FrazzledHunter
SILVER Star
The wife and I just took 2 laps around the lot with the tech. We jerk stopped to calibrate the REDARC Tow Pro. It stops smooth as butter. It pulls our trailer like nuthin'. The mighty 200 rocks!!! 
Towing with a 200-series Toyota Land Cruiser (3 Viewers)
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Nice camper!
- Thread starter
- #1,803
FWIW I find I need to turn the controller up a bit on the highway and down a bit around town. YMMV of course. If you’re locking the trailer brakes up though, turn it down slightly. If they lock up around town you’ll know it because your wife will shrink down in her seat hoping nobody heard you stopThe wife and I just took 2 laps around the lot with the tech. We jerk stopped to calibrate the REDARC Tow Pro. It stops smooth as butter. It pulls our trailer like nuthin'. The mighty 200 rocks!!!
FrazzledHunter
SILVER Star
We started at 6 and backed it down to 3. At 6 the trailer was stopping the LC!!! Thanks for the tip. We'll experiment around with it.FWIW I find I need to turn the controller up a bit on the highway and down a bit around town. YMMV of course. If you’re locking the trailer brakes up though, turn it down slightly. If they lock up around town you’ll know it because your wife will shrink down in her seat hoping nobody heard you stop
Yes I am sure. You should not 100% charge them if you do not have to. And you should not completely drain them if you dont have to.
Side question not related directly to towing. I currently have a 3000W inverter. I went that big so I can run A/C or the microwave off the inverter if needed, which I have done a few times. But I would say 99% of the time we are only using a couple hundred watts(lets say anywhere from 100-300) a most to maybe charge laptors or other smaller stuff.
Is it worth getting a second smaller inverter, maybe a 700W, so that it runs more efficiently when drawing less power?
Is it worth getting a second smaller inverter, maybe a 700W, so that it runs more efficiently when drawing less power?
At a technical/battery-chemistry level, this is correct.
But there is the question of practicality/value, too. My 100ah batteries cost me $315CAD each, shipped to my door. They are advertised as being good for "up to" 7000 battery cycles.
In the most optimistic projection, we'd camp 50 days per year. (Fat chance, but a man can dream.) My 2x100ah should be able to run my trailer for about 3.5 days. That means 14 cycles per year from camping, but let's round it up to 20 for the year. Even if the battery only gives me 700 cycles (10x less than advertised), that is far, far above what I actually need, and I'll almost certainly have a different trailer by the time the batteries need replacement.
Heck, even if they need to be replaced in as few as 3 years... it's $630CAD. I'll spend 10x more on gas by then.
Which leads me to ask... is keeping the batteries in the optimal charge range worth the worry/headache? For me, no. I'll keep them charged at 100% in transit, to give myself the max camping length/comfort, and replace them when/as needed.
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Well said. Those are my sentiments. Everything has a usable lifespan. LiFePO4s are great for their superior longevity and robustness, great for a set and forget setup.
For me, its is. And with a 3000W inverter and solar panels I can use the batteries for power outages and other things. I could even use them to help charge my Chevy Bolt with the level 1 charger if it came down to that. So I would like to keep them in good shape if possible.
But I generally overbought on batteries(I have 3x 170ah) so I am not too concerned about not having enough on a typical trip and my two 100W solar panels will generally float me day to day once I get to a comfortable charge level. I almost always get home with a 50% charge and don't even have to put the batteries into storage voltage since they are already there.
I also think that the battery degradation can be pretty quick depending on the conditions. If you are towing on a 100+F day in the sun where the inside of your camper is getting really hot, and you have those batteries charged to 100% for a long period of time, that is not great and makes things happen faster. If its a cold day then its not such a big deal.
Where I would consider getting a DC-DC charger is to bump my batteries when I am boondocking and the solar panels are not getting enough sun. In your case with 200 ah, a 60A DC-DC charger would bump your batteries significantly in short amount of time.
And being 200 series owners, most people probably don't really blink at $600, but I do. Not that I'm poor, but I am cheap and thrify, and the LX570 I bought is by a long shot the most expensive vehicle I have owned. Even my F150 Lariat bought brand new in 2015 was about $10k cheaper. While you are probably right that my batteries will last an exceeding long time, I still plan to treat them as best I can.
