The 2H/12H-T/1HZ/1HD-T/1HD-FT Gturbo Alternative Tech Thread

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Yes I did. I didn't know about the aftermarket stuff though as I have a habit of searching for stock turbos. I always wanted a 16t but it's considered a "high pressure" turbo option for the Volvo and was less common than the 13t which was standard. Both map well but the 16t can do more rpms and more PR. I'm not 100% but arent the 221's and the hL's turbine housings interchangeable? Might give more tuning options.
 
Td04hl 16t / he221 basically the same thing . There are some variants with both models like turbine housing size , cast or billet compressors, blade count on turbine and compressor . And different thrusts . The holsets were always marketed as being an "extreme duty" turbo over the early mhi stuff . From the few I've seen the turbines are the interchangeable .
 
Td04hl 16t / he221 basically the same thing . There are some variants with both models like turbine housing size , cast or billet compressors, blade count on turbine and compressor . And different thrusts . The holsets were always marketed as being an "extreme duty" turbo over the early mhi stuff . From the few I've seen the turbines are the interchangeable .

HE221 compressor is bigger than 16T in every dimension. The HE221 is 60x44.2mm. 16T is 56x43.4mm. The 221 also is designed for maximum boost and minimum surge. It trades off efficiency for effectiveness.

HE221 turbine is a different type, but dimensionally interchangeable.
 
HE221 compressor is bigger than 16T in every dimension. The HE221 is 60x44.2mm. 16T is 56x43.4mm. The 221 also is designed for maximum boost and minimum surge. It trades off efficiency for effectiveness.

HE221 turbine is a different type, but dimensionally interchangeable.

I used to think the same but was shown some he221 Turbos with cast compressors that measure the same as a 16t

Then there's the 16t extended tip compressor plus whatever other variants aftermarket manufacturers are doing. Garrett gtb2260vk is 60x44.5 and have heard billet versions are being done for the td04hL . Not sure the .3mm would really be worth the $.

The 221 turbine is more efficient and most aftermarket turbo builders will use it over the td04hl turbine when offering upgrades or rebuilds
 
HE221 compressor is bigger than 16T in every dimension. The HE221 is 60x44.2mm. 16T is 56x43.4mm. The 221 also is designed for maximum boost and minimum surge. It trades off efficiency for effectiveness.

HE221 turbine is a different type, but dimensionally interchangeable.

It's the tip design and wheel OD that take the HE221 compressor to a PR of 4. 16T map stops at PR3. But yes there are many HE221 variants.

Aftermarket TD04HL turbines are similar but different to the HE221. The often minor differences you get with copies vs the real thing.
 
So I went to see the turbo shop. So the comp wheel in the turbo is a 16g, and I was assured that this is a setup they did previously on a 13bt with great results.

Old mate had a look and decided my wastegate actuator wasn't holding the wastegate closed hard enough. My old actuator was leaking from an old welded repair so I'd switched to an eBay mambatek one. We roughly wired it closed and sure enough got better results, similar to the ct26. I didn't query the wheel sizes or why the invoice showed a 20g.

The force of the mamba wastegate actuator had seemed similar to stock to me, and I was very skeptical that the wastegate was so easily forced open, but sure enough it was. I've now fitted the strongest spring that came with the actuator and preloaded the rod heavily as well. I'm going to recheck through my setup, especially as I noticed some oil that looked to have leaked from the boost compensator.

I think something's not right as it seems like the turbo is slightly slower to build boost than the ct26 and won't peak as high. I haven't changed much on the truck, but did remove intercooler pipes etc and replaced the fuel lines and checked the spill timing. It doesn't help that it was over 2 months ago since I last drove it. I'll check everything over and go from there, I don't want to twice be quick to blame the turbo but actually overlook my own errors.
 
So I went to see the turbo shop. So the comp wheel in the turbo is a 16g, and I was assured that this is a setup they did previously on a 13bt with great results.

Old mate had a look and decided my wastegate actuator wasn't holding the wastegate closed hard enough. My old actuator was leaking from an old welded repair so I'd switched to an eBay mambatek one. We roughly wired it closed and sure enough got better results, similar to the ct26. I didn't query the wheel sizes or why the invoice showed a 20g.

The force of the mamba wastegate actuator had seemed similar to stock to me, and I was very skeptical that the wastegate was so easily forced open, but sure enough it was. I've now fitted the strongest spring that came with the actuator and preloaded the rod heavily as well. I'm going to recheck through my setup, especially as I noticed some oil that looked to have leaked from the boost compensator.

