LRA install & "while I'm here" items (2 Viewers)

[Artie]

Isn’t the inside of the tank coated or aluminumized? I have a 24 gallon tank and really wanted to weld an extra plate on the bottom of it for protection, but then was concerned that I’d screw up the aluminizing inside the tank so I didn’t do it. I’ve run several years now with the 24 gallon and wheeled it hard. I’ve beat the snot out of my differential and RLCA mounts and the arms themselves, scraped my Dissent bumper and smashed my exhaust pipe. I haven’t put a scratch on the tank. Im sure if I had a 40, it would be pretty banged up so I think a skid in that case is wise.

No coating that I am aware, maybe someone else can chime in a give me a new ring to worry about. The shop who did my build said they had done this on several before mine.

The 40 does hang rather low back there so we figured we’d rather be safe than sorry. I’ve kissed it off a few times but nothing too bad.

 

[Musubi]

I’ve beat the snot out of my differential and RLCA mounts and the arms themselves, scraped my Dissent bumper and smashed my exhaust pipe. I haven’t put a scratch on the tank.

Can't answer about the aluminized part. But this is great to know for me because I've got RCLA skids, rear shock guards, as well as the dissent bumper. Good to know that my 24gal will be safe hahaha.

 

[Musubi]

No coating that I am aware, maybe someone else can chime in a give me a new ring to worry about.

FWIW I bought my 24gal tank locally of another mudder. And when I called LRA to ask what should I check upon meet up. The first thing they told me was to take off the top sending unit and inspect for corrosion inside. I did that, and it was spotless inside. But then again the tank is brand new, just been sitting in the garage for a few years.

 

[Artie]

FWIW I bought my 24gal tank locally of another mudder. And when I called LRA to ask what should I check upon meet up. The first thing they told me was to take off the top sending unit and inspect for corrosion inside. I did that, and it was spotless inside. But then again the tank is brand new, just been sitting in the garage for a few years.

Interesting…

It’s been a few years since my install, maybe time to run a scope in there to check.

 

[gasman4u]

yeah $500+ is not cheap especially when I just spent a few hundred replacing all fluids. Seems like an either I bite the $500 now, or hope no problem in the future after installing the LRA. Did the P2420 put you in limp mode? When I had P0441 the car put me in limp mode for a while and that was very inconvenient until I figure out it was the gas cap.

No limp mode. But annoying to have the CEL “little light of mine” always glaring at me. Even after all I had to do with chasing the p2420, IMO the canister isn’t something that needs replacing until you get the stupid CEL code. If it ain’t broke and all that. Ultimately I only had to replace the original canister as the ham fisted shop I initially trusted managed to screw up the wiring harness on top of the new canister during re-installation.

Ironically, I thought the (still in use) first replacement canister was bad so I bought another one during a sale in anticipation of it needing to be replaced again. It is still sitting unused in the box. I don’t recommend this as an investment piece.

 

[CanadianRockyCruiser]

yup the spare has to be relocated, and sits flush-ish? against the muffler. But I've also read people hit their 40gal pretty hard without issues. To me I don't tow, so 24gal is the right balance between range and additional weight.

I already have a dissent bumper with swing arms in my garage to solve the spare tire issue. But from what I understand the LRA needs to go in first, otherwise the rear bumper gets in the way in install the other way around.

Is this correct: The Dissent rear bumper needs to be removed to install a 24 gallon LRA tank? I am wondering where the interference is...I've recently received my 24 gallon and I'm hoping to avoid re-installing the Dissent rear, if it is not absolutely necessary.

 

[2021 LC200]

Having a 12.5 LRA still sitting in the garage I always follow with interest threads on installing the same or similar.

One aspect based on CEL's related to the evap system is to look at routing the air vent line and LRA filter from the charcoal canister to a different location (i.e. not the driver side rear "wheel cavity"), while maintaining one or possible two filters (one fine filter like LRA and one coarse) in the system.

