Seeking Advice on FJ40 Diesel Swap (1 Viewer)

[ceylonfj40nut]

I think you need to think gasoline not diesel. You cant pass people with the 350 TBI? My son has a 40 with a 350 carbed engine mated to a 3 spd transmission. He beats me hands down in my 5.7 Tundra. He does 80 mph routinely on trips we take. Never has an issue passing anyone. Maybe you need to get your 350 dialed in or buy a refreshed motor. Easy because its already what you have the rig set up for, parts are readily available, cheap, and they are reliable. I will get laughed out of the room here but it has been a great combination. No diesel will match gasoline v8s on power and acceleration. Reliability is perspective. Diesels are viewed as more long lasting and more durable, “ less frequent breakdowns”. Many have said Toyota diesels are nice, but none will give you the off the seat grunt of a v8. I would not want to be stuck on a remote trail due to a part that i need yo get from Japan and have to wait 3 weeks. Having parts available at any big box store at a moments notice in the “ event of a breakdown” is reliability’s other side of the coin. I would want to hitch a ride to the closest big box store and hitch back to get me out. I love Toyota and everything about. I have more than a few cruisers. For today’s highways i would seek a chevy V8. Keep everything else Toyota. Best bang for the reliability and power combination. Diesels are cool. I have a few. Only time enjoy diesels is on the trail in 4LO. I dont enjoy enjoy getting to the trails to use it as much. I live in TX which takes a while to get out from to see the cool places. I want to spend more time at destination even though i enjoy the journey to destination.

The fuel economy argument is questionable at best. In most paces diesel is about 25% more expensive than gasoline. Diesels rarely get 25% more gas mileage. Its usually a wash. Add compound turbos and increased fueling for more power and its going the wrong direction.

My diesel experience (Ford 7.3L and multiple 2H diesels) has taught me that cold climate starts are tough on the engine and can be a reliability issue. Even with gloplugs and all. Block heaters work, but not in remote locations during a trip. I would hate to be stuck on a mountain or remote places on cold mornings, waiting to thaw.

Walking myself out of this room…..

 

[mudgudgeon]

Walking myself out of this room…..

Don't let the door smack you on the ass on the way out . . .

 

[ceylonfj40nut]

Don't let the door smack you on the ass on the way out . . .

Oh it did.

 

[mudgudgeon]

Many have said Toyota diesels are nice, but none will give you the off the seat grunt of a v8.

Probably true, but a tuned up 1hd-t, 1hd-fte etc have gobs of torque from idle, and can be a hell of a lot of fun to drive. They surprise a lot of people

The fuel economy argument is questionable at best. In most paces diesel is about 25% more expensive than gasoline. Diesels rarely get 25% more gas mileage. Its usually a wash.

My hdj80 would use about 14litres/100 km. Less if you babied it. More if having fun with it.
My fzj80 gets 17L+/100km.
Both 5 speed manual, stock gearing, 33s

My diesel experience has taught me that cold climate starts are tough on the engine and can be a reliability issue. Even with gloplugs and all.

My hdj80 never had any issue starting in cold weather down to about -5⁰c.
It fired on the first compression every time.
It would run rough for 1 minute max if really cold

 

[veiloctane]

For a motor with 275,000 km? I know they are diesels, but I'm not sure I'd want to do a full build and throw in a motor/tranny with that many miles. Am I looking at that incorrectly? Not sure what a rebuild would be be, but guessing that it would be pretty expensive.