I think something's not right as it seems like the turbo is slightly slower to build boost than the ct26 and won't peak as high. I haven't changed much on the truck, but did remove intercooler pipes etc and replaced the fuel lines and checked the spill timing. It doesn't help that it was over 2 months ago since I last drove it. I'll check everything over and go from there, I don't want to twice be quick to blame the turbo but actually overlook my own errors.

A 16g should still go well on the 13bt although is on the large side
I find mamba actuators a bit hit and miss. Some are fine some are inconsistent
 
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Hey guys, I have a td06-20g external gate for sale, only selling as my manifold is leaking and I am going a larger garret. Not as laggy as you would think spools hard. Asking $1350.
 
Well I tightened a few hose clamps, but I couldn't find anything amiss. Going for a quick motorway test drive suggests similar performance to the ct26, but slightly slower to spool up even though it starts boosting at maybe 1500rpm rather than 1600 previously. It doesn't take off till above 2000rpm.

I've started to experiment with the preload on the boost compensater, though the turbo shop assured me that this should spool up quickly without the need for extra fuel. However when I mentioned that the spill timing was advanced to approx 14deg btdc (stock is 11), he did say that might not be not be helping. It looks quite cunty to get at one of the bolts holding the pump in place so I don't think I'll experiment with the timing any time soon. Also, this is the same setup the ct26 was running, so everything else being equal, this should spool much quicker due to the smaller turbine housing?

It seems that it's laggy as much as needing rpm. Ie cruising at 1800-1900rpm 3rd gear, I plant the foot and the boost builds slowly, the gauge doesn't seem to climb much faster than starting at 1500rpm. I might try switching back to the factory crossover pipe(no intercooler) as my next experiment.
 
Well I tightened a few hose clamps, but I couldn't find anything amiss. Going for a quick motorway test drive suggests similar performance to the ct26, but slightly slower to spool up even though it starts boosting at maybe 1500rpm rather than 1600 previously. It doesn't take off till above 2000rpm.

I've started to experiment with the preload on the boost compensater, though the turbo shop assured me that this should spool up quickly without the need for extra fuel. However when I mentioned that the spill timing was advanced to approx 14deg btdc (stock is 11), he did say that might not be not be helping. It looks quite cunty to get at one of the bolts holding the pump in place so I don't think I'll experiment with the timing any time soon. Also, this is the same setup the ct26 was running, so everything else being equal, this should spool much quicker due to the smaller turbine housing?

It seems that it's laggy as much as needing rpm. Ie cruising at 1800-1900rpm 3rd gear, I plant the foot and the boost builds slowly, the gauge doesn't seem to climb much faster than starting at 1500rpm. I might try switching back to the factory crossover pipe(no intercooler) as my next experiment.

Advancing timing does retard spool. But 14 deg isn't excessive.

Do you have an EGT or AFR gauge? Ideally you need to set the boost compensator to allow enough fuel for ~600C or 18:1 A/F with no boost. Some excessively limit fuel. Which is good if you're avoiding smoke at altitude but can bring the suck.

The same turbo shop does a HE221 clone which would have been ideal, but more work to fit.
 
This turbo is a brand new ct26 core which *I think* is machined for the 16g. Could the he221 wheels not be made to fit?

Yes I have a preturbo egt. I'll have a play tomorrow, now the incessant rain has finally fecked off it's no longer a total misery trying to do stuff with the truck.
 
This turbo is a brand new ct26 core which *I think* is machined for the 16g. Could the he221 wheels not be made to fit?

Yes I have a preturbo egt. I'll have a play tomorrow, now the incessant rain has finally fecked off it's no longer a total misery trying to do stuff with the truck.

HE221 is a completely different turbo frame. So the parts won't fit.

I was hoping for more snow. But it's still early in the season!
 
Previously I *believe* i had a stock 13bt ct26. I have the wheels kicking about so I can put the vernier on them if it matters. It was definitely the stock turbine housing, noticeably larger than the new housing. The center housing was apparently flogged out.

The new turbo is supposedly the 1hdfte turbine housing, a ct26 core, 1hdfte turbine wheel, 16g compressor, with my old ct26 compressor housing. I don't know exactly what machining was involved in making this fit together.

This was put together by a well known new zealand turbo shop, several posters pm'd me about this and had only had positive dealings with them. I spoke to them again, and they said there's the possibility to put a smaller compressor wheel in there, involving some machining, but they don't want to do it before putting the truck on a dyno "to see what's going on, where it's making its torque etc".

