Towing with a 200-series Toyota Land Cruiser (3 Viewers)

[2021 LC200]

You can certainly get away without using a WDH, just as you can get away without using countless other safety-enhancing features. But in an emergency situation, you'll want the odds stacked in your favour.

Europe and Australia are not directly comparable to North America. They have much lower speed limits (especially when towing) and they have trailers that are frequently designed differently (for example, axles shifted further forward to lower tongue weight, utilizing surge brakes, etc.).

For what it's worth, my Andersen WDH hitch does not affect maneuvering in any way whatsoever.

I knew we would not agree. Enjoy your WDH.

For good order Europeans were wearing seat belts front and rear and by law sooner than in most if not all US states. Also ABS was introduced there by Mercedes on the S class. I would not want to do without either. A WDH is useful for longer combinations but not for what I have.

 

[2021 LC200]

Hey I noticed that too! I like them a lot as well.

But I worried that the holding clamps might possibly vibrate loose.
So I made a bracket-hook that hooks under the rear view mirror and is secured with 2 sizes of zip ties for a fool-proof securing of the mirror.
The hook is made from metal strapping & cushioned with gasket material that I had laying around.
When I'm done towing I just snip the narrower zip tie.
The mirror cannot come loose.

View attachment 3861337

Very nice. I have two secondary retainers however not as fancy as this setup.

 

[FrazzledHunter]

Very nice. I have two secondary retainers however not as fancy as this setup.

Thanks! I'm a retired engineer and don't have a lot to do except mess around with my Land Cruiser and trailer, travel, watch TV, putter around the house and solve problems that are both real and imaginary.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

I knew we would not agree. Enjoy your WDH.

For good order Europeans were wearing seat belts front and rear and by law sooner than in most if not all US states. Also ABS was introduced there by Mercedes on the S class. I would not want to do without either. A WDH is useful for longer combinations but not for what I have.

you keep bring up Europeans like they know something about trailering.....they dont

 

[2021 LC200]

Smaller cars and light weight construction travel trailers aka caravans in Europe. I think the direct comparison for our 200 series towing 7000 to 8000 lbs travel trailers is in Australia.

Forget about it, I know you all love your WDH’es and should use them. Best thing ever really!

 

[FrazzledHunter]

you keep bring up Europeans like they know something about trailering.....they dont

Interesting. I can only speak for our interactions. I haven't met any Europeans trailering here. I'm going to go off on a bit of a tangent...

We've talked to more than a few Europeans at campsites. What we've seen them do is pay to have their vehicle, always a Mercedes Sprinter Van, sent here by ship. They then proceed to tour the USA. Imagine that. They would go to such great expense just do drive around and do what some of us might take for granted.
I can't speak to their trailering ability but I can speak to their appreciation and admiration of our roads and parks. They're literally in awe of both. I appreciate the fact that the Europeans appreciate what we have (someone please edit that sentence).

I've concluded we should cherish the USA's parks at least as much as they do.

 

[2021 LC200]

I agree the US nature wise (as well as central and South America) has tons to offer.

Also the shear space everywhere and the lower taxes.

 

[GordJ]

why

I have done a little bit of towing with a 6500 lb trailer and I find it to be a "tow monster" with lots of stability in cross winds and plenty of power to get down the road. Thats all, no big deal just a very minor difference of opinion on the attributes of the 200.

 

[weaponoffreedom]

I have done a little bit of towing with a 6500 lb trailer and I find it to be a "tow monster" with lots of stability in cross winds and plenty of power to get down the road. Thats all, no big deal just a very minor difference of opinion on the attributes of the 200.

Maybe for a 6500 lbs trailer. Most people on here with LCs think that an 6500 lbs trailer is heavy.

 

[FrazzledHunter]

Maybe for a 6500 lbs trailer. Most people on here with LCs think that an 6500 lbs trailer is heavy.

Well I wouldn't want to go much heavier than what I have which is approx. 5500lb but I'm relatively inexperienced only having done significant towing on my current trailer. As is, I get 10mpg. A heavier trailer would only make that aspect worse. I just hate stopping for gas every 200 miles.

 

[JohnPW]

Regarding WDH: my trailering has been primarily pulling boats, which have different weight distribution, lower tongue weight, and in most cases, somewhat less wind resistance than a big travel trailer. But here in Florida, it seems no one ever uses a WDH for pulling boats. In 40 years of pulling boats in the Southeast I’ve never met anyone with a WDH. They aren’t compatible with the surge brakes that are commonly used on boat trailers. I’ve towed boats to around 7,000lbs without a WDH and never gave it a thought.

