- Thread starter
- #141
I have an extra starter. I can check. What do you want checked?
Replaced Starter Contacts. Still Intermittant Starting!!! Sleuth needed. (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter roncruiser
- Start date
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I have an extra starter. I can check. What do you want checked?
What a F'n block head I am!
I can troubleshoot and repair machines that maintain accuracy measured in microns but a simple starter circuit and the brain turns to stone.
Now that I know what the "click" is I'm positive that the ignition switch will solve the problem and since I've had it as well I'll be ordering one for my truck.
Thanks to those guys who finally made a dent and helped me see what is going on.
Sorry for all the back and forth on this, it tends to drive people crazy when I just don't get things when I think I do.
I can troubleshoot and repair machines that maintain accuracy measured in microns but a simple starter circuit and the brain turns to stone.
Now that I know what the "click" is I'm positive that the ignition switch will solve the problem and since I've had it as well I'll be ordering one for my truck.
Thanks to those guys who finally made a dent and helped me see what is going on.
Sorry for all the back and forth on this, it tends to drive people crazy when I just don't get things when I think I do.
- Thread starter
- #143
What a F'n block head I am!
I can troubleshoot and repair machines that maintain accuracy measured in microns but a simple starter circuit and the brain turns to stone.
Now that I know what the "click" is I'm positive that the ignition switch will solve the problem and since I've had it as well I'll be ordering one for my truck.
Thanks to those guys who finally made a dent and helped me see what is going on.
Sorry for all the back and forth on this, it tends to drive people crazy when I just don't get things when I think I do.
What made you see the light?
Accepting the idea that the solenoid moves the pinion and that the spring on the end of the plunger isn't a return spring.
Damn Rick, now you got me thinking all my knuckle busting from today was in vain.
If the contacts looked some what OK you most likely need an ignition switch.
Here is what I believe to be happening,
You turn the key and there is a bad connection through the switch which produces a weakened magnetic field in the solenoid.
Not so weak that the plunger doesn't move, so you hear a click but no turn over.
The plunger has the contact hat at one end, a large "plunger" shaft and then a small rod at the end. That rod slides down the inside of a compression spring. It's that spring that pushes against the pinion gear to move it into the flex plate.
Now if the pinion gear and flex plate are aligned reasonably well, even in it's weakened state, the solenoid will move the pinion into the flex plate completely and the plunger will connect with the contacts producing a click and the starter turns.
However if the pinion and flex plate are aligned so the gears don't mesh, then the pinion and flex plate collide with a click and the weakened magnetic field cannot over come the resistance of the spring so the plunger never connects with the contacts and nothing happens.
In a healthy system, if the pinion were to collide with the flex plate the plunger would continue to compress the spring making the connection with the contacts and starting the motor, where the rotation would finish moving the pinion into place providing solid drive to start the engine.
At least this is what I think is happening, I have an order in for a switch.
That was harsh
Why not just put in a relay and have a starter kill at the same time? Cheaper too.
Please keep us posted on your fix
- Thread starter
- #148
Why not just put in a relay and have a starter kill at the same time? Cheaper too.
Please keep us posted on your fix
When the ign. switch goes bad then your screwed.
Better to put in the new ign. switch with the relay and starter kill.I might try a momentary switch myself to start the vehicle.
Metro, my truck is 11 years old with over 200k on it, I think a new ignition switch is reasonable. If they were going bad at an unreasonable rate I could see modifying the circuit but that doesn't seem to be the case to me.
That's way overthinking it I believe a better comparison would be a bad window switch causing intermittent electrical operation, regarless of what's attached to it. If you remove a window switch and take it apart, you find a set of contacts (like old distributor points). You see pitting and buildup just like a set of distributor points. And just like points, you clean up the pitting, and the switch is fine for a couple years (I used to do this on road trips sitting in a rest area). Relays are the same, so are ignition switches.
The pitting and arcing causes a intermittent connection (no start) or resistance connection (clicking). The big issue with the starter switch is it has a return spring imbedded in the plastic housing. With arcing comes heat, add some twist, and eventually the housing itself will crack. I'm doing an ignition switch in one of my favorite german cars this week, I'll post up a pic of the carnage since it operates the same as the 80 switch.
ST
The life of the ignition switch is reduced if you carry 5lbs of keys, flashlights, beer openers, and assorted tools on the keyring.
-B-
- Thread starter
- #152
Sumo, post them pictures up. It'd be interesting to see what can happen to an ignition switch. Thanks.
I thought that was for the tumblers only and not the switch on the end.
not the same at all.
zcruiser
Needs monitoring
x2. I wore out the ignition switch on my Maxima (easy to replace, btw) that way, so now I have each key separate on my 'biner and only use one key at a time, the rest stay on my belt. Keeps the jangling noise down, too.
On our trucks is this a single unit? I just assumed that the electrical part was separate from the key part. And what I ordered from Dan was just the "switch" and not the tumbler assembly.
- Thread starter
- #158
Yes, the mechanical switch part is separate from the key barrel tumbler part. I also ordered the "switch" part from Dan.
Since the time is close, the real question is how do you remove the "switch" part? Is it only a matter of unplugging wires and removing screws immediately attached to the switch? Or is there some whole assembly that needs to removed to get to the switch?
Post pics when you figure it out as I'm doing mine next week.
LT, with all due respect, I've seen a lot of pitted electrical contacts. Pull your ignition switch apart and post up pics. You can slide over an electrical contact and have pit/arcing, or momentarilyy push an electrical contact and have pit/arcing.
It's exactly the same problem, causing the exact same intermittent and failure. BTST x too many. You do not need to replace the ignition tumbler assbly, only the POS plastic insert with the electrical connections.
No sugar coating. And Beowolf, the 93 switch I replaced had everything *and* a smurf doll hanging off the key ring. Excellent point on that... As one of my shop buddies said with his thick polish accent, "use the ignition switch to insert your key, not as a key hook for your pocket trash"
ST
