Stock tires/rims with Spacers

[fj5000]

Yes, the Michelin Defenders in P275/65/18 (116T) are considered an outstanding tire. I like mine but the look is not "cool". I've never had the stock Dunlops but I assume the softness is comparable. Note my size is one higher and a bit narrower than OEM, but if you leave the spidertrax (which I don't think changed the ride) the 275 width is fine. Spidertraxx are not needed at that size, but the look of the LC is better with the tires less inboard (in my opinion of course). I run stock 2019 LC wheels with 1" Bora hub centric spacers.

That said, the height difference isn't huge vs stock Dunlops. You can compare here but there will still be variations by brand: Tire Size Comparison - https://tiresize.com/comparison/

On my 275/65/18 Defenders, on a 2013 LC, the size change made my speedometer dead on with GPS speed, FWIW. The Defenders handle well, are very highly reviewed, and seem to last forever.

If you want a little more "fill the wheel well" look and stick with P-rated, the primary (only?) option is the General Grabber APT P rated 275/70/18 (the stock tire and size on some Nissan Titans). https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...GRAPTOWL&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes

Thank you. Very helpful. Your set up is where I’m tracking. I have the 1 inch bora’s on way. Would you mind taking some pics of this setup?

Sounds ideal — thank you again.

 

[fj5000]

I would start by removing the spacers since they do increase your scrub radius, which is usually what causes a harsh ride over rough roads. The guys from Shock Therapy have a great video explaining how scrub radius impacts ride quality.

Also really helpful. I’m going to try to get a thinner spacer and p-metric tire and see if that does it. Otherwise I’ll just go back to stock set up.

I did notice that the psi on all four tires were uneven - went to shop and had them all run at 38. I will say this made a meaningful change for the better. It’s still not where I want it but I could live with this if I had to.

Something about the spacer (any spacer) on car that has me searching for peace of mind - despite zero vibration etc.

 

[CharlieS]

Interesting video, that really helped me to visualize what you all have been talking about around scrub radius. I didn't do the maths, but maybe for those of us that have increased the radius of our tires and are also running spacers, the scrub radius impact is minimized. Out 1.25" with the spidertrax, but at the same time up an inch with the 33" tires, keeping the delta between the centerline and the "king pin" line (imaginary axis drawn through the UCA and LCA pivots) about the same where it meets the ground?

 

[BVE]

I was running 275/70/18s on stock 2013 rims with Spidertrax and I too also felt like they were super harsh and also made my steering have more play in the wheel.
I just had Icon Rebounds installed and the spacers removed since the offset is +25mm on the icons. I’m so glad I bought these wheels, my truck feels normal again.
Anyone in San Diego looking for spacers hit me up, I’ll give you a killer deal.

 

[Tex68w]

I went 275/70-18 (LT KO2s) - I love this tire while towing but daily driving is too harsh. I have a small lift so hesitate to go back to stock size but I wouldn't mind getting out of an E-rated next round.

I run that same size/make tire on our 200, I have over 3000 miles with them now and I couldn't be happier. I was originally running 40-42psi as that's what the book suggests and it's where Discount set them after install, but I have since dropped down to 37/38psi and I think they are much better. The tire overall has improved stability along with performance and looks.

 

[TheGrrrrr]

I would adjust pressure and if that doesn’t do it, go with the tire size/design you want but in a C or D load rating. Those two things will have an exponentially bigger impact than spacers. In my experience, the biggest impacts to ride quality are (in order of significance):

1. Suspension
2. Tread Design (AT vs Mud etc.)
3. Tire Load Rating
4. Tire Pressure
5. Alignment
6. Spacers?

 

[studawg]

I did notice that the psi on all four tires were uneven - went to shop and had them all run at 38. I will say this made a meaningful change for the better. It’s still not where I want it but I could live with this if I had to.

Theres just too many variables going on here to make an accurate judgment.

First of all, it sounds like you didn't even know what pressure you had in your tires before you started this thread. And you actually took your truck into a shop to have them adjust air pressure? Ok.

Get your tire pressure correct before you start making any judgments on why you think your ride is harsh.

Second, according to this thread

Heritage vs base REAR springs - HE & 2020 base owners, could use your help - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/heritage-vs-base-rear-springs-he-2020-base-owners-could-use-your-help.1208883/

...the non-Heritage Edition springs are heavier spring rate than the HE springs, so thats at least ONE factor affecting your ride.

Sorry but this feels like it has all been a waste of time.

