- Thread starter
- #21
sorry
https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-tech/163758-climate-control-computer.html
the one that meckels posted - but he said it's under the drivers side?
HVAC system stumps Dealer
- Thread starter Walking Eagle
- Start date
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sorry
https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-tech/163758-climate-control-computer.html
the one that meckels posted - but he said it's under the drivers side?
The AC amplifier is behind the glovebox on the right side. There is another part called the AC System amplifier that is behind the AC controls in the center dash. How do you guys work on your trucks without a FSM and EWD?
-B-
-B-
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If you have a flaky water temp switch then this could cause the AC to cut out when the temperature is hot. (Note that there are 3 water temp switches in the engine block.) You may also want to test that thermistor and the engine coolant temp relay.
A11 A/C THERMISTOR
2-1 : APPROX. 1.5 K 25°C (77°F)
11. AIR CONDITIOIN OPERATION
WHEN THE IGNITION SW IS TURNED ON, THE CURRENT FROM THE GAUGE FUSE FLOWS THROUGH THE THE A/C DAUL
PRESSURE SW TO TERMINAL 3 OF THE A/C AMPLIFIER. IF THE HEATER CONTROL SW IS TURNED ON, THE CURRENT FLOWS
FROM THE FL HEATER FUSE THROUGH THE A.C FUSE TO TERMINAL (B)17 OF THE HEATER CONTROL SW. WHEN THE A/C IS
TURNED ON, THE CURRENT FLOWS FROM TERMINAL (B)17 OF THE HEATER CONTROL SW TO TERMINAL (B)6 TERMINAL 2 OF
THE A/C AMPLIFIER, ACTIVATING THE A/C AMPLIFIER. THE CURRENT THEN FLOWS FROM TERMINAL 7 OF THE A/C AMPLIFIER TO
TERMINAL 4 OF THE ENGINE COOLANT TEMP. RELAY TERMINAL 3 TERMINAL 1 OF A/C MAGNETIC CLUTCH GROUND.
THIS CAUSES THE COMPRESSOR TO START. WHEN THE ENGINE COOLANT TEMPERTURE IS APPROX. 108C (226F), THE
WATER TEMP. SW (A/C) IS TURNED ON AND THE A/C CUT RELAY IS ACTIVATED. THIS TURNS THE COMPRESSOR OFF AND STOPS
THE AIR CONDITIONING. THE AIR CONDITIONING ALSO TURNS OFF, IF A SIGNAL IS INPUT TO THE A/C AMPLIFIER THAT THE AIR
OUTLET TEMPERTURE IS LOW (BELOW APPROX. 3C) OR THE REFRIGERANT PRESSURE IS ABNORMALLY LOW.
I will also offer another word of advice if it is not too late. Don't be an A-hole to the GM and the tech that tried to fix the problem. Call them back and ask nicely if you can speak to the tech that did the trouble-shooting. Wouldn't you like to know if they have already put in another A/C Amplifier and eliminated that as the problem? Maybe they have tested some other things that would help you in getting this working and a tech isn't likely to give you much assistance if you are belligerent.
Just a suggestion from old Beo so take it for what it is worth.... It probably isn't very hot in Oklahoma in July and August so maybe getting this fixed isn't a big deal.
-B-
A11 A/C THERMISTOR
2-1 : APPROX. 1.5 K 25°C (77°F)
11. AIR CONDITIOIN OPERATION
WHEN THE IGNITION SW IS TURNED ON, THE CURRENT FROM THE GAUGE FUSE FLOWS THROUGH THE THE A/C DAUL
PRESSURE SW TO TERMINAL 3 OF THE A/C AMPLIFIER. IF THE HEATER CONTROL SW IS TURNED ON, THE CURRENT FLOWS
FROM THE FL HEATER FUSE THROUGH THE A.C FUSE TO TERMINAL (B)17 OF THE HEATER CONTROL SW. WHEN THE A/C IS
TURNED ON, THE CURRENT FLOWS FROM TERMINAL (B)17 OF THE HEATER CONTROL SW TO TERMINAL (B)6 TERMINAL 2 OF
THE A/C AMPLIFIER, ACTIVATING THE A/C AMPLIFIER. THE CURRENT THEN FLOWS FROM TERMINAL 7 OF THE A/C AMPLIFIER TO
TERMINAL 4 OF THE ENGINE COOLANT TEMP. RELAY TERMINAL 3 TERMINAL 1 OF A/C MAGNETIC CLUTCH GROUND.