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In general, I don't like duplicating components for the same use cases unless there were a significant driving reason. I don't know what the standby draw of the 3k inverter is relative to a 700W? Is it enough to warrant another inverter? Maybe could make-up the difference charging your LiFePO4s to a higher state of charge, or getting more solar as IMO 200W solar is undersized for 510Ah of battery?
That said, I do have 2x inverters in my trailer. A 2k one built in (that can run the A/C). Another that's a part of a GoalZero 1000 portable solar generator. Both are wired such that they are capable of powering the whole trailers 120V via automatic transfer switches. The GZ is nice as the integrated 1500W inverter only draws 7W. 2k built-in inverter draws <20W. Both can be on standby practically forever.
I mention the portable solar generator as it expands the use cases it can support. I can easily take-out the battery to run a blender or coffee maker etc away from the trailer. Also allows me to have two banks to draw down depending on situation. And I can charge the GZ away from the trailer. "Installing" it is as easy as plugging in a 12V cig lighter for charge maintenance, and 120V pigtail to power the trailer.
It was less about the standby power than the efficiency of the inverter while operating. An inverter operating at 5% load is relatively inefficient compared to a 30% load. If my wife and I do a working camp trip where we are on laptops all day then we are drawing whatever the laptops are drawing for 8 hours. Lets just say that's 150W between the two(mine is a Lenovo P1 with dedicated GPU and 170W power adapter), my 3000W inverter is probably at 80% efficiency while a 700 would be at 95%+.
So now Im talking 1500 Whr vs 1250 Whr used per day. Its not a huge difference but a difference none the less.
I dont leave my inverters on while not in use so standby draw does not worry me too much.
As for the 200W of solar. It works fine for me because we usually have clear skies and I dont have them roof mounted. I put them on our gravity chairs and keep them perpendicular to the sun all day. I often see 11-12A to the batteries and can usually put about 60 AH into the batteries on a good day. Even 2 weeks ago on my trip I was seeing 11A in February.
That's some impressive solar numbers. Must be one of the perks of living in Utah.
I've got 200W on my current trailer, but have yet to see how it performs.
I do know that I previously had a 100W Renogy portable, and pointed directly into the sun, mid-day, mid-August, on a clear day, the most I ever saw was about 83W of solar charge coming in. Any less than those absolutely ideal conditions and the charge was negligible. Welcome to Canada, eh!
Gotcha, makes sense. There are some other opportunities if efficiency is the goal. Using 12V natively (sorta) using USB-C would be more efficient than an inverter. 170W would be sporty but unless you're hardcore computing or gaming all day, USB-C should easily keep up.
I'd encourage you to look at installed solar as it really rounds out the power solution. For probably the same reason you installed a large battery bank, installed solar makes for an effortless power system that could supplant the need for any DC-DC from the car, or plugging in at home or at sites. I don't even have a working converter in the trailer because 400W of solar is that good and I almost never plug-in. As you know, batteries only store, but solar is a real source of perpetual power.
Problem is my laptop wont even charge off a PD USB charger if its less than like 100W i think. I tried my wifes Lenovo USB C 65W charger and my laptop just sits there and does nothing.
FrazzledHunter
SILVER Star
Well we made it home JUST FINE!!!
I hate to say it and maybe jinx the good luck streak but it was actually a piece of cake.
We did stay off Rt 95 but we did run around the Baltimore Beltway (Rt 695) and then Rt 70W.
We ran in S6 and ECT most of the time which is what I gathered from this thread is the best.
I hate to say it and maybe jinx the good luck streak but it was actually a piece of cake.
We did stay off Rt 95 but we did run around the Baltimore Beltway (Rt 695) and then Rt 70W.
We ran in S6 and ECT most of the time which is what I gathered from this thread is the best.
- The LC towed the trailer like it wasn't there.
- ECT makes a difference - much less shifting around.
- We used a lot of gas: 10-12 MPG LOL.
- The suspension on the trailer (Dexter Torflex) was very smooth even over some washboard areas.
- I monitored some things with my OBD Link
- ATF temps were nominal but this was highway driving with an empty trailer.
- Only surprise was how long the LC stayed in 6th even climbing some hills.