275k km lots of life left in my opinion but if you want to rebuild there's lots of kits out there

here is a performance upgrade kit CUSTOM 1HDFTE PERFORMANCE REBUILD KIT ND1HDFTEKIT | Noordeman Diesel - https://www.noordeman.com.au/product/custom-1hdfte-performance-rebuild-kit-nd1hdftekit/

 

[veiloctane]

Probably true, but a tuned up 1hd-t, 1hd-fte etc have gobs of torque from idle, and can be a hell of a lot of fun to drive. They surprise a lot of people


My hdj80 would use about 14litres/100 km. Less if you babied it. More if having fun with it.
My fzj80 gets 17L+/100km.
Both 5 speed manual, stock gearing, 33s


My hdj80 never had any issue starting in cold weather down to about -5⁰c.
It fired on the first compression every time.
It would run rough for 1 minute max if really cold

100% agree with @mudgudgeon All my cruisers will be going Diesel from now on!

no issues with cold weather here we can reach -40C here in the Canadian igloo tundra

have good batteries/and suitable glow plugs to mind you I have a Webasto coolant heater and I run HOT SHOT’S SECRET INTRODUCES EDT+ WINTER DEFENSE DIESEL FUEL ADDITIVE all year round because the warmer months are only a few

other diesel winter additives will be fine it just took me a while to find out what really works for me.

 

[dbransco]

I appreciate all input! Even Ceylons gas engine suggestion! I have contemplated going with a gas engine, but I believe I'm set now on diesel. It's tough for me to decide, because I have not experienced any of tge engine I'm considering. See s to be a lot of love for the 1HD-FTE and I certainly like tge idea of staying Toyota. The cost of admission seems a but high when compared to North American options or even Mercedes, etc. I believe I have narrowed down my direction to tge 1HD-FTE, the Duramax 2.8L or Mercedes OM606. On paper, I don't think any of these option ls will disappoint.
To address Ceylons question, I can maintain good speeds with the 350 TBI (70 or so), but it's not real impressive from a start. Don't get me wrong, it moves the FJ40 fine. I purchased it with the 350, as well as the NV4500. I don't know what gearing. The engine came out of a early 90s Caprice and seems like it may be a bit tired. Regardless, I plan to take it down to the frame and redo things, so I know what's been done and have a good sense of comfort.

 

[vica153]

As someone who has spent a lot of time and money replacing an old V8 with a 606, I would recommend keeping the V8. Spend the money on gas and spend the time having fun in your FJ40.

4BT would a huge downgrade in terms of power and drivability. They were crappy and old in 2003. It really shouldn't be on anyone's list of engine choices in 2023. Crank up the boost to get more power and you still have tiny power band and terrible drivability. OM606 in stock form would also be worse than a 350. Maybe on par with a worn out 350. Spend money turning up the fuel and you can make peak power better, but its not going to have the throttle response and low end of the 350.

If you really want a diesel the 606 is good, but 648 is a better option. The VW 4 cylinders could be a better option if you can be happy with ~150hp/250lbft and awesome MPG. Newer, 100x more common, cheaper, more efficient. You could tune them to be on par with an worn out 350 and still get awesome MPG. Tuned 1.9L VW beats 4BT in every way except for the slow and heavy contest. Even the old Toyota diesels would hardly make any more power and then you're dealing with an old-expensive-rare-big-heavy toyota engine. Tiny VW engine leaves tons of space in the engine bay and you can get parts same day anywhere in the US.

If you're entertaining other gas engine options, I recommend the GM Atlas (Vortec) 4200. 4.2L inline 6 makes ~275 HP and TQ. 20MPG on the highway in a 4500lb SUV. Modern enough to have variable valve timing, but otherwise old and simple. GM engine so parts should be cheaper and easier to get. And if you get the itch for more power the inline 6 is easy to turbo and make +500hp.

 

[toddm]

Mine came with a 350 and auto and I hated it. I currently have a 1KZ-TE in my FJ40 (3.0L I4 out of a JDM Surf). If I were to do it over again I would probably go with a VW of some sort. The 4 cylinders have been put in a few 40's already. I daydream of using one of the 3.0 V6 TDI's out of a Touareg- 240hp/400ftlb in stock trim and a tune from Malone will get it to 305hp/490ftlb. The VW V6 TDI's are a bit complicated though and would be need tuning to the ECU to make them work. I like my 1KZ-TE but I think I give up a bit of fuel mileage since its an IDI. Its averaging about 19MPG since I put on the 33" x 10.5" BFG's. I have also tuned it to about 152hp/277Ftlb at the wheels. I don't think I should go much farther with the stock turbo.

