Mauser
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Did you do a load test? I have had a lot of batteries show full voltage with no load only to die when the key was turned.
NO START ISSUE - 100 Series 2000 LX470 (1 Viewer)
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Did you do a load test? I have had a lot of batteries show full voltage with no load only to die when the key was turned.
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I don’t have a way to test that. Where could I go to get that test done? Could I jump start the car and see if it starts that way? That may rule out of the battery is no good right?
2001LC
SILVER Star
What you hear when IG key turned ON, is brake booster pump (not fuel pump). The clicking at fuse box is ABS relay. That click is not normally heard but maybe once or twice. More frequent ticking may indicate a low voltage from battery, which is only time I notice it on a 2000.
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the load test is probably a good thing to do next. if you can jump-start, drive over to your local auto parts store they can do this test for you & it will diagnose problems with [re-] charging circuit as well (call them first to make sure they have the test equip)
I'm having the same problem. Did you ever get it resolved?
Ultimately find the culprit? I have had similar issue with no luck finding the problem. Starter and alternator have both been replaced fairly recently - not due to this. Periodically I can turn the key and dash light illuminate, but no crank. Not the immobilizer I’m thinking since the flashing red light by the radio goes off when key is inserted. On other occasions it will crank but not start. I can continue to let it crank and sometimes it will start but sluggish when it initially catches. If instead I back off the key and the turn it again it generally starts right up.
Fuel pump has also been replaced. In one sense it seemed like fuel wasn’t getting to the engine so it would fir, but I’m not certain about that. I’m also wondering if it has something to do with the ignition itself. Or, maybe some other electrical gremlin like a relay.
Fuel pump has also been replaced. In one sense it seemed like fuel wasn’t getting to the engine so it would fir, but I’m not certain about that. I’m also wondering if it has something to do with the ignition itself. Or, maybe some other electrical gremlin like a relay.
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how are these symptoms different from a starter contacts issue? mine does this every 3-4 weeks or so and I'm planning to change the contacts next weekend.
I am dealing with the same issue with same symptom. What I also noticed is the ABS relay buzzing. Starter was replace less than 10K miles ago with one from Lexus dealer. Battery is a few week old when I first experienced the problem intermittently and the old battery was tested bad. I replaced the fuse box with a new one yesterday and that's not the culprit.
Did you fix the problem?
ramangain
Clarksonian disciple
A crank position sensor on the fritz can also cause your issue. Any codes in Techstream?
2001LC
SILVER Star
No Start or long crank.
Diagnosing hands-on is an art, remotely is difficult at best. Detail & Terminology is very important to understanding condition(s) and rendering possible solution.
With a bad starter. We do not hear engine crank, when contacts & plunger land on bad spot. We may or may not hear a single click. Dash lights will generally dim.
In rare occasion, start motor or drive is going/gone bad. In these we may hear a very sluggish crank (motor of starter failing) or clunk (drive gear damage) no crank.
Battery post not cared for properly, will oxidize. This reduces AMP to (not fully charging battery) & from battery. Over time the battery will be damaged (sulfate). With weak/low battery AMPs, we may experience a no crank. This acts, very much like; bad starter contacts & plunge i.e. No crank and dash lights dim. Weak AMP to system contact, relay, motors, etc. is damaging. Starter contact can actually fuse to plunger, according to Denso tech support. Old wire or corroding wire contact or blue in wires going under/into wire sheathing will increase resistance. This also reduces AMP to devices. Bad grounds also will cause issues. Heat also increases resistance. How many have, door locks not working in summer heat on sunny side of car (resistance goes up).
A weak electric system, delivery low AMPs to starter will also act like bad starter contact. i.e. no crank!
In the USA we only get rebuilt Denso or Toyota Denso starters. It was recently pointed out to me. All rebuilt starter should be open up and contacts re-seated, before instillation. That sometime the contacts are not properly seated. If so, starter will fail sooner rather than later.
With weak fuel pressure, we may experience a crank with no start or long crank, and then start at times. This is often due to a failing or failed fuel pump. Clogged up fuel filter can reduce fuel pressure also.
With a poorly tuned engine. We may also get long cranks.
Wiring to cam and crank sensors, also failed sensor must also be considered. Picture of drive side of engine down on and below timing cover of wiring, can be revealing. I see about 1 in 10 2UZ engine after timing belt, fan bracket or AC compressor work done. Someone has route the wire wrong. The wires may then get cut by moving parts.