 

[GordJ]

Regarding WDH: my trailering has been primarily pulling boats, which have different weight distribution, lower tongue weight, and in most cases, somewhat less wind resistance than a big travel trailer. But here in Florida, it seems no one ever uses a WDH for pulling boats. In 40 years of pulling boats in the Southeast I’ve never met anyone with a WDH. They aren’t compatible with the surge brakes that are commonly used on boat trailers. I’ve towed boats to around 7,000lbs without a WDH and never gave it a thought.

In my opinion, having a 20’ boat, a 20’ single axle travel trailer and a 25’ tandem axle travel trailer, there is very little that the three have in common when it comes to towing. The differences come because of variations in the center of balance and center of gravity.
The boat (about 5,000 lb’s) has a much lower center of gravity and the weight is much closer to the center of the tandem axles which means, again in my opinion, that there is way less length and weight behind the axles and therefore no need for the equalizer. Also, with surge brakes it is much more complicated to install a WDH. But, more importantly, it tows like it is on rails.
The 20’ T.T. is only about 4500 lb’s and after trying it with and without the equalizer I am pulling it without the hitch largely to reduce tongue weight. Just easier and aesthetically more pleasing.
The bigger T.T. (6.500 lb’s) I pull with the equalizer because it seems to reduce both the vertical yo-yoing and the side to side sway. I believe that the raised center of gravity and the added length, especially behind, outside of the tandem axles necessitates the “stiffening” that the equalizer gives. The height and length brings a pendulum effect the neither the boat with its shorter behind the axles weight and the just plain smaller T.T. doesn’t have.

 

[2021 LC200]

I agree on boats having a low CG, though less tongue weight and outboards on the back does not help.

With this combination of 22ft body travel trailer I have had zero sway issues in a range of conditions including 18 wheelers passing close by at considerable higher speed. Tow hook nice and short making distance to rear axle optimum.

Having said that, I would install at least an anti sway arm for a relative long travel trailer like a 28 or 30ft body and use my airbag man airbags (which allow you to run at enough pressure to keep things level). However those are typically loaded well over 8500lbs. Do not need or want to go there from a brakes/ downhill perspective.

 

[gaijin]

Regarding WDH: my trailering has been primarily pulling boats, which have different weight distribution, lower tongue weight, and in most cases, somewhat less wind resistance than a big travel trailer. But here in Florida, it seems no one ever uses a WDH for pulling boats. In 40 years of pulling boats in the Southeast I’ve never met anyone with a WDH. They aren’t compatible with the surge brakes that are commonly used on boat trailers. I’ve towed boats to around 7,000lbs without a WDH and never gave it a thought.

Aren't the guidelines in the Owner's Manual clear enough? Or are they incorrect?

From my 2013 LC200 Manual:

 

[2021 LC200]

Written by Americans from Toyota US

Same Toyota does not change transmission fluid

I enjoy the manual but consider this BS

 

[FrazzledHunter]

Written by Americans from Toyota US

Same Toyota does not change transmission fluid

I enjoy the manual but consider this BS

I can't speak to the towing specs because I'm an amateur at towing. But I've concluded the oil viscosity recommendation (only 0W-20 for my 2018) is in the same BS category having looked at manuals published outside the US. Especially for heavy load applications like towing.

 

[JohnPW]

Aren't the guidelines in the Owner's Manual clear enough? Or are they incorrect?

From my 2013 LC200 Manual:

View attachment 3862562

They are very clear. And they are basically identical to the instructions in the owners manual of every BOF SUV, and every half ton pickup, of every auto manufacturer. And you can go to every boat ramp in Florida, with boats in excess of 10K lbs being launched, and you are unlikely to find anyone who has a WDH. Especially on any SUV pulling 8300lb or less (Land Cruiser rating range). Most of them will have no trailer brakes, or at best surge brakes, which won’t work right with a WDH. Many will have surge brakes that are rusted and not functional.

I’m not defending this as best practice. I am saying it has always been this way, since before anyone ever heard of a WDH.

These are low COG boats in flat Florida (or coastal GA, AL, LA, SC). I’m not discouraging anyone from using a WDH, especially if towing a travel trailer in hill country. My only point is that using a WDH is far from universal, and in fact almost unheard of when towing boats in the Southeast.

 

[coleAK]

Well I wouldn't want to go much heavier than what I have which is approx. 5500lb but I'm relatively inexperienced only having done significant towing on my current trailer. As is, I get 10mpg. A heavier trailer would only make that aspect worse. I just hate stopping for gas every 200 miles.

