, a statement I heard straight from the mouth of the product engineer in Nagoya, Japan.”

BTW, the product engineer mentioned is the lead engineer for Land Cruiser development...Mr. Sadayoshi Koyari.

Great info!!

FULL article: Top 10 Used Overland Vehicles - Expedition Portal

IMHO, the 200 series is the pinnacle of Toyota quality. (I have a few doubts about the 300 series due to weight saving attempts and possibly cost cutting.)

 

[Madtiger]

And everything you want to know about 200: https://newsroom.toyota.eu//service...hash=d7c0308c1c0f8d87eb5a1e947f93bd0f82d258bc

 

[Madtiger]

Longest lasting cars to reach 200,000+ miles: Longest-Lasting Cars to Reach 200,000 Miles and Beyond - iSeeCars.com

“With roots dating back to 1950, the iconic and indestructible Toyota Land Cruiser is designed to last at least 25 years, and it is relied upon in many developing countries where off-road driving is the norm,” said Ly.

 

[Madtiger]

Another good review to compare with other Toyotas:

 

[nwfl4runner]

I've been researching this quite a bit over the holidays and came up with nothing, which makes me think that it's not an issue. My question is - are there any areas in a 200 series that see more stress, or break under offroad use, or need strengthening?

I'm not looking for the actual offroad abilities of a 200, I have one and it's been great. For context, I also have a 2020 Tacoma 6-speed and I always dreamed of turning it into a lightweight supercharged mid travel desert runner. I was just about to pull the trigger on all the suspension, supercharger etc. last month when I started spending more time on Tacomaworld. Turns out Tacomas that see relatively heavy offroad use are at risk of tearing the radiator mount sheet metal, bending the LCA mounting points, bending spindles, and of course the frame isn't fully boxed. Kinda killed my dream which is a shame because I've really enjoyed this truck but I'm not sure it's the right platform to sink a bunch of money into.

Anyway - anything similar in 200s? Any points that regularly need reinforcement or are they just bomb proof?

When you talk about how you like to use the taco, are you talking about mid-travel (longer coilovers) and ruts, are you talking a +2 kit and hitting whoops at speed, or wash outs at 25? And is that the primary goal?

Edit: I ask because use will dictate inherent failure points to a large extent.

 

[TeCKis300]

Big fan of your 100 series build

@ikarus , I must have missed this. Got a link?

 

[tbisaacs]

@ikarus , I must have missed this. Got a link?

Builds - Ikarus' LX470 Offroad Build and BS

Current state: I had a Tacoma for several years but eventually decided I needed cab space instead of bed space. Was an awesome truck - lifted, 33s, front and rear lockers, compressor, regeared to 4.88s, skids, front bumper, snorkel, rear tire carrier, etc: I'd always loved Land Cruisers...

forum.ih8mud.com