I might have killed my Orion

[treerootCO]

update:

Changed the oil for the 2nd time. 500+ miles and some light wheeling.
1st Ball jar = 1....2nd Ball jar = 2nd oil change.

 

[treerootCO]

No leaks around the idler......I did get stuck on the compost pile though. Had to drop her into 4 to get unstuck.

 

[bustanutley]

you are such a dork

 

[peesalot]

how bout putting those mercedes axles under the fj ?

 

[wngrog]

500 miles! That will take me a year

 

[Pin_Head]

From the source

ORION

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

We added the following statement to the Orion instruction sheet:
"It is recommended that the Orion oil be changed and the magnetic drain plug cleaned after the first 500 miles. The initial break in will produce some metallic debris from the new cast iron case, this debris will adhere to the drain plug and look like thick grease."


I feel much better now

Pardon me for being skeptical of AAs interpretation that this junk is coming from the cast iron case, but they are pissing down your back and telling you it is raining.

I don't get how that much metal could continue to be coming off the cast iron case without something seriously wrong. I have never seen that much metal with new gears and housings and any time I have seen gear lube that had that much metal in it there was something seriously wrong. There has to be some kind of bad metal to metal contact somewhere. If it is not a gear grinding the case iron, then it may be the gears themselves. Who ever produced the gears and hardened them may have fawked it up.

CYA and make sure that they know that this is a continuing problem. You might send them a sample from your jar stash to make the point that you are keeping the evidence.

 

[cpg]

I agree. I changed mine about 300 miles. Fluid was pretty damn clean. This pain in the ass Orion is still popping out of gear now there telling me to change my out put shaft. It is barely worn at all. And the low range is like brand new. I will try this since the collar spring and ball have all been changed. I am starting to worry if it is not a accuracy issue with the machining of the castings. If they are off it will be a expensive time consuming boat anchor.
Chris

 

[Poser]

I am skeptical that the shift fork detent is centered in the grooves on the shift fork rail when in a selected range.


When the fork is neutral, low or high range, there should be a little ' free-play' with the fork in relation to the detents on the fork rail, the shift collar and the main shaft and gears.


If the area of the t-case where it has been machined for the shift rail to pass through and be retained by the little tab and bolt is not allowing the shaft to go in far enough to be 'centered' where it would have been in the original case, then the fork, ball and spring would not be centered in the detent on the shift rail, preventing a positive selection of high range. Conversely, if the rail were not in the case far enough, then the same would be true when trying to select low range.



This is just something that I have been thinking about for a little while now, as there are people that have problems in high range, or in low range. I do not remember reading about a unit that would not stay in either range. I have wanted to call and talk with Randy at AA about this, but just have not had the time. I am going to Monday morning.


-Steve

 

[bustanutley]

If I recall correctly I think AA took a shortcut and designed or machined the splines on the gears wrong. From what I understand on stock T-cases there is a 2 deg slope on these splines to keep the t-case engaged in gear when torque is applied. The orion dose not have these tapers, theirs is just at 0 degs, this explains why these cases pops out of gear.

Note: this is just what I remember reading somewhere

 

[Poser]

Why is it not happening to ALL OF THEM THEN?

 

[peesalot]

Poser , you are spot on with the shift rail analysys. When we assembled mine the first time it would drag the shift collar on the high gear dogteeth when in nuetral . After much investigation we decided the shift rail itself was in wrong position and upon inspection we noticed the lock tab had a little offset where it engaged shift rail ( like 1/8 in. ) so we flipped it thereby pushing rail farther into case and that worked . I never thought to think that the surface where the tab bolts may not be right , good call. I will measure a stock case and see , is it possible the rail needs to be replaced to provide more throw ?????

 

[cpg]

Rail was not the problem on mine shifts into the detents with no problem. Still popping out.
Chris

 

[peesalot]

CPG , what poser is saying is that the detents may not be in proper position in relation to the gears if the surface where the locktab bolts is not machined right.

 

[cpg]

Hey Pees
What lock tab bolts are you talikng about?
Your case workin fine now or have you had time to reassemble?

 

[cpg]

Has any one noticed how much difference in engagement between stock gears on the collar compared to the new gears? It is quite a bit less on the new gears.

 

[honk]

Are there answers yet?

I was watching this thread with interest because the Orion had seemed like a good solution for me - a low range of four trail gears and a high range of four street gears. But the thread stopped two weeks ago.

So what's coming down in the way of conclusions about the Orion or improvents/fixes from the maker?

 

[treerootCO]

I am welding in my metaltech cage tomorrow. I will have the tranny tunnel out and I can take pics of the Orion's innards........we will see............

 

[65swb45]

I am welding in my metaltech cage tomorrow. I will have the tranny tunnel out and I can take pics of the Orion's innards........we will see............

Sorry, I don't follow your logic Mike?

Tranny tunnel out = good time to weld cage?

Whatever. I am very curious to know how yours is holding up too. I was thinking of calling AA this week to order an Orion for Ruftoys.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

Whatever. I am very curious to know how yours is holding up too. I was thinking of calling AA this week to order an Orion for Ruftoys.

Dang-This is like the pope saying he plans to get married. Why not upgrade the front axle first to fine spline birfs and disc brakes?

 

[treerootCO]

When I put the interior back together after the Orion/465 install, I didn't retap all the tranny tunnel bolts. The back half isn't bolted down as well as it could be.