Why do this extra effort? Because looking at the issues encountered (slow filling and early pump cut off when filling up, CEL lights from the evap system) I believe routing the vent back to the filler area is more dust free and actually mimics the OEM setup and will prevent plugging of the LRA filter with dust and grime.

What remains an issue? Overfilling and soaking the charcoal filer with gasoline. However my expectation is that the proposed vent line setup will allow for trouble free fill ups and reliance on normal pump cut off, both filling the main and then the LRA or aux tank. This in turn should prevent flooding of the charcoal filter.

WOULD LIKE YOUR FEEDBACK ON THIS APPROACH? ALSO WHETHER I NEED TO ROUTE THIS VIA THE WHEEL WELL AND THE INSIDE (as proposed below in 2) my sketch of the setup) OR YOU THINK IT CAN ALL BE ACCESSED VIA THE WHEEL WELL AND LRA FILLER NECK ITSELF?


1) Diagram of setup per LRA and direction of air flow during purge (blue) and refuel vapor recovery (orange)

2) Proposed setup to "extend" or route the vent line from the LRA setup (at green arrow location above) to the 12 o'clock position of the filler area. Believe this needs routing through the wheel well and access to the filler neck rubber from the inside of the vehicle (requiring removal of rear passenger side interior panel and as fitted the subwoofer in that area)

 

[2021 LC200]

A related question to my proposed setup above to understand the slow fill ups witnessed as I understand by LRA users;

Has filling up the main and aux been easy with expected pump shut off when the system was just installed or was it difficult from day 1?

So I can understand the value of a long term well working vent setup and anticipated prevention of soaking the charcoal canister.

Appreciate input/thoughts from @TeCKis300 and others with LRA installs.

Thanks in advance

 

[TeCKis300]

A related question to my proposed setup above to understand the slow fill ups witnessed as I understand by LRA users;

Has filling up the main and aux been easy with expected pump shut off when the system was just installed or was it difficult from day 1?

So I can understand the value of a long term well working vent setup and anticipated prevention of soaking the charcoal canister.

Appreciate input/thoughts from @TeCKis300 and others with LRA installs.

Thanks in advance

The slow fill had two potential causes.

In the original instructions and install, LRA included a flow limiting orifice in the breather line. This orifice in my analysis served no purpose other than to create fill issues as the breather has to vent displaced air when filling at the pump. Once removed, it filled great and like stock. I have removed and run without an orifice for years and with no evap related CELs. Hopefully their latest instructions reflect this.

Second issue is that the external mushroom breather filter can get clogged over time. Especially those that do a lot of offroad in the southwest with silt like dirt. Combine cycles of silt dirt and rain, and the filter gets choked up creating the fill issue again because the tank cannot vent.

More details here:

Charcoal Canister / LRA Breather Fix

TL;DR 1) LRA charcoal breather plumbing and adapters are too small in diameter, limiting venting when filling the main tank tripping the gas pump. Needs 5/8" ID plumbing though to breather. 2) Breather filter is a maintenance item. Too much dust and dirt will plug the external breather filter...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[2021 LC200]

Ok, thanks for the feedback! Sounds like relocating the vent intake to the filler neck has merit based on the issues observed.

Just need to look another time at:
- Whether I will go through the wheel well and then route it to the filler neck or can I stay external and reach the same 12 o clock spot at the filler neck
- What inline filter I use to make this happen as the mushroom one would not work

Any other views from those who have worked on their LRA setups themselves and tried to improve or resolve the fill up and or CEL’s?

 

[2021 LC200]

Been searching the pdf repair manual and online for the setup of the filler neck grommet and whether you would have to get to it from the inside of the vehicle.

What I have found sofar is a picture of as I understand a 100 series showing the grommet is indeed bridging (see blue arrow) the "inner" wheel well to the outer body and therefore fitting a vent penetration to this grommet at the 12 o'clock position (so it is out of view and has less tendency to let dust in) will need to happen from the inside.

Also the LRA install pictures on a 200 series from the wheel well suggests the same/similar setup

Plan to continue searching for more evidence on our 200 series, however the path I am on seems correct.

