Quick VCG change turned badly.. (2 Viewers)

[cutmebr0]

First I bought a lot of suspension maintenance parts: motor/transmission mounts, tie rod ends, sway bar links and bushings, control arms, r/p bellows(they're torn and leaking fluid), and all the bushings for those trailing arm things in the rear. Tried to hit close to everything. Hoping for the diff bushings next.
I was going to get this thing detailed first. Interior/Exterior plus undercarriage and engine bay and decided I was going to fix the oil leak from the cover since it was making the most mess. I didn't want to get any oil or fluids on my clean undercarriage.
Top 4 and the side one came out perfect, but all four bottom bolts snapped. Thought s*** I'm already here let's do the other side, luckily only 3 of the bottoms one snapped on me.
This was on Thursday of last week btw lol.
I got the 4 on the passenger side out, just drilled through the bolts and ran a tap through it.
But while I was in there I checked my valve clearances and found the back 3 exhaust pretty much on both sides were WAY too tight.
Passenger side one was .23MM just under spec, and one was .18-.19MM, then on the driver side they ranged from .14mm to .21MM.
Question here is has anyone came across this? I'm going to take the camshaft out and see what thickness of shim is under them and use the calculation/graph in the FSM to figure out which shims I'll need to bump down to.
Also while I have those out I plan on replacing the timing belt and water pump, as well as everything that came in the kit.

So that's been my week of hell, hopefully finishing those bolts tomorrow..

Any other recommendations of what I should look at while I'm this deep into it? lol

 

[excessive]

can you tell me how you got a drill in the space where the valve cover bolts were? I had to take my engine out when my bolts snapped because I coulnd;t find a way to fit a drill in there

 

[cutmebr0]

I used an angle air drill I got from HF. Also used their HSS bits, a pack was like $4, they were the real small one's. I'll get some pictures of everything.
I also used my dremel with some engraving tips to help bore out the hole, especially if my initial hole was off center. The hardest part was trying to get the center punch centered on the bolt lol.
But yeah, started with the center punch, then a mix of drilling and the dremel. On all 4 I had to get use a pick and hammer to get some pieces out. Then I ran a wire cleaner through the hole, and then the tap.

 

[Mike NXP]

@2001LC has been wanting someone to get into valve clearances so this will be a good one. I can't think of really any other forums where folks are diving into that so keep us posted. You're in deep now.


Relevant thread from poor Excessive who just had a similar issue but I think on the Driver side which is much harder to get at?
my living nightmare. valve cover gasket replacement turns into engine out job - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/my-living-nightmare-valve-cover-gasket-replacement-turns-into-engine-out-job.1308907/page-4

 

[cutmebr0]

The holes aren't perfect, and I did nick a time or two close to the seal or on the seal. But I sanded it smooth and I may throw some RTV there where I did lightly nick the aluminum lol.

My workspace:

The HF punch I used:

HF Drill bits, I bought a few packs of these since they dull out:

HF Angle air drill:

Dremel, with the 90 (I only had to use it for the far rear bolt on passenger side) with the bits I used:

 

[cutmebr0]

These are the main positions I used the drill:

And this is the driver side I'll be starting in a few hours:

 

[cutmebr0]

@2001LC has been wanting someone to get into valve clearances so this will be a good one. I can't think of really any other forums where folks are diving into that so keep us posted. You're in deep now.


Relevant thread from poor Excessive who just had a similar issue but I think on the Driver side which is much harder to get at?
my living nightmare. valve cover gasket replacement turns into engine out job - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/my-living-nightmare-valve-cover-gasket-replacement-turns-into-engine-out-job.1308907/page-4

I'll keep it updated here. I'm going to pull the cams out after I get the driver side bolts drilled out today.
The part numbers for the shims range from 1375322020-1375322420 depending on the size.
Thankfully they cover the calculations and graphs in the FSM, I would probably be lost without that lol.

 

[cutmebr0]

Got the 3 on the driver side out lastnight. They were more difficult, only because of the limited space and my dremel bits kept getting caught on the rags I had stuffed in there to protect from the metal shavings lol. I couldn't tell you how many times the dremel barely slipped, nicked a rag and the next thing you know it's pulled out and flying around in circles from the dremel.

 

[cutmebr0]

Update:
Can't get the water inlet assembly off. I've tried caressing it with rubber mallet, with little success of it breaking loose. I can barely tilt up and down, and barely rotate it. I've been at it for 30mins for so.
Can't bust the cam pulley bolts loose, had to make a homemade SST lol, they will not budge.
Broke a bolt off on the front bearing cap on RH side. They were all torqued down way passed 12ft-lb, the one I broke was supposed to be at 69in-lb.
So far this project has continued to be a trainwreck haha.

