Getting my 2016 LC200 ready to tow my 4k pound loaded travel trailer. Just installed a Redarc controller, and needed to purchase a 3 foot electrical extension for the trailer wiring hookup. The recommendation is to not tow any higher than 6th gear. I've read the manual and don't understand how to do this. Do I need to go into manual mode and shift every gear? I hope not. Haven't done all of that shifting since my 82 Hilux.
Towing with a 2016 and not going higher than 6th gear.
- Thread starter welchsoft
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Manual mode. PWR setting. No shifting required.
When you're in drive, move the shift knob sideways to the S setting and then just move it forward/backward (+/-) until you see 6th gear in the dash display. The transmission will then shift normally, but only up to 6th gear. Works like a charm. You can also downshift on downhills for engine braking. No need for any other setting or using ECT PWR unless you want to. The purpose is to keep the transmission from the overdrive gears (7&8), which allows the torque converter to lock up so the transmission runs cooler.
terrapin
SILVER Star
I don't know about newer vehicles, but in my 2010 LX I tow in 4th gear (as recommended for a 6 speed), but if I downshift for either going up or down hills the cruise control gets turned off. I can only use cruise control in 4th. I wish I could use it in the lower gears.
Interestingly, the manual does not explicitly state to use specific gears to tow. It does explicitly say not to use cruise when towing. Possibly for liability reasons?
It is good practice however to use sport mode and limit to lower gears even on flats as it minimizes hunting. For towing anything significant, at least 5th. Larger trailers with more weight and aero load will need 4th. (Or 7th and 6th if an 8-speed). Idea is to minimize hunting and encourage the torque converter to lock a higher percentage of time. As that'll ensure the best economy and least heat built up in the transmission.
When climbing and descending, definitely use lower gears. RPM will help the engine run cooler with less stress going up. RPM will help with more engine braking going down. Don't be afraid to use the full extent of the RPM band and/or second gear on serious grades if you're towing a larger load.
2016 Section 4-1 of owners manual under "Trailer Towing Tips"
To maintain engine braking efficiency and charging system performance when using engine braking, do not put the transmission in D.
If in the S mode, the transmission shift range position must be in 6 or lower. (P. 199)
I understood this to tow in no higher than 6th.
To maintain engine braking efficiency and charging system performance when using engine braking, do not put the transmission in D.
If in the S mode, the transmission shift range position must be in 6 or lower. (P. 199)
I understood this to tow in no higher than 6th.
Ha i use my adaptive cruise all the time but also stay vigilant at all times. My leg can’t take pushing the go pedal for all day hauls.
bloc
SILVER Star
On the 8spd 6th is 1:1, on the 6spd it is 4th (though I seem to remember it isn’t exactly 1:1, slightly off, indicating it still uses a planetary or two).
The thing to keep in mind is the 8spd vehicles have 3.3:1 diffs whereas the 6spds have 3.9.. this means you may need a lower gear to hit similar cruising RPMs / hp output.
As long as the TC can lock 5th should be fine on an 8spd, but it’s all a balance of hp demand/efficiency/comfort.
The thing to keep in mind is the 8spd vehicles have 3.3:1 diffs whereas the 6spds have 3.9.. this means you may need a lower gear to hit similar cruising RPMs / hp output.
As long as the TC can lock 5th should be fine on an 8spd, but it’s all a balance of hp demand/efficiency/comfort.
Same. keep foot near brake and right hand near the cruise control lever to disengage without braking if needed. 100's of hours doing this in my 2016.
- Thread starter
- #12
Just to follow up on my towing experience. We towed 4500 miles with our travel trailer which weighed 5020 pounds (verified on CAT scale). Stuck to 65mph, and on flat roads could use 7th gear which ran just below 3000 rpm. The vehicle handles well. Tried cruise a couple of times but even on flat roads, the transmission would downshift with a very slight incline to abandoned the cruise control idea.
IMO your interpretation is wrong. Read it again, “when using engine braking” to me is the only time to use lower gears. But I don’t tow in S and I cant figure out if the S mode comment is connected to the engine braking comment and I don’t tow in S so, to me, it is irrelevant.
Unlike many on the board who tow I don’t do anything different except I put it in ECT Power and just drive around, often on Cruise. Don’t take this to mean that I have the only right way or that I think I am the only one who is correct, merely that this how I do it.
I am adding this edit, I do downshift a lot, manually, to slow down or descend but I am in D as a default.
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- Thread starter
- #14
In my own case I ran in S set to S6, used engine breaking and went to S7 on long stretches of flat terrain. Most of the time I just let the transmission do its thing. I also read that section of the manual to indicate 'don't tow in D'.
bloc
SILVER Star
For a very light/compact trailer this could work but the driver should learn how to be very, very aware of signs that the torque converter is unlocking. Our overdrive gears (8th for 16-21 and 6th from 08-15) are quite tall and it would be asking a lot to be able to provide the necessary torque to pull a significant trailer through the air at such low RPMs. This can lead to the TC unlocking and rapid rise in ATF temps.. with basically no other indicator that the truck isn’t perfectly happy.