Nice laptop you got there! I don't know what generation of P1 or the specific config and seems like there's some variation to success depending on if you have a dGPU. But there is also some higher end 12V USB-C PD charger that may get you there. A cursory search:
Well we made it home JUST FINE!!!
I hate to say it and maybe jinx the good luck streak but it was actually a piece of cake.
We did stay off Rt 95 but we did run around the Baltimore Beltway (Rt 695) and then Rt 70W.
We ran in S6 and ECT most of the time which is what I gathered from this thread is the best.
By far the biggest PITA was getting stuck behind a Prius for about 15 miles doing 45MPH in a 55MPH zone, no doubt trying to save gas.
- The LC towed the trailer like it wasn't there.
- ECT makes a difference - much less shifting around.
- We used a lot of gas: 10-12 MPG LOL.
- The suspension on the trailer (Dexter Torflex) was very smooth even over some washboard areas.
- I monitored some things with my OBD Link
- ATF temps were nominal but this was highway driving with an empty trailer.
- Only surprise was how long the LC stayed in 6th even climbing some hills.
10-12 is very good IMHO. My trip 2 weeks ago I averaged 7.9 on the way there, 7.5 to the second state park we went to, and 8.5 on the way home.
I towed ~20,000 miles with my F150 Ecoboost and saw anything from 6.7 to 10.8 average depending on conditions. 6.7 was driving from the Black Hills back to UT as an early season snowstorm was blowing across WY. 10.8 was also in WY heading east with a stout tailwind. My overall average was probably around 9.
FrazzledHunter
SILVER Star
I'm only guessing. We ran around town a bit before we hitched up. I'll have much better numbers after a few full to near-empty fills when we're towing 100% of the time between fills.
- Thread starter
- #1,819
Wow, 10+ mpg. I’m jealous. I usually get about 7 to 7.5Well we made it home JUST FINE!!!
I hate to say it and maybe jinx the good luck streak but it was actually a piece of cake.
We did stay off Rt 95 but we did run around the Baltimore Beltway (Rt 695) and then Rt 70W.
We ran in S6 and ECT most of the time which is what I gathered from this thread is the best.
By far the biggest PITA was getting stuck behind a Prius for about 15 miles doing 45MPH in a 55MPH zone, no doubt trying to save gas.
- The LC towed the trailer like it wasn't there.
- ECT makes a difference - much less shifting around.
- We used a lot of gas: 10-12 MPG LOL.
- The suspension on the trailer (Dexter Torflex) was very smooth even over some washboard areas.
- I monitored some things with my OBD Link
- ATF temps were nominal but this was highway driving with an empty trailer.
- Only surprise was how long the LC stayed in 6th even climbing some hills.
An interesting thing highlighted recently by @radman is how tranny temps remain lower in Normal mode instead of ETC PWR. It would be interesting to understand if this could eek out more MPGs under towing.
I almost exclusively use ETC PWR when towing and haven't really compared. The lower temps suggest that normal mode is more aggressive to lockup the torque converter which makes sense. More lockup reduces temps, but it would also impact efficiency. IIRC, ETC PWR when not towing can make almost 1 MPG difference. And when towing, 1MPG is 10% more fuel efficiency which can be a big deal.
I do like the more aggressive throttle mapping of ETC PWR which is less effort when really heavy. It should hold gears out longer which again helps. When the TC is unlocked, is does create more dynamic gearing. All of which is helpful as designed. At the trade of efficiency.
It does make sense and perhaps understanding that can be an opportunity to eek out more MPG, if desired. Will have to give that a whirl next time.
I almost exclusively use ETC PWR when towing and haven't really compared. The lower temps suggest that normal mode is more aggressive to lockup the torque converter which makes sense. More lockup reduces temps, but it would also impact efficiency. IIRC, ETC PWR when not towing can make almost 1 MPG difference. And when towing, 1MPG is 10% more fuel efficiency which can be a big deal.
I do like the more aggressive throttle mapping of ETC PWR which is less effort when really heavy. It should hold gears out longer which again helps. When the TC is unlocked, is does create more dynamic gearing. All of which is helpful as designed. At the trade of efficiency.
It does make sense and perhaps understanding that can be an opportunity to eek out more MPG, if desired. Will have to give that a whirl next time.
