Deleted. Not worth it.
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.
Fort9378
SILVER Star
Coming from a truck with an opening rear window, I'd like the option. Got to have something to gripe about
. It's by no means a deal killer for me. I just like the airflow when a rear window is open vs just 2nd row door windows.
Absolutely still a lot to learn.
I think pricing is going to be limited by the market. There's only so high you can push on a midsize SUV with a 4cyl. Jeep is finding out the hard way right now. My expectation is current MSRP bumps around $2-4k with the next generation. A Ram Powerwagon can be had for $60k pretty easily (despite an MSRP of $70ish). A Ranger Raptor is $58k. F150 Raptors are selling at $5k under msrp now. Is a 4Runner TH going to be priced beyond market price of a Powerwagon? It's possible, but I'm skeptical that it'll be much beyond $60k.
Although - I suppose I should qualify that as $60k in 2024 dollars - who knows how long it will be before the 4Runner is actually on sale. Could be years from now.
By full time 4wd being different from awd - are you referring to the multimode transfer case as awd while the transfer cases with a center differential but no option for 2hi being full time 4wd? Toyota calls that "full time 4wd with mutimode selection" which is obviously a misnomer. It's not full time 4wd if it has part time 2wd. But that's Toyota's nomenclature. Otherwise I'm not sure what you're getting at here. Toyota calls the models with a center differential that do not have a 2hi option "AWD" such as the Lexus IS350 that shares the same center differential and powertrain layout as the LC250. Toyota calls the part time rear drive engagement models (ex rav 4) "Part time AWD." And Toyota calls the same system as the Lexus IS in something like the older Corolla "full-time 4WD" using the same terms as the Land Cruiser. Because it's the same thing. The only difference being a 2 speed transfer case in the LC vs a single speed in the Lexus IS. If you're meaning something else - I guess I'm missing what the difference is.
I love the roll down window. I had it down all the time. It's nice to manage air flow when you want windows down in summer. I roll down the rear window in my tundra quite often in the summer too. All windows down and sunroof open is as close as you can get to a convertible without having to remove anything.
The window also really handy for accessing gear when the back is full and for hauling long items that don't fit easily inside. I would be pretty bummed if they didn't make the glass open. The hatch style opening sucks if you want to leave it open on the highway and you can't adjust air flow with it. It also hits on stuff on the roof rack if you have a kayak or something up there. It's better than nothing, but rolling down is the way to go IMO.
In an SUV with the exhaust at the back of the vehicle, you are more likely to get the "station wagon effect" and draw exhaust fumes into the vehicle by driving with the rear window open. I owned my '03 4Runner for 13 years and I rarely lowered the rear window. I find that opening the upper portion of my 200 Series hatch is more convenient when loading groceries than waiting for the 4Runner's rear window to operate. I think opening the glass on the 250 will be similarly convenient to the 200 for loading groceries into the back.Coming from a truck with an opening rear window, I'd like the option. Got to have something to gripe about
Personally, I rarely drive with a window open or even the sunroof open. I want peace and quiet. I don't want to listen to the traffic noise -- I'd rather be able to hear some music. But that's just me...
Fort9378
SILVER Star
I think the problem for buyers (I know it's the case for me) is that the American 3 aren't really competitors. Toyota has the reliable japanese off-roader market pretty cornered and they know that. I think there is an auto pricing bubble in general but Toyota will absolutely get away with pushing their offroad lines into the 60s imo. The 4runner still sells like hotcakes even pushing am almost 20 year old design consistently into the mid 50s.
Generally AWD indicates lack of a low range. At least in every 4x4 circle I've ever been in.
I will also throw into the mix that I think the LC250 will look better than the 4Runner 
The 4th Gen 4Runner, 5th Gen 4Runner Limited, 200 Series, GX 550, and 300 Series all have a lockable, limited slip Torsen center diff, and a two-speed transfer case. So they have an AWD capability, but also a lo range, and with the center diff locked the front and rear driveshafts turn at the same speed, just like a part-time 4WD system. Best of both worlds, IMO.
