Trip Report and Diagnostic Help

[ewillis]

So...I'm stumped and irritated with this axle/hub issue. I'll try and be as succinct as possible, but this issue requires a bit of background. Pics included to keep the story interesting.

Clue #1 is that I completed a birf rebuild about 2000 miles ago. I replaced everything except wheel bearings with OEM.

About a month ago, I'm cruising at highway speeds and hear this whirling/grinding noise coming from my PS side wheel that causes me to hit the emergency lane on the highway. After I pull over and inspect, I cruise home slowly with no noises whatsoever. Had a trip to Encinitas coming up so I thought maybe it was a loose outer wheel bearing. I repacked both sides (preload seemed a bit loose) and completed the 500 mile trip with no issues...also caught a nice yellowfin!

Literally 2 days after getting back, @Qball calls me up and says "hey we're going to Bishop...wanna come"?

So we make about a 700 mile round trip to Bishop to do some wheeling at Funnel Lake...
11,000 feet in elevation

Funnel Lake was really cool and we spent a lot of time crawling through rocks, meadows, and high-elevation plains. We had @jtwopark lose a panhard bolt on the trail and @NLXTACY provided a really brilliant fix using a ratchet strap and socket to get him off the trail and all the way home.

20 miles from home, I again hear this grinding/whirling noise (this time on DS) similar to when you hit the asphalt serrations on the freeway, but this time my rig would not move but a few feet without grinding and I had to tow it the last 20 miles home.

Yesterday I decided to start trouble shooting. My axle breather lines have been puking gear oil so I thought maybe the diff somehow ran dry after the long trip. I took out the fill plug and gear oil poured out of the top (seemed pressurized). So that wasn't it. Put the rig on jack stands and felt for play in the wheel, but there wasn't much if any. I pulled the wheel off and found condensation on the cap...seems to have been pretty hot! The red stuff is Redline Moly grease, not rust.

So...in conclusion, does anyone have an idea of what this issue could be before I pull everything out and replace all bearings/seals again? I had no issues until I rebuilt the axle so i'm not sure if that is causal, relational, or inconsequential. Caliper bolt is also nice and tight.

TIA

 

[george_tlc]

Jack up the front end and spin each wheel to hear if the grinding is still there. Grinding at wheel revolution speed or prop shaft speed?

I assume you didn't get a stone etc stuck somewhere between pads/dust shield/caliper etc etc.

Anyhow, time to peel the onion (at least remove the drive plates) to see if it is axle spinning making the noise or wheel spinning... I'd do a step at a time rather than just ripping it all down and pulling birfields until you have an idea of the source of the noise.

cheers,
george.

 

[blkprj80]

Did you grease those bronze bushings inside the spindle?

 

[ewillis]

Jack up the front end and spin each wheel to hear if the grinding is still there. Grinding at wheel revolution speed or prop shaft speed?

I assume you didn't get a stone etc stuck somewhere between pads/dust shield/caliper etc etc.

Anyhow, time to peel the onion (at least remove the drive plates) to see if it is axle spinning making the noise or wheel spinning... I'd do a step at a time rather than just ripping it all down and pulling birfields until you have an idea of the source of the noise.

cheers,
george.

Thanks George...There is no noise when spinning the wheels on jack stands and not due to a rock getting stuck because it happened prior to the Funnel Lake trip as well. It seems to only happen after a bit of time on the freeway.

 

[ewillis]

Did you grease those bronze bushings inside the spindle?

Possibly not...I don't recall completing this step.

 

[george_tlc]

Drive around a bit (close to home) and get the noise back and then isolate where it is coming from.

Possibly not...I don't recall completing this step.

gak!

Pop off dust covers at least and look to see what fun may be hiding there

cheers,
george.

 

[leucadiacruiser]

Great pix up until the flatbed - great chatting with you at the trailhead and hope you get this one resolved.

 

[ewillis]

Great pix up until the flatbed - great chatting with you at the trailhead and hope you get this one resolved.

Ahhh...Mr. Leucadia! I was hoping we'd get together and have some beers one of those nights, but it was frickin cold!!

gak!

Pop off dust covers at least and look to see what fun may be hiding there

cheers,
george.

Will do George...I have a feeling I may have not greased the spindle properly.

 

[leucadiacruiser]

Ahhh...Mr. Leucadia! I was hoping we'd get together and have some beers one of those nights, but it was frickin cold!!

Yeah it was - turns out 35° in summer feels the same as 35° in winter!

 

[scottryana]

First check drive plates and then my guess would be like you said not greasing the spindle bushing.

 

[Tools R Us]

Remove the plug and check knuckle moly grease level. If it's correct (~1/2-3/4 full) will lube the spindle bushing, if low/empty the bushing will run dry.

 

[ewillis]

First check drive plates and then my guess would be like you said not greasing the spindle bushing.

Thanks Ryan...elaborate on drive plates please. I'm not seeing a clear image in FSM.

 

[Qball]

For 35s torque the preload to 20-25ft/lb.

Also feel for smoothness when spinning the wheel/bearing, put some pressure in while you turn the bearing. Mine was crunchy, does this mean you need the outer bearing back? LOL

 

[george_tlc]

Drive plates are the things under the cone washers that 'connect' the axle to the wheel (where free wheeling hubs would normally be installed in a part time 4wd). All torque goes through those plates. Plates can strip out where they mesh with the axle splines - but then in AWD you would lose most of your drive to the wheel that is stripped out.

cheers,
george.

 

[ewillis]

Drive plates are the things under the cone washers that 'connect' the axle to the wheel (where free wheeling hubs would normally be installed in a part time 4wd). All torque goes through those plates. Plates can strip out where they mesh with the axle splines - but then in AWD you would lose most of your drive to the wheel that is stripped out.

cheers,
george.

Ahh...yes! FSM calls it a "flange". I will check...thanks!

 

[elhombre]

"Yesterday I decided to start trouble shooting. My axle breather lines have been puking gear oil so I thought maybe the diff somehow ran dry after the long trip. I took out the fill plug and gear oil poured out of the top (seemed pressurized)."

Did you overfill the diff with gear oil when you did the birf R&R? Or is it full from water getting into it some how?

 

[ewillis]

"Yesterday I decided to start trouble shooting. My axle breather lines have been puking gear oil so I thought maybe the diff somehow ran dry after the long trip. I took out the fill plug and gear oil poured out of the top (seemed pressurized)."

Did you overfill the diff with gear oil when you did the birf R&R? Or is it full from water getting into it some how?

Hmmm...good question. I initially overfilled a bit...there was gear oil still oozing out of the fill hole when I capped it during the rebuild. I didn't let it completely drain out. What came out yesterday was way more than I could have overfilled. We hit a water crossing (not too deep) that could have pulled some water in the breather lines because I don't have them extended. The color of the gear oil was greenish and looked to be mixed with some moly.

 

[ntxcruisin]

Having same issue with my 97 LX450. I recently replaced front axles, birfields, wheel bearings and inner axle seals. Roughly 1500 miles after that work it makes the noise when decelerating. I dropped it off at the shop today to have it looked at. If you find out what it is let me know and I will do the same.

 

[ntxcruisin]

her is the video of the noise on YouTube

 

[ntxcruisin]

here is the second video