 

[jayp2]

That helps, with that info you can rule out most of the Japanese offerings if parts availability is a concern. Parts availability for 1HZ is actually a non-issue but, it is not going to meet your power requirements if you want to "effortly pass" anyone. Your drivability requirements should have you looking at turbo charged direct injected offerings. Compound turbos should not be required. Keep in mind the more you modify to meet your requirements such as adding a turbo for the HZ or Mercedes diesel you are sacrificing reliability and repairability since you will be working with one-off fabricated parts.

While imperfect, there are plenty of low boost 1HZ's out there with no reliability issues.

Stock 1HZ is pure simplicity wrt wiring requirements....you need to be careful on install of motor mounts as I've read due to clearance of tranny.xfer but its super straight forwards and has plenty of power as long as passing isnt a requirement.....and lets be honest.....fast moving 40's get dodgy...passing on a downhill straightaway with the 2F and stock steering is a white knuckle point and shoot experience.

I'm putting parts/plans together for a re-rebuild of my 40 next year assuming all goes well

I'd do a cummins R2.8 if I could find a way to mate it up to an H55f but so far havent found an option avail....1HZ in my opinion is next best option....super simple, I can turbo it if I choose to and addition of toyota power steering options gets easy.....A/C becomes a relatively easy option too with factory parts.

 

[fjdiesel]

While imperfect, there are plenty of low boost 1HZ's out there with no reliability issues.

Stock 1HZ is pure simplicity wrt wiring requirements....you need to be careful on install of motor mounts as I've read due to clearance of tranny.xfer but its super straight forwards and has plenty of power as long as passing isnt a requirement.....and lets be honest.....fast moving 40's get dodgy...passing on a downhill straightaway with the 2F and stock steering is a white knuckle point and shoot experience.

I'm putting parts/plans together for a re-rebuild of my 40 next year assuming all goes well

I'd do a cummins R2.8 if I could find a way to mate it up to an H55f but so far havent found an option avail....1HZ in my opinion is next best option....super simple, I can turbo it if I choose to and addition of toyota power steering options gets easy.....A/C becomes a relatively easy option too with factory parts.

I believe @sogncab has an H55f mounted to his Cummins R2.8.

 

[dbransco]

While imperfect, there are plenty of low boost 1HZ's out there with no reliability issues.

Stock 1HZ is pure simplicity wrt wiring requirements....you need to be careful on install of motor mounts as I've read due to clearance of tranny.xfer but its super straight forwards and has plenty of power as long as passing isnt a requirement.....and lets be honest.....fast moving 40's get dodgy...passing on a downhill straightaway with the 2F and stock steering is a white knuckle point and shoot experience.

I'm putting parts/plans together for a re-rebuild of my 40 next year assuming all goes well

I'd do a cummins R2.8 if I could find a way to mate it up to an H55f but so far havent found an option avail....1HZ in my opinion is next best option....super simple, I can turbo it if I choose to and addition of toyota power steering options gets easy.....A/C becomes a relatively easy option too with factory parts.

They have adapters for the H55.

Adapter Kit - Cummins R2.8 to Toyota H42 & H55

Cummins R2.8 crate engine to Toyota H42 H55 factory manual transmission adapter kit

quickdrawbrand.com

 

[roma042987]

While imperfect, there are plenty of low boost 1HZ's out there with no reliability issues.

Stock 1HZ is pure simplicity wrt wiring requirements....you need to be careful on install of motor mounts as I've read due to clearance of tranny.xfer but its super straight forwards and has plenty of power as long as passing isnt a requirement.....and lets be honest.....fast moving 40's get dodgy...passing on a downhill straightaway with the 2F and stock steering is a white knuckle point and shoot experience.

