New Engine: Which Parts to Buy / Reuse?

jaymar

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Let's say you buy a new short block and head from Mr. T, because you want a million-mile oem engine. (And maybe because you're not going to beat the short block price with an oem-parts rebuild anyway). Ideally, you don't have to tear it down for another 300,000 miles. (Maybe it's your grandkid who gets to do that.)

Now--which additional parts do you buy new, because they might wear out in the next 300,000 miles? I assume valvetrain and cams and oil pump, belts/hoses, sensors, water pump and thermostat, fan/hub. What else?

UPDATE: Great all-new-parts thread from @COYS...

 
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Literally every other part you *can* buy. Stuff is going out of production. Get everything you *might* want while you can.

Incidentally, I would bet that internal combustion engines will be banned from use on public roads before you or your grandkids could put another 300k on. Honestly, unless your goal is a museum piece, I would be looking at the most efficient engine swap. But hey, no judgement, I'm a huge fan of sunk cost myself!
 
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Timing chain, tensioner and guides. New injectors if you can afford them. Or send yours to RC Engineering to get rebuilt. Fuel filter. Main Engine harness or insepect yours thoroughly and make necessary repairs.
 

SaturnAscends

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Incidentally, I would bet that internal combustion engines will be banned from use on public roads before you or your grandkids could put another 300k on.
I don’t mean to derail the thread, but I seriously doubt that’s going to happen in our lifetimes. The battery tech and charging infrastructure is nowhere near there for EVs. Same thing for hydrogen. Not to mention any decent EV is at least 30k. I know this will all improve eventually, but who knows when exactly.

PHEVs are more feasible, but in any case, good luck enforcing an ICE ban in the US. Federal emissions laws are barely enforced as it is.
 

COYS

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Now--which additional parts do you buy new, because they might wear out in the next 300,000 miles? I assume valvetrain and cams and oil pump, belts/hoses, sensors, water pump and thermostat, fan/hub. What else?

Gentle reminder that the entire car itself is a consumable. It and you will become dirt at some point in time because we will ALL wear out, some *faster* than others.

Having gone thru a new long block build myself in the past yr (all new OEM parts unless NLA), I wouldn't hesitate to reuse my og block, but I would never reuse the head. I'd go brand spanking new for all that trouble/effort including its innards which actually is pretty reasonable cost wise (valves, cams, stem seals, lifters, springs, etc). There have been known cases of blocks and heads showing cracks from age/use.

+1 to what gummy said. Hoard as much as you can before it's gone!
 

SaturnAscends

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Gentle reminder that the entire car itself is a consumable. It and you will become dirt at some point in time because we will ALL wear out, some *faster* than others.

Having gone thru a new long block build myself in the past yr (all new OEM parts unless NLA), I wouldn't hesitate to reuse my og block, but I would never reuse the head. I'd go brand spanking new for all that trouble/effort including its innards which actually is pretty reasonable cost wise (valves, cams, stem seals, lifters, springs, etc). There have been known cases of blocks and heads showing cracks from age/use.

+1 to what gummy said. Hoard as much as you can before it's gone!
Granted I'm no expert, but I don't see why a head couldn't be reused if a reputable machine shop pressure tested, reshimmed the valves, and checked it for flatness, etc.

There may be cases of the heads being warped/cracked beyond repair, but it's difficult to say how common that actually is from a handful of anecdotal accounts.

I know there's also debate on the viability of machining a head that' warped beyonf Toyota's spec. I'd be interested to hear the opions of some seasoned LC mechanics.
 

SaturnAscends

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Yeah, it is.



DMV: "oh, ICE? No registration renewal for you."
I'm not convinced the charging infrastructure will be able to keep up with a surge in EV ownership. Of course I could be wrong, but the jury's out on that. Keep in mind, even if supercharging only takes 3x the time as an ICE fill up, that still translates ot a lot of cumulative delay if everyone is in an ICE platform.

To your latter point: once again, good luck enforcing that ban on renewing rego for ICE cars, if such a politically suicidal measure could ever get passed in the first place.

Even if EV tech improves enough to overcome its current limitations (long distance towing, longer charge times, battery longevity etc.), there'd have to be some heavy subsidies for everyone to afford to make the switch.

Please don't take this as anti-EV sentiment or ICE apologism. I just don't quite see the fesibility for making every Joe Blow and his cousin trade in their old Chevy Pickups for the latest $100,000 cybertruck. Ok that might be hyperbolic, but I'm just saying, many people have a car budget of $5,000 max.
 

COYS

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Granted I'm no expert, but I don't see why a head couldn't be reused if a reputable machine shop pressure tested, reshimmed the valves, and checked it for flatness, etc.

There may be cases of the heads being warped/cracked beyond repair, but it's difficult to say how common that actually is from a handful of anecdotal accounts.

I know there's also debate on the viability of machining a head that' warped beyonf Toyota's spec. I'd be interested to hear the opions of some seasoned LC mechanics.
FSM says so.

Plus the risk of losing money and time to potentially redo something that could’ve been avoided for $1500 is a no brainer take while still available fresh off T shelf (for me).

Risk tolerance is often times a personal thing. Peace of mind is a wonderful thing I value. Do you.
 

SaturnAscends

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FSM says so.

Plus the risk of losing money and time to potentially redo something that could’ve been avoided for $1500 is a no brainer take while still available fresh off T shelf (for me).