THIS CAUSES THE COMPRESSOR TO START. WHEN THE ENGINE COOLANT TEMPERTURE IS APPROX. 108C (226F), THE
WATER TEMP. SW (A/C) IS TURNED ON AND THE A/C CUT RELAY IS ACTIVATED. THIS TURNS THE COMPRESSOR OFF AND STOPS
THE AIR CONDITIONING. THE AIR CONDITIONING ALSO TURNS OFF, IF A SIGNAL IS INPUT TO THE A/C AMPLIFIER THAT THE AIR
OUTLET TEMPERTURE IS LOW (BELOW APPROX. 3C) OR THE REFRIGERANT PRESSURE IS ABNORMALLY LOW.
I will also offer another word of advice if it is not too late. Don't be an A-hole to the GM and the tech that tried to fix the problem. Call them back and ask nicely if you can speak to the tech that did the trouble-shooting. Wouldn't you like to know if they have already put in another A/C Amplifier and eliminated that as the problem? Maybe they have tested some other things that would help you in getting this working and a tech isn't likely to give you much assistance if you are belligerent.
Just a suggestion from old Beo so take it for what it is worth.... It probably isn't very hot in Oklahoma in July and August so maybe getting this fixed isn't a big deal.
-B-
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- Thread starter
- #24
It's not cutting out when the truck is hot, it just cuts out when it's hot outside, well, it did for a period of time, speratically, now it's perminate. Besides, it's not that the a/c is cutting out, it's that the whole control is dead. If the control was functioning, and fan running, at least I'd have defrost in the morning rain rathter than driving 1/2 blind.
I spoke with the tech. He was no help. Wasn't cause I was a 'a-hole' about it, he was just vague as heck. Can't say I'd trust anything he said anyway, they couldn't even plug all the switches back in before returing it to me, it's not like I'm going to trust that he tested anything correctly.
Had some time to look at it again. Did a nice little video clip of opening up the dash and finding all the parts that weren't plugged in, and pictures of the ashtray light stuck inbetween the panels keeping them from fitting. They should make my case for why they owe me for fixing what they screwed up. If not, it's gonna look really nice on utube!
I pulled the AC amplifier out PN88650-60212. Opened up the case to look at the PCB. It's had water in the case. The connections are all corroded and such - have photos, will attach when I get a chance to load from the camera. Went to get one from a local junkyard, and it was full of water. Don't know where the water is coming from in my truck, the yard one had the windows out. It's not designed to be very water tollerate that's for sure. The top is open, and the bottom is closed, so there is really no place for it to escape if it does get condensation or what not in it. Ordering another used one today. So hopefully will be resolved by the weekend????
Oh, and yes it's freak'n hot in OK, only salvation is I'm not driving the truck at all, I'm riding my cycle, cause who can afford to drive a 10mpg truck at $4.00 a gallon? Would be nice to have it for rainy days, and for it's main purpose - 4wheel'n though.
Did you read this thread? That part will definitely be your problem.
https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-...t-wells-check-your-electrical-components.html
How much does Dan get for a new one?
-B-
- Thread starter
- #26
dang, all the searching I've done for the last two years, I haven't ever found that thread, nor has anyone suggested it, wish you'd brought it up about 4 weeks ago!
MSRP is $675.99
Jim Nortion in Tulsa is $675.99
Riverside Toyota In Tulsa won't list their prices on-line, but if Jim Norton is at MSRP, then Riverside will be the one that is more than MSRP - we'll see if they e-mail me a price.
Toyota of Dallas is $479.55
I think CDAN was very close to TOD when I looked at the dash control a couple years ago. Course, even made in japan, it can't cost more than $50 to produce. We have more complicated EOC PCB's that cost $30 or less, but sourced in Mexico - so you gotta add something for the 'Made in Japan' sticker, but still, ignorance is bliss when it comes to knowing what these things cost to make vs. the proffit made on replacement parts.
I'm going junk yard route - figure $125 to test out if it fixes the problem or not is worth it. Course, the obvious risk is getting a bad one from the yard, it not fixing the problem, then not knowing if it's the ac amp, or not, and then of course the potential of failing shortly after starting use, but if it fails 6 months after working, I'll just consider the $125 a diagnostic fee that is less than what Riverside was giong to charge.
Here's what the PCB looks like once removed from the housing.
MSRP is $675.99
Jim Nortion in Tulsa is $675.99
Riverside Toyota In Tulsa won't list their prices on-line, but if Jim Norton is at MSRP, then Riverside will be the one that is more than MSRP - we'll see if they e-mail me a price.
