Question About This Aluminum Radiator- Missing AT Cooler Line Fittings (1 Viewer)

[96beast]

So I found an all aluminum radiator on ebay in china for which the price was too good to pass it up. It looks like it was copied from a ron davis, or similar design. It came in the mail all the way from china yesterday, and was in fact solid aluminum, and the welds and build quality look good. It has 2 rows that are each about 1" wide. Overall I thought I got a steal, until it was noticed that the AT cooler line fittings were completely absent. The seller then said the radiator was only to be used on manual trans. cruisers.

Other than returning the thing to china or trying to recoup my loss on the classifieds section (engine swap anyone?), is there someway I can make up for the lack of AT trans connections in this radiator? Help me brainstorm a way I can make this work. It looks like it would increase my cooling capacity if I could figure this out, and would definitely be cheaper than a KOYO or OEM replacement. Thanks everyone!

 

[thatcabledude]

i think i would run just the external cooler.

 

[B Legit]

I have been running an external cooler from Napa on both my tranny and power steering (separate coolers, and have been happy with the results. I can send you a part number. I actually prefer this set up as trans fluid leak inside your radiator or the possibillity of dumping coolant into your trans is eliminated.

 

[B Legit]

Here it is, just mount it in front of your brand new radiatorNAPA AUTO PARTS

 

[96beast]

Even though im in a warm climate, the main thing I'm concerned about losing is the heating that the radiator presumably provides to warm up the tranny oil to operating temps. One question I have that might help me is what do the lines do once inside the stock radiator? Would it be out of the question to add in some sort of custom trans line inside the rad. and weld it back shut?

 

[CJF]

Even though im in a warm climate, the main thing I'm concerned about losing is the heating that the radiator presumably provides to warm up the tranny oil to operating temps.

Valid concern, IMO.

One question I have that might help me is what do the lines do once inside the stock radiator?

Pretty sure the line just widens into a larger diameter (1-2 inches?) pipe that runs from one side of the lower tank to the other.

 

[thatcabledude]

I actually prefer this set up as trans fluid leak inside your radiator or the possibillity of dumping coolant into your trans is eliminated.

Me too, no chance of "strawberry milkshake".

I guess bypassing the internal one in very cold climates could be frowned upon, but I havent had any problems with that setup on my 4runner.

 

[86tuning]

You can always install a heat exchanger for your ATF. Just plumb it in line with your heat exchanger for hot water showers. In colder climates this is a good idea. In warm climates I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[Tools R Us]

... I actually prefer this set up as trans fluid leak inside your radiator or the possibillity of dumping coolant into your trans is eliminated.

Me too, no chance of "strawberry milkshake".
...

And, what is the chance of that happening, almost zero? By far the highest wear rate on the trans is when it is running cold/cool. So give up the quick warm up wear advantage for some perceived advantage that is never likely to happen?

 

[cody c]

Ive got a good OEM rad that I'd trade you if you were interested, its in my 92.

Mine has the trans cooler (I dont need with s 5 speed) and that one would have a bit more cooling capacity Id think.

 

[Tools R Us]

Here it is, just mount it in front of your brand new radiatorNAPA AUTO PARTS

How would that be any better than the stock cooler? It is smaller, likely wont be mounted as well, so is more likely to leak, fail?

 

[Tapage]

and that one would have a bit more cooling capacity Id think.

i don't " think " it will be an issue .. I mean it's just a line in the factory rad ..

 

[scottryana]

Like we were talking about I think if we were in a really cold climate I wouldn't want to give up the "warm to operating temps" aspect of the stock radiator, but living in southern Texas the likely hood of really cold temps don't happen often and you can still drive easy as things come up to temp. The cooling effect is mostly handled by the cooler in front of the radiator, but you could also pull that and run a remote cooler with an electric fan. If you are worried about engine coolant temps this gives you the benefit of not running hot ATF in the radiator as well as removing the hot air from the transmission cooler in front of the radiator.

Seems like a good thing here when it is 105 in the summer. Any way you go I think you will be fine. The 80 was built with lots of safeguards to operate anywhere you are just "modifying" it for your local.

 

[thatcabledude]

And, what is the chance of that happening, almost zero?

IDK, it gets brought up on 4runner forums as much as headgasket problems are on MUD.

Both issues may be blown a little out of proportion though.

 

[96beast]

Well if it goes into the truck I'd either like to 1) recreate the stock setup as close as possible or 2) somehow improve upon the original design by upgrading the cooler/heater somehow. If the plumbing through the radiator does in fact heat up the trans fluid to operating temps faster, then I don't think I want to lose that function. The last thing I want is trans problems, and so far I haven't had any. This system is really intriguing, and there is no real information that I can find about it in the FSM or when I search the forums on here.