Fuel leak down, which is usually at fuel injectors. We may have long crank. Some Fuel injectors leak down is within spec. Sitting overnight, than a bit longer crank, but just after engine running and turned off then starts right up. May indicate excessive injector “leak down”. This is due to little or no fuel pressure in fuel rail. BTW: Fuel pump only runs when engine is turning over. I.e. cranking or running.
Immobilizer system failing or failed. Engine will crank but will not start. CEL off during system test phase. In 98-02 security light will not go off, while key in IG switch. Sometime a blown EFI fuse in main engine room fuse box. Can also be relay, or so it has been reported. Sometimes loose EFI fuse. Loose fuse indicates some sort of damage to fuse box. Fuel pump will not get power if EFI fuse issue, i.e. no fuel pressure.
forum.ih8mud.com
As you can see no start is most often and electrical issue. Intermittent no start almost always is electrical in nature. But we can have mechanical issue. Worst of which is a blown engine. Overheating engine can gives all kinds of issues. If it's caused of overheating not corrected, it will take-out, the near indestructible 2UZ.
We also have occasion of dying while driving (Dead Stick), than will not start until rest for 5, 10, 20, 30 minutes or longer. This is most often a weak fuel pump. Especially in the 06-07 years. Those have a known weak fuel pump issue
We are seeing some, after engine running hot and fuel boiling (fuel coming out gas cap), not start until cool down. In some cases, this if not from poor engine tune and or coolant system issue. This is currently under investigation. With a pure stock rig, well-tuned we rarely see this. But for some reason we do sometimes, but more so in a built rig. It's believed to be an EVAP issue. But it's a bit of a chicken and egg story. Which came first? Blocking heat from fuel lines has been most effective to date, with stopping or reducing fuel boiling. It’s known; bad or these blended fuels (corn fuel) are at least in part to blame for fuel boiling. But even that, does not explain all cases.
Diagnosing hands-on is an art, remotely is difficult at best. Detail & Terminology is very important to understanding condition(s) and rendering possible solution.
- Year. Make. Model, Mileage. Region of operating (rust bucket or not)
- Cranking: Hearing engine turning over as IG key turned to start, but engine has not yet started (not running).
- Slow cranking: Hearing engine cranking but sound sluggish, like on very cold -20f morning.
- System test mode. First few seconds IG key turn to on. All dash indicator and warning lights appear. Any not appearing indicates and issue with that light or system. See owner’s manual as to what light should be on and then go off, and which remain on until engine running.
- CEL (check engine light) on or off during system test phase.
- CEL ON or OFF once engine running.
- Codes pending (no CEL while engine running) or active (CEL on during engine running). This takes reading the system with a devices connected to computers of the vehicle. Parts store will do for free.
- Security light (light in center console, near outside temperature reading) ON or OFF before key touches IG switch.
- Security light ON or OFF after key inserted into IG switch.
- Picture of engine bay. I like to see this to get idea of condition of engine and electricals. Help if I see battery terminals and wire condition in the bay. Also vacuum hose and air box & pipe. Sometimes I can spot a well-kept form one not so well keep or aftermarket wiring that may give clues to overall health.
- Has condition suddenly appeared? Or have you had intermittent issues. Possibly now getting worst.
- Other detail like maintenance history and especially recent work completed.
- Any change in key use to start you rig.
With a bad starter. We do not hear engine crank, when contacts & plunger land on bad spot. We may or may not hear a single click. Dash lights will generally dim.
In rare occasion, start motor or drive is going/gone bad. In these we may hear a very sluggish crank (motor of starter failing) or clunk (drive gear damage) no crank.
Battery post not cared for properly, will oxidize. This reduces AMP to (not fully charging battery) & from battery. Over time the battery will be damaged (sulfate). With weak/low battery AMPs, we may experience a no crank. This acts, very much like; bad starter contacts & plunge i.e. No crank and dash lights dim. Weak AMP to system contact, relay, motors, etc. is damaging. Starter contact can actually fuse to plunger, according to Denso tech support. Old wire or corroding wire contact or blue in wires going under/into wire sheathing will increase resistance. This also reduces AMP to devices. Bad grounds also will cause issues. Heat also increases resistance. How many have, door locks not working in summer heat on sunny side of car (resistance goes up).