 

[gasman4u]

A related question to my proposed setup above to understand the slow fill ups witnessed as I understand by LRA users;

Has filling up the main and aux been easy with expected pump shut off when the system was just installed or was it difficult from day 1?

So I can understand the value of a long term well working vent setup and anticipated prevention of soaking the charcoal canister.

Appreciate input/thoughts from @TeCKis300 and others with LRA installs.

Thanks in advance

I have never had issues with early shutoffs on fill ups (as long as nozzle is pointed in line with the fill tube).

I had a K&N filter initially per my request. I had lots of issues and about a year in (after changing to new K&N filer), on LRA's recommendation I changed to their little filter thing. My plan is to put a filterwears sock on it when I go to clean it next annual interval to try and minimize the amount of dirt it ingests.

My filter is above the fill neck and has a relief built in to its setup such that moisture will (hopefully) not be sucked in as well. It's VERY humid where I am and I'm trying to minimize the chance of issues due to environment. HTH

 

[2021 LC200]

Combined with a picture of my filler neck and the filler neck grommet it is pretty clear I need to route this through the wheel well and to the grommet from the inside. That I expect can be done.

Shield Assembly Fuel Tank Filler aka Filler Neck Grommet - Part No. 7729160120

 

[2021 LC200]

I have never had issues with early shutoffs on fill ups (as long as nozzle is pointed in line with the fill tube).

I had a K&N filter initially per my request. I had lots of issues and about a year in (after changing to new K&N filer), on LRA's recommendation I changed to their little filter thing. My plan is to put a filterwears sock on it when I go to clean it next annual interval to try and minimize the amount of dirt it ingests.

My filter is above the fill neck and has a relief built in to its setup such that moisture will (hopefully) not be sucked in as well. It's VERY humid where I am and I'm trying to minimize the chance of issues due to environment. HTH

You may consider putting in the effort and mod I am proposing. I think that will resolve this issue pretty much as the filter and vent in the top of the wheel well is inherently a dusty and wet environment. Never seen anything major at the filler neck so it is a good place, further supported by the fact that Toyota has the OEM vent build in the filler neck in the same place.

 

[2021 LC200]

From a previous search on this some of the parts to make that setup work. Need to go through this idea one more time though and see what is available today vs this search in Sept 2024

 

[2021 LC200]

With the last two barbs to fit in the air filter and the frist bard above to screw into the neoprene expansion nuts

 

[2021 LC200]

Another aspect to address in my proposed setup is any gap between the LRA filler neck and the OEM filler neck shield/grommet to prevent dust/debris getting into that area from the wheel well.

I would think some thick O-rings or some other wrap can close that gap. Maybe one or two of these will work (please note have not checked dimensions yet so do not just buy this...).

 

[bloc]

With regard to preemptively changing the charcoal canister, isn’t one of the concerns that the extra fuel volume and especially surface area could overwhelm an otherwise barely-hanging-on CC?

I have to admit that would be on my mind with 200k+ on the original unit.

 

[2021 LC200]

With regard to preemptively changing the charcoal canister, isn’t one of the concerns that the extra fuel volume and especially surface area could overwhelm an otherwise barely-hanging-on CC?

I have to admit that would be on my mind with 200k+ on the original unit.

Maybe, maybe not... My gut tells operating one without flooding it at the pump is key.

 

[bloc]

Maybe, maybe not... My gut tells operating one without flooding it at the pump is key.

Sometimes the flooding isn’t from the pump. I’ve had the stock tank and system boil at altitude in Colorado multiple times.

My point is over 220(me) or 235k miles there is not only a statistically increasing chance of “events”, but simple wear & tear on the stock system. Then we go and throw another 50-200% of fuel volume producing vapors at the evaporative system..

I can easily see how the aux tank could push a charcoal canister over the edge. I think there is an argument for and against preemptively changing the CC depending on the owner’s risk tolerance, wrenching abilities, budget, etc.