 

[GVegasG]

Wow. Simple project turned into a big headache. Good luck. Be patient.

 

[shtbrwn86]

I've now seen two people with snapped bolts when trying to do their VCG and it has me terrified lol
I realize two out how many hundreds on here isn't bad odds, but if it's me working on it, they will all snap.
Is this really not that common and I am just being paranoid? I'm wanting to tackle this soon. Arizona/PNW owned truck with no rust whatsoever.

 

[cutmebr0]

I've now seen two people with snapped bolts when trying to do their VCG and it has me terrified lol
I realize two out how many hundreds on here isn't bad odds, but if it's me working on it, they will all snap.
Is this really not that common and I am just being paranoid? I'm wanting to tackle this soon. Arizona/PNW owned truck with no rust whatsoever.

There's quite a few I came across on here. Honestly, I was extremely anxious at first, but it wasn't too hard to drill them out and run a tap through them. I thought about welding a nut and washer on them but didn't want to deal with constantly rewelding it over and over until they popped loose.
You're probably just being paranoid. I'd put a wrench on all of them and see how many will easily pop loose. And the ones that won't try PB blaster on them for a few days. And if they snap, they snap. Grab the stuff I listed above and just drill, dremel, pick and tap lol.

Update as well:
Got the water inlet housing off by hitting it harder than I probably should have.
Finally got the RH cam pulley loose by using a chain wrench and using the old timing belt to go between the chain and cam pulley.
Haven't tried the LH side yet. This weekend I'll get it off, hopefully not break any bearing cap bolts on the LH side, take the exhaust cams off and measure the shims currently in place on the valves that were out of alignment.
I'll provide pictures.

 

[David310]

Update:
Can't get the water inlet assembly off. I've tried caressing it with rubber mallet, with little success of it breaking loose. I can barely tilt up and down, and barely rotate it. I've been at it for 30mins for so.
Can't bust the cam pulley bolts loose, had to make a homemade SST lol, they will not budge.
Broke a bolt off on the front bearing cap on RH side. They were all torqued down way passed 12ft-lb, the one I broke was supposed to be at 69in-lb.
So far this project has continued to be a trainwreck haha.

I also had a hard time with the water inlet and used a rubber mallet and pry bar. It came out after 30-45 mins of torture.

Thanks for sharing and hope there no more snags.

 

[2001LC]

@2001LC has been wanting someone to get into valve clearances so this will be a good one. I can't think of really any other forums where folks are diving into that so keep us posted. You're in deep now.


Relevant thread from poor Excessive who just had a similar issue but I think on the Driver side which is much harder to get at?
my living nightmare. valve cover gasket replacement turns into engine out job - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/my-living-nightmare-valve-cover-gasket-replacement-turns-into-engine-out-job.1308907/page-4

That was many years ago. Good memory!

My interest was and still is. Are valves clearances coming out of spec, in the 4.7L. If so; at what mileage, by how much and what effect on MPG, idle, power curve, etc.. If so, is this a PM we should consider. Factory manual states first indication "sound"!

Toyota USA made 4.7L, made no specific reference to valve clearances. But in a newer article, they implied.
(This article is newer than the original, I had read)
" Tearing down would confirm their suspicions. From the piston heads, valve stems, crankshaft journals, and the block itself, the engine was in impeccable condition. Examining the parts in person was quite amazing. There was very little carbon buildup on the valve stems, the cross hatching was still visible on the cylinder walls, and the crankshaft journals had no visible wear marks. The only real blemish found was one slight mark on a bearing.
"We remeasured the head, the block, and cams in our lab," said Connie Roberts, Toyota quality manager. "Nothing was abnormal. It wasn't within specifications, but after a million miles it isn't going to be. The biggest surprise to me was the bearings. They are probably the cleanest I've ever seen come out of an engine. After examining the parts, measuring them against specs and testing the engine on the dyno, the team was pleasantly happy to discover that, as it sits, the engine would have scored a 99/100 on their quality tests—high enough to pass it as a good engine. "We have seen our durability test engines have a considerable amount more wear and tear than this engine," Myatt said several times during our visit. Each time he said it, he smiled. "

https://www.motortrend.com/features/million-mile-tundra-the-tear-down/

Number one thing I was looking for, was a reasons why MPG was dropping with mileage. For one; was it internal issues not easily corrected, such as cylinder. Or even valve clearance. Whereas, not as difficult as say, pulling head. It is a difficult job. One that a number of procedure must be followed. Like securing exhaust cam sub-gear with a bolt, and lifting out camshaft keeping it level.