A weak electric system, delivery low AMPs to starter will also act like bad starter contact. i.e. no crank!
In the USA we only get rebuilt Denso or Toyota Denso starters. It was recently pointed out to me. All rebuilt starter should be open up and contacts re-seated, before instillation. That sometime the contacts are not properly seated. If so, starter will fail sooner rather than later.
With weak fuel pressure, we may experience a crank with no start or long crank, and then start at times. This is often due to a failing or failed fuel pump. Clogged up fuel filter can reduce fuel pressure also.
With a poorly tuned engine. We may also get long cranks.
Wiring to cam and crank sensors, also failed sensor must also be considered. Picture of drive side of engine down on and below timing cover of wiring, can be revealing. I see about 1 in 10 2UZ engine after timing belt, fan bracket or AC compressor work done. Someone has route the wire wrong. The wires may then get cut by moving parts.
Fuel leak down, which is usually at fuel injectors. We may have long crank. Some Fuel injectors leak down is within spec. Sitting overnight, than a bit longer crank, but just after engine running and turned off then starts right up. May indicate excessive injector “leak down”. This is due to little or no fuel pressure in fuel rail. BTW: Fuel pump only runs when engine is turning over. I.e. cranking or running.
Immobilizer system failing or failed. Engine will crank but will not start. CEL off during system test phase. In 98-02 security light will not go off, while key in IG switch. Sometime a blown EFI fuse in main engine room fuse box. Can also be relay, or so it has been reported. Sometimes loose EFI fuse. Loose fuse indicates some sort of damage to fuse box. Fuel pump will not get power if EFI fuse issue, i.e. no fuel pressure.
EFI Relay Bypass Kit (Immobilizer Fix) for UZJ100/LX470
I'd like to purchase the efi relay bypass kit from you. Its for a 2002 LX470.
forum.ih8mud.com
As you can see no start is most often and electrical issue. Intermittent no start almost always is electrical in nature. But we can have mechanical issue. Worst of which is a blown engine. Overheating engine can gives all kinds of issues. If it's caused of overheating not corrected, it will take-out, the near indestructible 2UZ.
We also have occasion of dying while driving (Dead Stick), than will not start until rest for 5, 10, 20, 30 minutes or longer. This is most often a weak fuel pump. Especially in the 06-07 years. Those have a known weak fuel pump issue
We are seeing some, after engine running hot and fuel boiling (fuel coming out gas cap), not start until cool down. In some cases, this if not from poor engine tune and or coolant system issue. This is currently under investigation. With a pure stock rig, well-tuned we rarely see this. But for some reason we do sometimes, but more so in a built rig. It's believed to be an EVAP issue. But it's a bit of a chicken and egg story. Which came first? Blocking heat from fuel lines has been most effective to date, with stopping or reducing fuel boiling. It’s known; bad or these blended fuels (corn fuel) are at least in part to blame for fuel boiling. But even that, does not explain all cases.
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Hi All,
I have the issue that has been pretty well described in this thread.. ( have 2000 LC100)
I put the key in, all dash lights come on... but as soon as I crank, all electrics get cut off. engine never turns over. not even a little.
- 2 new batteries have been tried. although battery was ruled out positively before anyway.
- it take a couple of minutes for things to reset, before I can put the key again and dash lights will come on. if I immediately try again, all electric would remain dead for a min or two.
- this can happen even after driving the car for hours or hundreds of miles on a trip. I could turn it off to fill up gas, and then no start.
- has been happening for over a year. (answer below, if you wonder, how I've been managing!)
- rarely it starts again after waiting a few minutes and trying again.
- I can consistently get it to start, -- ready?! by disconnecting the battery negative and reconnecting. this works every time. and then there is normal crank. which confirms strong battery(two different batteries have been tried.) and normally functioning starter.
I think there is some electrical thing, that when the first crank attempt fails, as there is no real crank, it is capable to cut entire electrical system of the car off. and this can be easily reset by reconnecting negative terminal!
what do you guys think?
lots of people reported this problem. what is the root cause?
Thanks,
I have the issue that has been pretty well described in this thread.. ( have 2000 LC100)
I put the key in, all dash lights come on... but as soon as I crank, all electrics get cut off. engine never turns over. not even a little.
- 2 new batteries have been tried. although battery was ruled out positively before anyway.
- it take a couple of minutes for things to reset, before I can put the key again and dash lights will come on. if I immediately try again, all electric would remain dead for a min or two.