Last edited:
TheLCProject
SILVER Star
Do you lose KDSS
It's always worth it. It's the internet.
You might be right. I'm sure Toyota will push the price as high as it can. Just not sure if it will sell. Maybe it will. Tundras seem to be stacking up and not selling well right now. Same with 4Runners. The slowest selling cars on Toyota lots right now are the BZ4X (yeah - it sucks all around, no surprise there), the Crown (oddball styling I guess??) and then Tundra and 4Runner are 3 and 4 on the list with over 60 days of supply on hand. That's probably predictable for the 4Runner given everyone knows a new one is coming. The Tundra is more problematic. It's still pretty new and not selling very fast. Not sure how much to read into these things. Is it a trend or a just noise?
Fort9378
SILVER Star
I'd love to see it slow down so I hope you're right. I think Tundra and Sequoia are way too expensive for what they are. That 40-60k range seems to be the ticket for high sales anymore.
Probably right. Especially if Toyota goes with the Tundra/Tacoma language. But imagine this with a 4Runner front clip. Could be pure Toyota gold.I will also throw into the mix that I think the LC250 will look better than the 4Runner
Cool mid-2000’s Jeep Patriot
Doggo. He loves it. Lots of air. Part of the reason, not only one, also I miss my 80 with the side windows.
We only have cats — they don’t appreciate rides in the car.Doggo. He loves it. Lots of air. Part of the reason, not only one, also I miss my 80 with the side windows.
Last edited:
Not my work. But I'm also not really seeing the Patriot there although I'm not really remembering what early patriots looked like. Sure looks a lot like early 4Runner vibes to me. I don't think it'll look nearly as good as that render. The key design elements that are must-haves IMO are the forward angled C pillar, roll down rear window, and the octagon-ish shape front grill. I'd also say square ish wheel wells are pretty universal. And if we're being true to history - a saggy rear end.
Last edited:
Just out of curiosity i looked at TRD Pro tundra prices. Lowest advertised price I found for TRD Pro tundra was $66,072. That's about $5k below MSRP. I'd like to think that the TRD Pro tundra would sit $5-10k above a comparable LC250 or 4Runner. Not sure it's a better vehicle, but typically would be priced higher. For me - Tundra Limited with TRD OR package would be my sweet spot in the range. I see them well equipped around $60.
Toyota has a ridiculously efficient supply chain. I read a report earlier this month from Cox Auto that said the average days of inventory on hand for automakers was 72 days in Jan, Toyota was around 35 days. With much less inventory on hand Toyota dealers won't be discounting much.
I'm not sure the inventory level is the result of efficient supply chain. I think it's probably the opposite. It's the result of a very lean supply chain that is also fragile and we're seeing the cost of such a fragile system in delays and lack of production volume. I'm sure Toyota would build more of its popular vehicles if it could. Days of inventory is a bit of a opaque reference value because it is a balance of sales volume and deliveries.
Part of what is concerning about tundra sales for Toyota is that they're moving about 11-12k units per month - but inventory is going up. That means they're building faster than they are selling. The production is very efficient in managing inventory levels. Presumably they'll slow production soon, or maybe already have. What's concerning about 11-12k per month is that it's only a bit more than half of the sales that the last generation Tundra saw in its first few years of sales. Toyota sold almost 200,000 tundra in 2007. Highest sales volume month so far is only 12k. In short - it's sell significantly worse than the prior release did and the inventory build up suggests it's a demand problem not a supply constraint.
It doesn't seem like Toyota put a lot of effort into the new Tundra. So maybe this is inline with what was expected. But I'd have to think Toyota was hoping to grow its market share not just muddle along at the same sales volume it had with the 15 year old prior generation. IMO pricing has a LOT to do with the problem. The most expensive spec you could option out on the prior gen was about $55k. Now that gets you a well optioned SR5. Sales reflect that I think.