Can't get the water inlet assembly off. I've tried caressing it with rubber mallet, with little success of it breaking loose. I can barely tilt up and down, and barely rotate it. I've been at it for 30mins for so.
Can't bust the cam pulley bolts loose, had to make a homemade SST lol, they will not budge.
Broke a bolt off on the front bearing cap on RH side. They were all torqued down way passed 12ft-lb, the one I broke was supposed to be at 69in-lb.
So far this project has continued to be a trainwreck haha.

Only time I've seen water inlet stuck in water bypass joint. Is when FIPG used with O-ring, which is very bad. When FIPG used, we almost always see pitting (electrolysis) where O-seats in water bypass.

Darn, busted cam cap bolt. You've the most busted bolts I've heard of. With head covers, this is most common with corrosion. Which I see some on your aluminum. But why a cam bolt, I can only guess.

Is your engine VIN number a match to vehicle?

 

[cutmebr0]

That was many years ago. Good memory!

My interest was and still is. Are valves clearances coming out of spec, in the 4.7L. If so; at what mileage, by how much and what effect on MPG, idle, power curve, etc.. If so, is this a PM we should consider. Factory manual states first indication "sound"!

Toyota USA made 4.7L, made no specific reference to valve clearances. But in a newer article, they implied.
(This article is newer than the original, I had read)
" Tearing down would confirm their suspicions. From the piston heads, valve stems, crankshaft journals, and the block itself, the engine was in impeccable condition. Examining the parts in person was quite amazing. There was very little carbon buildup on the valve stems, the cross hatching was still visible on the cylinder walls, and the crankshaft journals had no visible wear marks. The only real blemish found was one slight mark on a bearing.
"We remeasured the head, the block, and cams in our lab," said Connie Roberts, Toyota quality manager. "Nothing was abnormal. It wasn't within specifications, but after a million miles it isn't going to be. The biggest surprise to me was the bearings. They are probably the cleanest I've ever seen come out of an engine. After examining the parts, measuring them against specs and testing the engine on the dyno, the team was pleasantly happy to discover that, as it sits, the engine would have scored a 99/100 on their quality tests—high enough to pass it as a good engine. "We have seen our durability test engines have a considerable amount more wear and tear than this engine," Myatt said several times during our visit. Each time he said it, he smiled. "

https://www.motortrend.com/features/million-mile-tundra-the-tear-down/

Number one thing I was looking for, was a reasons why MPG was dropping with mileage. For one; was it internal issues not easily corrected, such as cylinder. Or even valve clearance. Whereas, not as difficult as say, pulling head. It is a difficult job. One that a number of procedure must be followed. Like securing exhaust cam sub-gear with a bolt, and lifting out camshaft keeping it level.


Only time I've seen water inlet stuck in water bypass joint. Is when FIPG used with O-ring, which is very bad. When FIPG used, we almost always see pitting (electrolysis) where O-seats in water bypass.

Darn, busted cam cap bolt. You've the most busted bolts I've heard of. With head covers, this is most common with corrosion. Which I see some on your aluminum. But why a cam bolt, I can only guess.

Is your engine VIN number a match to vehicle?

I wish I could answer at what mileage they came out of spec I'm at 250k right now, but I've only owned it since 230k I believe. When I get the exhaust shims out I'll measure and put in this thread the current clearances and the calculations I used for new shims. I can say right now I'm getting roughly 13MPG which seems normal.. And I wish now I would have taken metrics regarding power curve before taking it all apart so I could see the difference from after doing all of this.
And if I had the time I would tear it all the way down.
I've reread the FSM regarding the cams so many time because of anxiety, I think I have it memorized by now haha. So I'll be extra cautious.
But yes, the inlet had FIPG with the o-ring, I cleaned it all off and hoping there isn't substantial pitting.

I will need to figure out where the VIN lives on the engine, is it on the metal tag on the RH?

 

[2001LC]

I wish I could answer at what mileage they came out of spec I'm at 250k right now, but I've only owned it since 230k I believe. When I get the exhaust shims out I'll measure and put in this thread the current clearances and the calculations I used for new shims. I can say right now I'm getting roughly 13MPG which seems normal.. And I wish now I would have taken metrics regarding power curve before taking it all apart so I could see the difference from after doing all of this.
And if I had the time I would tear it all the way down.
I've reread the FSM regarding the cams so many time because of anxiety, I think I have it memorized by now haha. So I'll be extra cautious.
But yes, the inlet had FIPG with the o-ring, I cleaned it all off and hoping there isn't substantial pitting.