I'm putting parts/plans together for a re-rebuild of my 40 next year assuming all goes well

I'd do a cummins R2.8 if I could find a way to mate it up to an H55f but so far havent found an option avail....1HZ in my opinion is next best option....super simple, I can turbo it if I choose to and addition of toyota power steering options gets easy.....A/C becomes a relatively easy option too with factory parts.

"no reliability issues" is a relative statement. I DRIVE my cruisers more than your occasional Sunday drive. I can tell you that a turbo HZ pulling a heavy load in 116 degree temps in Arizona probably would not live long. I'm not sure what you read about tranny/transfer clearance but that is a non issue. There are also at least two or three adapters that mate the H55 up to an r2.8.

 

[jayp2]

"no reliability issues" is a relative statement. I DRIVE my cruisers more than your occasional Sunday drive. I can tell you that a turbo HZ pulling a heavy load in 116 degree temps in Arizona probably would not live long. I'm not sure what you read about tranny/transfer clearance but that is a non issue. There are also at least two or three adapters that mate the H55 up to an r2.8.

"turbo HZ pulling a heavy load in 116 degree temps"

116 degree temps alone imho is already outside of normal/sane operation environment

that kinda heat is not consistent with human life

Couple people were kind enough to steer me to R2.8/H55f info, thank you

 

[sogncab]

The R2.8 needs a BIG radiator, a good fan, and proper shrouding. It builds heat in a hurry when pushed hard, but it's not an issue if everything else is mitigated.

 

[mudgudgeon]

While imperfect, there are plenty of low boost 1HZ's out there with no reliability issues.

Stock 1HZ is pure simplicity wrt wiring requirements....you need to be careful on install of motor mounts as I've read due to clearance of tranny.xfer but its super straight forwards and has plenty of power as long as passing isnt a requirement.....and lets be honest.....fast moving 40's get dodgy...passing on a downhill straightaway with the 2F and stock steering is a white knuckle point and shoot experience.

I'm putting parts/plans together for a re-rebuild of my 40 next year assuming all goes well

I'd do a cummins R2.8 if I could find a way to mate it up to an H55f but so far havent found an option avail....1HZ in my opinion is next best option....super simple, I can turbo it if I choose to and addition of toyota power steering options gets easy.....A/C becomes a relatively easy option too with factory parts.

A turbo 1HZ in a 40 running 1bar of boost should have zero trouble passing anywhere.

Less than 1 bar boost on a HZ puts them in questionable territory IMO.
They hate high EGTs, but appreciate a bit more boost.

Aussie workshops are littered with 1HZs that died running 5, 7, 10lb boost

 

[mudgudgeon]

that kinda heat is not consistent with human life

lol. Context is everything huh!

116⁰f is a normal summer day for huge chunks of Aus.

If your turbocharged 1hz can't cope with that, you've done it wrong.
Although, towing with anything in that heat requires a certain amount of mechanical sympathy IMO

 

[roma042987]

As someone that has a good share of Toyota diesels I have to agree with C.D. here. While direct injected diesels have no trouble starting in cold weather, they are HARD to come by in the States and inherently expensive. Also, unlike other parts of the world, the vast interstate system here in the United States with its 70 to 85mph (112-137 kph) limits does not coincide well with the Toyota diesels I've driven.

 

[Gun Runner 5]

@roma042987 ….. “Also, unlike other parts of the world, the vast interstate system here in the United States with its 70 to 85mph (112-137 kph) limits does not coincide well with the Toyota diesels I've driven.”
——————————————————————————————————————
I avoid interstates like the plague but when I’m forced to travel on them I hide out in the right lane with the heavily laden trucks. I can hold my own there.

 

[roma042987]

@roma042987 ….. “Also, unlike other parts of the world, the vast interstate system here in the United States with its 70 to 85mph (112-137 kph) limits does not coincide well with the Toyota diesels I've driven.”
——————————————————————————————————————
I avoid interstates like the plague but when I’m forced to travel on them I hide out in the right lane with the heavily laden trucks. I can hold my own there.

It's hard and at times impossible to avoid interstates with the amount of travel I do. I put 4800 miles on my 61 in a span of two weeks.