What I think that really means is that they don't trust that there isn't something else wrong, with the fuel pump for example. To be fair the truck is a 1970s Land Rover, and a few things on it are pretty rough. I know the only performance difference between now and a few months ago with the ct26, is the low/slow boost below 2k rpm. I replaced the fuel lines, checked the spill timing, and adjusted the valve clearances, otherwise didn't do anything to the pump/engine. Up until i bought this truck I spent all my time and money on dirtbikes, and going back a few years road bikes. I've always pissed about with jetting, exhausts, air boxes, squish etc on 2strokes. The trick to the 'seat of the pants dyno' is to only change one variable at a time. Once in a blue moon something coincidentally breaks at the same time as you make another change and sends you on a wild goose chase, but I don't think that's happened here.

I've dropped a lot of money on this truck since I bought it bringing it up to spec, and particularly the last few months. I took it off the road to rebuild the transfer box and ended up getting the gearbox rebuilt, new rear prop made up, rad recored, and of course the turbo upgrade because the old one was blowing and leaking oil with crazy end float. I'm pretty bummed out to put it all back together to find the turbo is worse than stock, can't produce more than about 6psi till after 2k rpm. The landy runs 3.54 diffs so 2k rpm is 80kph in 4th or 100kph in 5th. 4th is gonna suck on the hills.

The turbo shop said they would try and sort something out with the dyno tuners they work with, but i've not heard anything back and realistically I've run out of time and money for the moment. I'm waiting on a visa change to be approved so I can move to a different part of NZ to start a new job. The landy is driveable for now so I'll make the move, replenish the bank balance, get another daily driver (current daily is about ready to be scrapped so I'm not taking it with me), then look at getting a smaller comp wheel put in. I'll probably go to a different shop though.
 
The new turbo is supposedly the 1hdfte turbine housing, a ct26 core, 1hdfte turbine wheel,

1HD-FTE turbine housing won't mate to a CT-26 core, unless they have machined the CT-26 core. There is a significant difference in size between the two cores where the turbine housing bolts up.

I think if you had a 1HD-FTE Turbine, and turbine housing, the difference in early boost would be very obvious in comparison to the CT-26 turbine and housing. It certainly is on my 1HZ.

I did some measurements to compare the two different turbins, cores, housings etc.

There's some pics and info in the post linked below, and the following posts

The 2H/12H-T/1HZ/1HD-T/1HD-FT Gturbo Alternative Tech Thread
 
In the post i lnked above, you'll see i highlighted casting numbers on the two turbine housings. If you can see the casting number on your turbine, its easy to cross reference to be 100% sure what you have.

Its worth noting as well, that the shaft size for the CT20B (hd-fte turbo) is quite a bit thinner too. It woud take a bit of work to mate the CT20B turbine and housing to the CT26 CHRA
 
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I think if you had a 1HD-FTE Turbine, and turbine housing, the difference in early boost would be very obvious in comparison to the CT-26 turbine and housing. It certainly is on my 1HZ.
Yup that was what I was expecting, and the response from the turbo shop is that they would expect that too, hence why they think something is wrong elsewhere.

I've had a look at the airflow figures for 3.4l and 4.2l, and the 16g compressor map. The 3.4 is off to the left side of the map till mid 2000s rpm at moderate boost. The 4.2 is a bit closer to the middle (efficient?) part of the map at the lower rpm numbers, but not massively so. This is the small 16g. The big 16g looks worse, the 3.4 would be quite close to the surge line at lower rpm. I don't know which 16g I have...

The invoice listed ct26 chra, but I didn't actually check that with them, so maybe it's actually the ct20b center? I haven't compared it to the old one, but it fits up with my stock oil and coolant lines.


It's probably going to have to wait a month or so now before I play around with it. I went with the turbo shop because I wanted it right first time, wanted it to last, and because I didn't have the time or patience to try and score something 2nd hand and play about with it myself. I've spent far too little time driving the truck since I bought it six months ago.
 
So if my info is correct (it's a bit shady for CT20B as I've relied on others to collect measurements) that's a 1HD-FTE turbine with a 6cm housing which should give you a corrected flow of ~13 lb/min. That should deliver decent spool.

Looking at your install it's clear why they went this route, it's the only bolt-in option.

I think you need it tuned to see what the turbo can do. Do you have an EGT gauge?

That air-cone thing pretending to be a filter. Is it new? It'll be sucking hot air in that part of the engine bay which will delay spool. It's right in the air-flow of the cone of hot air thrown off the radiator fan.

*edit for wrong numbers earlier*
 
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Well the casting number does match 1HD-FTE, and the size of the CHRA looks like it would be the CT20B too, but it's hard to tell from the pics alone.
You could measure and compare the diameter of the CHRA where the turbine housing clamps on. There's 10 or 15mm difference in diameter (can't remember the diameters) CT26 is larger
 
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