I will need to figure out where the VIN lives on the engine, is it on the metal tag on the RH?

13MPG is low. But driving style is a key component of MPG.

I've 3 methods for dealing with pitting in water bypass, where water inlet O-ring seats:
1- Hone, but only a very few passes. As we can't increase ID, anymore than a few microns.
2- Replace water bypass (Best). In the 98-05, can be done without removing intake manifold.
3-FIPG 1282B band-aid. Very effective, if dine correctly.

I see engine VIN plate, in you pictures. It's on BK 2 head, center, just below head cover gasket surface above exhaust manifold.
I also see sand on head(s), just above surface for VCG. I'd vacuum at this point, as air or water not an option with head covers off. I hate sand in engine!

Here's FIPG 1282B band-aid on block. I've done same, to water inlet. When replacing, was not and option.

 

[2001LC]

BTW: I've an 03LX w/315K miles, getting 16 to 18MPG.

 

[cutmebr0]

13MPG is low. But driving style is a key component of MPG.

I've 3 methods for dealing with pitting in water bypass, where water inlet O-ring seats:
1- Hone, but only a very few passes. As we can't increase ID, anymore than a few microns.
2- Replace water bypass (Best). In the 98-05, can be done without removing intake manifold.
3-FIPG 1282B band-aid. Very effective, if dine correctly.

I see engine VIN plate, in you pictures. It's on BK 2 head, center, just below head cover gasket surface above exhaust manifold.
I also see sand on head(s), just above surface for VCG. I'd vacuum at this point, as air or water not an option with head covers off. I hate sand in engine!

Here's FIPG 1282B band-aid on block. I've done same, to water inlet. When replacing, was not and option.

Nice, I'll attempt the FIPG.
The vin does match thankfully!
I also noticed this(not sure if that's oil or is there somehow power steeling fluid somehow flung up and seeped in??) when taking off the plate behind the cam pulley on the RH side:

 

[2001LC]

Good, that it has matching VIN#. I was probing, try to find reason for so many bolt busting. The cam journal bolt is really strange. Even so many of the head cover bolts busting is unusual, when so oil soaked. Are you using power wrench, to remove bolt?

Looks like oil leak!

The vane pump and its mount point, look relatively dry. When vane pumps leak, they tend to leak very badly. It's almost always the front bearing/shaft seal. The whole pump, especially lower halve is wet. Usually a puddle of ATF, develops under the pump area. Addition, power steering reservoir is usually low, need topping with ATF frequently. I see, only a little sand stuck to suction hose, so just weeping.

I do not see oil coming from cam seal (yellow). Nor from area associated with oil pump O-ring (red). So likely engine oil from head cover gasket, is what you're seeing..

BTW: Everyone replaces cam & crank seals while in there, except me. I only replace them, when I see leaking. Which in 98-05 4.7L. The only ones I've seen leak, are ones someone replaced previously. Same goes for head cover gasket. Those, I just retorque the bolts, as a PM.

 

[cutmebr0]

Good, that it has matching VIN#. I was probing, try to find reason for so many bolt busting. The cam journal bolt is really strange. Even so many of the head cover bolts busting is unusual, when so oil soaked. Are you using power wrench, to remove bolt?

Looks like oil leak!

The vane pump and its mount point, look relatively dry. When vane pumps leak, they tend to leak very badly. It's almost always the front bearing/shaft seal. The whole pump, especially lower halve is wet. Usually a puddle of ATF, develops under the pump area. Addition, power steering reservoir is usually low, need topping with ATF frequently. I see, only a little sand stuck to suction hose, so just weeping.
View attachment 3503382

I do not see oil coming from cam seal (yellow). Nor from area associated with oil pump O-ring (red). So likely engine oil from head cover gasket, is what you're seeing..
View attachment 3503381


BTW: Everyone replaces cam & crank seals while in there, except me. I only replace them, when I see leaking. Which in 98-05 4.7L. The only ones I've seen leak, are ones someone replaced previously. Same goes for head cover gasket. Those, I just retorque the bolts, as a PM.

Well I was hoping I wouldn't need to change the cam seals, I might need to. They put alot of FIPG on the bearing caps, it hasn't wanted to come off yet, it is loose though and I'm afraid to pry and dent the aluminum. BUT it seems as if the cam seal has adhered itself to the cap, I'm going to have to pull the seal out before I can take the caps off.