A much smarter course of action is to run in S6 (for 8-speed) or S7 if the trailer is small. The higher cruising RPMs allow more torque production for a given throttle setting and this will help prevent TC unlock. And the engine doesn’t mind at all.. it’ll happily sing along at 4k if asked, though that is often excessive for flat land and will use more fuel. In fact some more RPMs can help build oil pressure from the low gauge reading we typically see at freeway speeds in Drive.
My truck pulls my camper (3200lbs) just fine by putting it in drive and pressing the ETC button.
Towed perfect and you'd never know it was back there.
Towed perfect and you'd never know it was back there.
bloc
SILVER Star
I’m saying if you check your transmission fluid temps while towing those with the method you describe you’d probably find them higher than is ideal.
Here’s my feeble attempt to describe why the owner’s manual says to tow in a 1:1 gear.
What’s going on in the torque converter is the secret to why it’s so much better for it to be locked up. In overly simple terms, it consists of 2 fan-like turbine blades. The one driven by the engine pushes ATF against the one connected to the transmission. This allows slippage when stopped because there is no direct connection between the engine and transmission, just ATF. As the engine rpm and torque (HP) increases, the ATF from the engine side starts pushing hard enough to turn the transmission. As the vehicle accelerates and reaches cruising speed , a mechanical lockup between the engine driven turbine fan and the transmission turbine fan occurs, eliminating the slippage that was initially essential to being stopped.
Inefficiency and heat build up are inherent in torque converter slippage before lockup because only ATF under a lot of pressure is connecting the engine to the transmission. So mechanical lockup is good.
When towing, the increased need for HP (roughly torque X rpm) means the transmission will be needing higher rpm from the engine. If in too high a gear when more HP is needed, the first thing that happens is the torque converter unlocks, increasing heat build up in the ATF as well as inefficiency.
Keeping the transmission in a 1:1 gear (4th in the 6 speed and 6th in the 8 speed) provides the HP needed for towing and normally prevents the torque converter from unlocking. Of course mountain driving and hard acceleration will unlock the torque converter momentarily anyway.
Towing in a 1:1 gear also makes for a better driving experience. The engine is generating good HP that reduces transmission gear hunting, makes it smoother to use cruise control, and provides easier acceleration and engine braking. The engine likes it too. Better to let it spin than lug. I don’t think it uses more gas to run at higher rpm; it takes a certain HP (read gas usage) to go down the road at 60 mph regardless of engine rpm (up to a point, of course).
What’s going on in the torque converter is the secret to why it’s so much better for it to be locked up. In overly simple terms, it consists of 2 fan-like turbine blades. The one driven by the engine pushes ATF against the one connected to the transmission. This allows slippage when stopped because there is no direct connection between the engine and transmission, just ATF. As the engine rpm and torque (HP) increases, the ATF from the engine side starts pushing hard enough to turn the transmission. As the vehicle accelerates and reaches cruising speed , a mechanical lockup between the engine driven turbine fan and the transmission turbine fan occurs, eliminating the slippage that was initially essential to being stopped.
Inefficiency and heat build up are inherent in torque converter slippage before lockup because only ATF under a lot of pressure is connecting the engine to the transmission. So mechanical lockup is good.
When towing, the increased need for HP (roughly torque X rpm) means the transmission will be needing higher rpm from the engine. If in too high a gear when more HP is needed, the first thing that happens is the torque converter unlocks, increasing heat build up in the ATF as well as inefficiency.
Keeping the transmission in a 1:1 gear (4th in the 6 speed and 6th in the 8 speed) provides the HP needed for towing and normally prevents the torque converter from unlocking. Of course mountain driving and hard acceleration will unlock the torque converter momentarily anyway.
Towing in a 1:1 gear also makes for a better driving experience. The engine is generating good HP that reduces transmission gear hunting, makes it smoother to use cruise control, and provides easier acceleration and engine braking. The engine likes it too. Better to let it spin than lug. I don’t think it uses more gas to run at higher rpm; it takes a certain HP (read gas usage) to go down the road at 60 mph regardless of engine rpm (up to a point, of course).
So you are saying that putting over 214,000 miles on the LC and somewhere over 100,000 on the LX without an issue isn’t enough evidence but you think that I need to monitor tranny temps? How many transmission failures are you aware of? I’ve seen one or maybe two on mud but that doesn’t seem like many. I understand that there are many different types of people on mud and I don’t consider my type to be superior, merely my type, and I don’t mean to discount the advantages of being a “numbers” person but I have quite a bit of actual hands on evidence that putting it in D and hauling yourself around doesn’t cause damage. You can do all the monitoring you want but I find that the surroundings are a lot more interesting. And, again, real life experience doesn’t indicate a need.
I just did a quick scan on my Gaia account and it shows over 20,000 miles of hauling the travel trailer from just over 49 degrees N to just over 68 degrees N but I don’t record the jet boat towing.
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