Does anyone know if the trans lines that go to the cooler are connected with the lines that go into the radiator or are they separate (i.e. are the two systems related)? It also seems weird to me that the lines would go into the radiator when the coolant would usually run hotter than the trans fluid. Does this system shut down or stop flowing when the trans fluid heats up? I just want to make sure I understand this system and the plumbing before I try to jerry rig some sort of new setup with this radiator. Any other suggestions or ideas would be appreciated. Thanks guys!

 

[scottryana]

The coolant in the radiator should be around 180 degrees, it isn't uncommon to see 200-220 degree transmission temps when the transmission is being worked hard. The transmission inlet/outlet are on the bottom of the radiator which is the cold side so it shouldn't be that hot. It is a cooler and a heater, really more like a regulator keeping temps in operating range. When I did the external cooler with electric fan on my last truck I had a temperature switch turn on the fans so it wasn't actively cooling while the fluid was coming up to temp.

 

[B Legit]

And, what is the chance of that happening, almost zero? By far the highest wear rate on the trans is when it is running cold/cool. So give up the quick warm up wear advantage for some perceived advantage that is never likely to happen?

So what is your real time solution to this guys problem? He already bought the radiator without an internal cooler and wants to know if there is a way to make it work. 2 years and a considerable amount of rough miles on my truck in a non arctic climate says that there is a viable solution to his problem. s***, that trans cooler is about the only thing that hasn't busted on my truck in the last two years. I was always under the impression that heat is the number 1 killer of auto transmissions anyway, then again this is my first auto and something tells me you what you are talking about when it comes to this stuff I was just trying make sure he knew that he could make that rad work if he really wanted to, or had to $$$. I guess he could sell that rad for scrap, and shell out for a new one. Or he could make it work for another 60 bucks and take a chance that it will toast his tranny. I honestly am not experienced enough to tell him which one is right and which one is wrong for certain. I can say that I did it this way and it is working for me and I am certainly not the only one running this way. If you are saying that the best, most ideal scenario is for him to have the correct radiator for his truck, I would agree with that, but that is not what he asked.

 

[scottryana]

96Beast, you gave me some ideas, I am calling Ron Davis to see if they can do their radiator without the transmission regulator in it. I am going to pull the stock cooler and run an external cooler somewhere that isn't in front of the radiator. There are lots of cars that don't run through the radiator, and it is common practice for me not to drive hard until things are up to temp. It seems to me like the 80 series needs as much help as it can get in the cooling department.

You can see the tranny cooler I ran on my A343F in my 55, its in the back left.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/64478501@N04/5870410762/

 

[Tools R Us]

...
Does anyone know if the trans lines that go to the cooler are connected with the lines that go into the radiator or are they separate (i.e. are the two systems related)? ...

They are the same lines. It's a bypass system, some of the pumped fluid goes out through the lines, both coolers and back to the pan.

 

[Tools R Us]

So what is your real time solution to this guys problem? He already bought the radiator without an internal cooler and wants to know if there is a way to make it work.

Just run the stock air cooler?

2 years and a considerable amount of rough miles on my truck in a non arctic climate says that there is a viable solution to his problem. s***, that trans cooler is about the only thing that hasn't busted on my truck in the last two years. I was always under the impression that heat is the number 1 killer of auto transmissions anyway, then again this is my first auto and something tells me you what you are talking about when it comes to this stuff ...

I would not expect it to "bust" from have a less than ideal cooler. Could likely get away with no cooler for that long, lots of vehicles have been made without a cooler?

Overall heat is the #1 killer because most vehicles have undersize/capacity coolers. The '80 doesn't share this characteristic, they have a very nice stock system, one of the reasons that they rarely have trans issues.

A trans is most likely to have a quick failure if/when overheated. The highest wear happens when it is operated cool/cold, this will only be seen long term. The '80 addresses both, a coolant heat exchanger to speed warmup and an air cooler for big loads.

If you don't have a coolant heat exchanger, warming the motor will do little/nothing to warm the trans. It will only significantly warm when driving starts and will take much longer than if assisted by the coolant. This is why the '80 still has the coolant heat exchanger with the huge air cooler, from an overheating point of view, it likely isn't needed.

One trick that may work: Get a smaller air type cooler and mount it behind the radiator, in the warm air stream. This has been done, mainly for power steering. But, agree, the best bet is to get a proper radiator.