 

[TeCKis300]

I would adjust pressure and if that doesn’t do it, go with the tire size/design you want but in a C or D load rating. Those two things will have an exponentially bigger impact than spacers. In my experience, the biggest impacts to ride quality are (in order of significance):

1. Suspension
2. Tread Design (AT vs Mud etc.)
3. Tire Load Rating
4. Tire Pressure
5. Alignment
6. Spacers?

Good point on spacers. I agree it's not what's making ride quality harsh here. Spacers has impacts to scrub radius and bump steer, but not really ride quality. That said, a narrower spacer would serve his tire size better.

 

[TeCKis300]

Theres just too many variables going on here to make an accurate judgment.

First of all, it sounds like you didn't even know what pressure you had in your tires before you started this thread. And you actually took your truck into a shop to have them adjust air pressure? Ok.

Get your tire pressure correct before you start making any judgments on why you think your ride is harsh.

Second, according to this thread

Heritage vs base REAR springs - HE & 2020 base owners, could use your help - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/heritage-vs-base-rear-springs-he-2020-base-owners-could-use-your-help.1208883/

...the non-Heritage Edition springs are heavier spring rate than the HE springs, so thats at least ONE factor affecting your ride.

Sorry but this feels like it has all been a waste of time.

I disagree. There was nothing wrong with the OPs question and he provided what info he thought was relevant. With additional discovery as it went along. His impressions are perfectly appropriate as he was looking for more info.

He knows his car rode well prior with the same suspension, that part has not changed. While HE vs non-HEs might ride a bit different, they're both worth of descent ride quality.

 

[fj5000]

Theres just too many variables going on here to make an accurate judgment.

First of all, it sounds like you didn't even know what pressure you had in your tires before you started this thread. And you actually took your truck into a shop to have them adjust air pressure? Ok.

Get your tire pressure correct before you start making any judgments on why you think your ride is harsh.

Second, according to this thread

Heritage vs base REAR springs - HE & 2020 base owners, could use your help - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/heritage-vs-base-rear-springs-he-2020-base-owners-could-use-your-help.1208883/

...the non-Heritage Edition springs are heavier spring rate than the HE springs, so thats at least ONE factor affecting your ride.

Sorry but this feels like it has all been a waste of time.

Funny. This forum is incredibly useful (fact) but also has a group of people that take it in the wrong direction/too seriously/too personal. Case in point above. (Sorry for wasting your time?? - maybe don’t invest your time if it’s so valuable?) Cripes.

There are three factors that separate my current issue from the stock ride. The non HE springs are the same spring on any 200 (perhaps from 2016 or even earlier to today). My ride after replacing HE springs with a set of Base springs was excellent. Normal. What I have expected from previously driving two other 200’s in years past.

That is baseline. Now - 1) new tires at larger size and e rating. 2) 1.25 spacers. 3) psi on said e rated tire. These are the variables that I’m playing with. Dealer stated 41 all around. After reading these helpful psi comments I noticed they were all out of whack. Had then evened and put to 38.

Ride here at 38psi is much better. Still stinks in comparison to stock. Will move to p metric and test with /without spacers to see where this ends up.

I’ve had a few people reach me independently and have expressed interest in how this unfolds - so will let all know of what gets me feeling close to stock - which for me - may end up being the stock set up again.

 

[TheGrrrrr]

Funny. This forum is incredibly useful (fact) but also has a group of people that take it in the wrong direction/too seriously/too personal. Case in point above. (Sorry for wasting your time?? - maybe don’t invest your time if it’s so valuable?) Cripes.

There are three factors that separate my current issue from the stock ride. The non HE springs are the same spring on any 200 (perhaps from 2016 or even earlier to today). My ride after replacing HE springs with a set of Base springs was excellent. Normal. What I have expected from previously driving two other 200’s in years past.

That is baseline. Now - 1) new tires at larger size and e rating. 2) 1.25 spacers. 3) psi on said e rated tire. These are the variables that I’m playing with. Dealer stated 41 all around. After reading these helpful psi comments I noticed they were all out of whack. Had then evened and put to 38.

Ride here at 38psi is much better. Still stinks in comparison to stock. Will move to p metric and test with /without spacers to see where this ends up.

I’ve had a few people reach me independently and have expressed interest in how this unfolds - so will let all know of what gets me feeling close to stock - which for me - may end up being the stock set up again.

I would make one change at a time. I doubt you need to go all the way to P rated tires and could probably still do an AT tire in C load rating. Honestly that will probably make the biggest difference by far. What ever you do, keep the spacers for a while with the new tires, so you know what each change did individually.