- this can happen even after driving the car for hours or hundreds of miles on a trip. I could turn it off to fill up gas, and then no start.
- has been happening for over a year. (answer below, if you wonder, how I've been managing!)
- rarely it starts again after waiting a few minutes and trying again.
- I can consistently get it to start, -- ready?! by disconnecting the battery negative and reconnecting. this works every time. and then there is normal crank. which confirms strong battery(two different batteries have been tried.) and normally functioning starter.
I think there is some electrical thing, that when the first crank attempt fails, as there is no real crank, it is capable to cut entire electrical system of the car off. and this can be easily reset by reconnecting negative terminal!
what do you guys think?
lots of people reported this problem. what is the root cause?
Thanks,
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2001LC
SILVER Star
Assume dash security light goes off, when key in IG SW. Sound like starter. They give early warns just like you've described. May be opening and closing hood, jossels starter contact. Further clue, would be. Tapping on starter then it starts. Which chrome bar in tool it is usefully for.
I have had starters fail on me before. and this one isn't smelling like starter. (I know they always fail in different/new ways every time.)
don't think it's hood opening jostles it! as I can open the hood and close it as many times, and it won't change anything until I disconnect and reconnect the negative terminal. (I suppose I could also reconnect the positive, but my natural instinct is to do it on negative.)
so, something gets reset, with battery disconnect, that makes it work perfectly after every disconnect. and it won't work until a disconnect. or sometimes I can wait a few and try again, and then wait a few and try again, and it might work eventually without disconnecting the battery, but at this time, as soon as it doesn't start, I disconnect the battery, and it works after that 100%! I have installed a quick disconnect terminal also! LOL
most puzzling part being all electrics cutting off through the car after a failed crank. if starter is bad, could it cause all electric to cut off? only after a failed crank..
2001LC
SILVER Star
No but if battery drops too low, dash lights go dead. Which with bad starter does sometimes draw on battery. Make sure you test volts directly on battery post, then on clamps or further downstream. Volts should be the same all points.
Check your starter relay in fuse box. Swap a known working one in, would be helpful.
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This doesn't sound normal.
2001LC
SILVER Star
Oh! I took as key and turned to on. Good catch.
2001LC
SILVER Star
I keep my hood tight (high). So much so I can hear (feel) a pop, when I release it. That and or vibration of door opening & closing, rocking vehicle getting out closing hood, first tying IG sw, etc. All seem meaningless. But we only need a tiny movement of bad contact, for them then to hit a good enough contact spot. The tap tap tap directly on starter is a great tool for clue, for this reason.
If when key in IG SW, and turn to ON, dash lights then come on. Than once turned to start, dash lights dim but starter does not crank or even make a sound. Then likely, either bad starter, low voltage or both.
If dash light do not dim and starter does not crank, as IG SW turn to start. Then likely, no current to starter. Bad IG SW, bad transmission neutral sw, bad starter relay, fuse box issue like security system.
A ground single fault I suppose is possible. I don't actually know of a ground signal in the start circuit, but there is likely one. If so disconnecting battery, and the surge reconnect, may trip the circuit. @medtro do you know of one. Perhaps in a cowling junction box? IDK!
Also, I always consider age and miles. When gather clues.
I had one guy deal with random no crank/start for 3 years 40K miles. Before he brought to me w/250K miles. It was the starer, but not contacts.
If when key in IG SW, and turn to ON, dash lights then come on. Than once turned to start, dash lights dim but starter does not crank or even make a sound. Then likely, either bad starter, low voltage or both.
If dash light do not dim and starter does not crank, as IG SW turn to start. Then likely, no current to starter. Bad IG SW, bad transmission neutral sw, bad starter relay, fuse box issue like security system.
A ground single fault I suppose is possible. I don't actually know of a ground signal in the start circuit, but there is likely one. If so disconnecting battery, and the surge reconnect, may trip the circuit. @medtro do you know of one. Perhaps in a cowling junction box? IDK!
Also, I always consider age and miles. When gather clues.
I had one guy deal with random no crank/start for 3 years 40K miles. Before he brought to me w/250K miles. It was the starer, but not contacts.
Check fusible link and battery cable connections. Sound like problem is close to the battery.
I am sure there is ground in the starting circuit to trigger those relays. Unfortunately I don't know the location.