Risk tolerance is often times a personal thing. Peace of mind is a wonderful thing I value. Do you.
I know the FSM says replace if not in spec. But AFAIK if it hasn't been overheated it may still be within spec for flatness, depending on how many heat cycles its been through. Moreover, I might go out on a limb and say the FSM has been shown to be imperfect and in some respects, open to interpretation by qualified mechanics i.e. bearing torque specs.

That being said, I do appreciate your rationale and I wasn't trying to refure what you said. Just putting it out there for the sake of discussion.
 

COYS

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I know the FSM says replace if not in spec. But AFAIK if it hasn't been overheated it may still be within spec for flatness, depending on how many heat cycles its been through. Moreover, I might go out on a limb and say the FSM has been shown to be imperfect and in some respects, open to interpretation by qualified mechanics i.e. bearing torque specs.

That being said, I do appreciate your rationale and I wasn't trying to refure what you said. Just putting it out there for the sake of discussion.

Many of us here aren’t first owners so how your 80 has been treated in its lifetime is an unknown for most except for what you choose to do to it present/future.

So no 80 in 2022 is perfect. Mine certainly isn’t. They’re only getting more imperfect as time passes.

For those 80 things that are under my control, I will make and present decisions that eliminate or reduce risk of a redo or repair. I bought a new head. My 278k mile og head was fine.

Do you.
 
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@Ozark Bushwalker "the future won't happen because I see problems in the present". None of these arguments sway me. I've seen EVs go from near-useless slugboxes to some of the highest performing automobiles on the road in less than two decades. From novelties dismissed by the automotive press to daily drivers I see around me regularly. You want to convince me that somehow ICEs will remain relevant to consumers in 30 years? You won't.

There are brilliant people out there working next-generation battery and energy technology. Meanwhile, we're on a website where we argue about the merits of Gates versus aftermarket hoses on our 25+ year old gas guzzlers. We're the dinosaurs.

Reminds me of this:
Screenshot_20221107_122503.jpg


Anyway, this is the last post I'll make in this thread. No need to continue derailing.
 
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Back to the question at hand;

Harmonic Balancer
Radiator (TYC1918 for me)
Main wiring harness to engine
Knock Sensors (2)
Engine Mounts

The rest can be reused until it naturally fails, and these parts are the ones to put in with the engine, because it's easier to do so now. It's what I actually did. Good luck,
 

jaymar

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Literally every other part you *can* buy. Stuff is going out of production. Get everything you *might* want while you can.

Incidentally, I would bet that internal combustion engines will be banned from use on public roads before you or your grandkids could put another 300k on. Honestly, unless your goal is a museum piece, I would be looking at the most efficient engine swap. But hey, no judgement, I'm a huge fan of sunk cost myself!
Truth be told, I'm not sure any of us will be here 30 years from now, so there's that. But just in case...
 

jaymar

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Good info, thanks! Now let me refine the question:

Which internal parts (and PITA-to-change external parts) are NOT included when you buy the new short block and head from Mr. T?
In other words, if you want all-new internals so you don't have to tear into it hopefully ever again--what else do you need to buy?
(Externals can be moved over from original engine and swapped out for new parts as funds allow.) Looking at the list above...

Short Block & Head +
Cams
Valves, stem seals, lifters, springs (does the head come with valve seats installed?)
Timing chain, tensioner, guides (and gear?)
Head gasket
Head bolts
Oil pump
Harmonic balancer
Engine mounts
Crank pulley with S/C groove

Cooling system components, water pump, injectors, fuel filter and lines, oil and air filters, sensors and smog stuff to ensure ideal (and legal) engine conditions.

What am I missing?

Hoping to maybe have the cheddar for this next year...
 
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On Timing Chain Tensioner, consider one of those "ratchet-type" tensioners that don't rely on oil pressure to tension. This was a consideration when I paid to have my new block installed (thanks, @Cruiserhiggs !), and it can be replaced from outside without too much trouble, but in all likelihood, you will need new tension runners. They get crumbly after a couple of hundred thousand miles.
 

DSRTRDR

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there was a seemingly endless list of parts I had to order when Kevin installed the new OWM shortblock on my LX

what I do know is that all of those parts combined exceeded the cost of the shortblock by quite some $$$$

maybe one of these days I could cobble together a list from e-mails, MUD PMs, texts and yellow stickies :hmm: . . . . but sorry, work is so busy right now that I won't be able to get to it until late next spring

in short:

I went with the sentiment expressed earlier in this thread: get anything new you possibly can - I also specified OEM parts for the head rebuild
 

jaymar

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On Timing Chain Tensioner, consider one of those "ratchet-type" tensioners that don't rely on oil pressure to tension. This was a consideration when I paid to have my new block installed (thanks, @Cruiserhiggs !), and it can be replaced from outside without too much trouble, but in all likelihood, you will need new tension runners. They get crumbly after a couple of hundred thousand miles.
Ha, I forgot about that. Got a thread link?
 

OGBeno

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there was a seemingly endless list of parts I had to order when Kevin installed the new OWM shortblock on my LX

what I do know is that all of those parts combined exceeded the cost of the shortblock by quite some $$$$

maybe one of these days I could cobble together a list from e-mails, MUD PMs, texts and yellow stickies :hmm: . . . . but sorry, work is so busy right now that I won't be able to get to it until late next spring

in short:

I went with the sentiment expressed earlier in this thread: get anything new you possibly can - I also specified OEM parts for the head rebuild

I mean this is as interesting as eating marshmallow.

Cmon, Claudia.
 

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