 

[fj5000]

I would make one change at a time. I doubt you need to go all the way to P rated tires and could probably still do an AT tire in C load rating. Honestly that will probably make the biggest difference by far. What ever you do, keep the spacers for a while with the new tires, so you know what each change did individually.

Yes - exactly (spacers) will keep and play around. I’m also feeling like the 1.25 is too wide for me. Bora 1inxh is coming soon and would think a skinnier spacer would also help with reducing scrub radius and thereby make ride a bit better too. (Very helpful video posted btw)

 

[1carnut]

Thanks for getting this back in track. Yes. I switched from stock pmetric Dunlop’s to e rated Michelin defender 285/65/18.

I think the HE rides high so I pulled the rear springs and replaced them with stock springs. Lowered the rear end about an inch +.

Car ran perfect. Smooth etc. I’ve owned three of these 200’s. All of them with the oem spec tires. This one - I decided I wanted a tire that 1) filled out wheel well better, 2) sat flush or close to flush with the fenders. On top of the new tires - I added spidertrax 1.25 from Eric S.

First set of e rated tires. It’s the tires, the psi, or the spacers. Or a combo of them all that is creating a firm ride. I’m going to lower the psi first to 37/38 as discussed - then try without spacers. Then try the Dunlop’s I still have with and without spacers...

Sounds like the 275/65/18 in pmetric (defender) is a nice riding tire? Any comparisons to the Dunlop’s? (In terms of comfort - as that is all I’m going for).

All of this was done for looks - I can go right back to the oem setup if need be - but was curious if it was possible to keep the oem feel of the truck with a better looking tire set up (with tires that are highway tires)

I've been thinking the same about the combination of the HE specific rear springs and the e-rated Toyo 285/65/18s we're running. I've tried pressures as high as 50 psi and as low as 34 for on road and i can find a level of ride stability i find satisfactory. Truck is sitting at close to 6800 lbs with just me onboard given the bigger tires, budbuilt steel, gamiviti roof rack, 4 person RTT and the drawer system we've added. I'm thinking it might be worth changing the rear springs to the regular LC parts as well as going to a none e-rated tire before going straight to a BP-51 as i really don't want to lift it any higher especially in the back!

 

[CharlieS]

I've been thinking the same about the combination of the HE specific rear springs and the e-rated Toyo 285/65/18s we're running. I've tried pressures as high as 50 psi and as low as 34 for on road and i can find a level of ride stability i find satisfactory. Truck is sitting at close to 6800 lbs with just me onboard given the bigger tires, budbuilt steel, gamiviti roof rack, 4 person RTT and the drawer system we've added. I'm thinking it might be worth changing the rear springs to the regular LC parts as well as going to a none e-rated tire before going straight to a BP-51 as i really don't want to lift it any higher especially in the back!

Maybe get the RCTIP from @gaijin? The information he has provided has always worked for me.

Rear ride height is determined by your springs, not the shocks, so if you keep your current springs, the BP-51 shocks won’t impact the ride height.

 

[Nola622]

I've been thinking the same about the combination of the HE specific rear springs and the e-rated Toyo 285/65/18s we're running. I've tried pressures as high as 50 psi and as low as 34 for on road and i can find a level of ride stability i find satisfactory. Truck is sitting at close to 6800 lbs with just me onboard given the bigger tires, budbuilt steel, gamiviti roof rack, 4 person RTT and the drawer system we've added. I'm thinking it might be worth changing the rear springs to the regular LC parts as well as going to a none e-rated tire before going straight to a BP-51 as i really don't want to lift it any higher especially in the back!

I'm confused - are you saying you are currently running HE rear springs and also have sliders, roof rack, RTT and drawer system? Sounds like you should change the rear springs. OME or Dobinsons will have plenty of options lower or equal to HE rear ride height.

 

[1carnut]

I'm confused - are you saying you are currently running HE rear springs and also have sliders, roof rack, RTT and drawer system? Sounds like you should change the rear springs. OME or Dobinsons will have plenty of options lower or equal to HE rear ride height.

yeah that's right so we're typically rolling around at about 6800-7000lbs when we're not fully loaded for a trip at close to 7300lbs when we are. Between the added weight, e-rated tires and the HE rear springs i can't seem to figure out how to find the best combination of ride and handling. Even with the rear drawers installed and loaded up that rear end sits at least an inch higher than the front. I've been running 37lbs through the winter but now since i remounted to RTT this weekend it again feels all over the road even with the increased outside temp. Checking out some other tire forums most folks are basically saying you're an idiot and will surely ruin your tires and most likely die if you run e-rated tires at high speeds below 50ish lbs. I've never encountered such a polarizing question with so many hugely diverse opinions