I’ve owned 3 different campers (and also towing my brothers 2 campers from time to time) easily over 60k miles with my LX570 over >10 years now. When it comes to campers weight has almost nothing to do with MPG, it’s all frontal profile.

first 2 summers I had a ~7k lb airstream and got 9-10 mpg then switched to a ~7k lb outdoor RV, which was ~3’ taller, ~8” wider, with a flatter front profile and get 8-9 mpg (~10-15% worse). When I tow my brothers ~4500 lb rPod I get 9-10 mpg (same as the airstream), when I towed his previous ~4k lb single axle 15’ microlight that has almost the same front profile as my ORV I got ~8-9 mpg. I just picked up a Black Series HQ17 that is closer to 8k lbs but has a more sloped front and is narrower then my ORV I get 9-10 mpg.

 

[coleAK]

They are very clear. And they are basically identical to the instructions in the owners manual of every BOF SUV, and every half ton pickup, of every auto manufacturer. And you can go to every boat ramp in Florida, with boats in excess of 10K lbs being launched, and you are unlikely to find anyone who has a WDH. Especially on any SUV pulling 8300lb or less (Land Cruiser rating range). Most of them will have no trailer brakes, or at best surge brakes, which won’t work right with a WDH. Many will have surge brakes that are rusted and not functional.

I’m not defending this as best practice. I am saying it has always been this way, since before anyone ever heard of a WDH.

These are low COG boats in flat Florida (or coastal GA, AL, LA, SC). I’m not discouraging anyone from using a WDH, especially if towing a travel trailer in hill country. My only point is that using a WDH is far from universal, and in fact almost unheard of when towing boats in the Southeast.

Boats carry much more of the weight over the trailer axles (and have a much lower tongue weight) than campers and are more aerodynamic. I don’t think I have ever seen a boat with a WD. Also think about the fact have you ever seen a boat with a 5th wheel?

I had a 32’ Duckworth that was ~10k lbs (loaded and fueled) that I regularly towed (~5 miles and <35 mph) from dry storage to the ramp) with my LX570 and previous G500. It’s tongue weight was ~500-600 lbs. Comparison, my 7k lb ORV is ~900 lbs on the tongue.

Boat vs camper is not even close to an apples to apples comparison.

 

[TeCKis300]

All trailers can sway. The predominate factors are

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1. Speed - which provides a source of energy that could translate into sway. Particularly under braking where excess momentum of the trailer tries to outrun the tow vehicle by translating into sway.​

2. Loading - particularly not having a COG far enough ahead of the trailer axles for stability, and too much mass behind the trailer axles possibly amplifying resonate sway forces.​

​

What makes travel trailers potentially more prone to sway are a couple other factors. Exacerbated with longer trailers. Just because a long trailer is within weight limits, there's still more danger.

3. Lateral aero push - with larger slab sides to catch wind, effectively tacking in the wind like a sailboat, adds to lateral side forces. The larger the sway event / angle of incidence, the larger the lateral force contribution. Particularly dangerous when combined with the next factor​

4. Trailer yaw moment - having more yaw momentum that a towing vehicle has to manage or arrest upon a large sway event.​

​

It's especially important for a tow vehicle to dampen and constrain any lateral movement to begin (cue WD hitch) with because sway forces can get further amplified once set up. Less compliance in the suspension, tires, can help and inflating tires incrementally more on both the tow vehicle and trailer can be a dial towards better stability.

The 200-series, while having a relatively shorter wheelbase, does have significant mass, especially mass at the rear axle (versus an unladen truck) to dampen sway forces.

Weight distribution hitches are a huge lever and factor to increased stability and margin of stability. There will always be incidentals on the road like unexpected gusts of wind, dynamic situations needing emergency braking or maneuvers, flat tires, failed trailer brakes, etc, that could make a once stable articulated rig, unstable.

It goes beyond that too. A WD hitch doesn't just create more stability. As its namesake, it also distributes weight back to the front axle. This helps the structure so all the tongue weight and dynamic loads aren't purely in cantilever on the ball. The rear axle and tires don't have to work as hard. Prevents unexpected understeer because the front axle doesn't have as much traction for positive control. Shortens braking distances.

And just because a vehicle can be made level via spring rate or airbags, is no where close to the same thing.

IMO for even a small 22' travel trailer, there is no way I wouldn't run a WD hitch for that extra measure and margin of safety. From my experience with 20' to 28' travel trailers, the WD hitch always makes for a better handling and more stable rig. Better ride comfort with less porpoising.