Toyota of Dallas is $479.55
I think CDAN was very close to TOD when I looked at the dash control a couple years ago. Course, even made in japan, it can't cost more than $50 to produce. We have more complicated EOC PCB's that cost $30 or less, but sourced in Mexico - so you gotta add something for the 'Made in Japan' sticker, but still, ignorance is bliss when it comes to knowing what these things cost to make vs. the proffit made on replacement parts.
I'm going junk yard route - figure $125 to test out if it fixes the problem or not is worth it. Course, the obvious risk is getting a bad one from the yard, it not fixing the problem, then not knowing if it's the ac amp, or not, and then of course the potential of failing shortly after starting use, but if it fails 6 months after working, I'll just consider the $125 a diagnostic fee that is less than what Riverside was giong to charge.
Here's what the PCB looks like once removed from the housing.
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- Thread starter
- #27
oh, and here's the condition of the dash when I got it back.
TrickyT
Hate that mud...
I think you guys are talking are talking about different things. The A/C amplifier, as Beowulf says, is behind the glove box. It's p/n 88650-60060. It's a black box with a single 9-pin connector on the top. There's a circuit board inside, but it doesn't look anything like the photos that Walking Eagle posted.
Walking Eagle, could you be talking about the A/C SYSTEM amplifier? Where was it located? I suspect, but don't have the necessary documentation, that the system amplifier is different on a standard '97 versus a 40th anniversary edition '97. My 1997 EWD does not include the schematics for the 40th AE climate control. Does any know if there was a separate EWD for this rig?
- Thread starter
- #29
the part name, from the TOD web site is
'AMPLIFIER ASSY, AIR'
It is certainly confusing to to have two parts with the same name - at least the same name in the parts catalog - even more confusing that Beowulf's diagram has two slightly different part discriptions.
This is the part # you gave:
Collision Catalog
Item Number MSRP Core Price Price
8865060060 $250.01 $0.00 $177.37
Air conditioner and heater - Evaporator components - Amplifier
Amplifier 1995 - 1997
OEM Catalog
Item Number MSRP Core Price Price
8865060060 $250.01 $0.00 $177.37
AMPLIFIER ASSY, AIR
This is the part # I'm replacing
OEM Catalog
Item Number MSRP Core Price Price
8865060212 $675.99 $0.00 $479.55
AMPLIFIER ASSY, AIR
'AMPLIFIER ASSY, AIR'
It is certainly confusing to to have two parts with the same name - at least the same name in the parts catalog - even more confusing that Beowulf's diagram has two slightly different part discriptions.
This is the part # you gave:
Collision Catalog
Item Number MSRP Core Price Price
8865060060 $250.01 $0.00 $177.37
Air conditioner and heater - Evaporator components - Amplifier
Amplifier 1995 - 1997
OEM Catalog
Item Number MSRP Core Price Price
8865060060 $250.01 $0.00 $177.37
AMPLIFIER ASSY, AIR
This is the part # I'm replacing
OEM Catalog
Item Number MSRP Core Price Price
8865060212 $675.99 $0.00 $479.55
AMPLIFIER ASSY, AIR
TrickyT
Hate that mud...
But where in the truck does p/n 88650-60212 reside?
- Thread starter
- #31
it's under the dash, drivers side, to the right of the steering wheel - First take off lower dash panel, then the big metal guard, then the duct, then you can get to it. The three pugs that go into the top are a bit of a pain. snapped a couple shots taking it out, plan on doing better putting it together.
TrickyT
Hate that mud...
Got it. I poked my head under the dash of my non-anniversary edition '97 and couldn't find a white box like yours. Of course it's hard to see up there with the dash guard and heat vent in place, but I'm pretty sure it's not present. So I'm betting that this part is unique to LX450's and AE versions of the the FZJ80. Also, from your photos of the circuit boards it looks like there is a microprocessor on one of the boards. So a better name for p/n 88650-60212 would be "climate control computer" if you ask me.
At any rate, I sure hope this fixes your problem. Any idea on how water got into yours? If not you should consider spending a little time trying to figure that out so that you don't have a repeat of the problem in the future. A common problem with 80's are leaks around the windshield on older vehicles and vehicles that have had the windshield replaced and a non-OEM rubber gasket was used. So at a minimum you should spray the windshield with a garden hose and make sure there's no water intrusion.
At any rate, I sure hope this fixes your problem. Any idea on how water got into yours? If not you should consider spending a little time trying to figure that out so that you don't have a repeat of the problem in the future. A common problem with 80's are leaks around the windshield on older vehicles and vehicles that have had the windshield replaced and a non-OEM rubber gasket was used. So at a minimum you should spray the windshield with a garden hose and make sure there's no water intrusion.
If you have water in that part of your vehicle then you have a serious windshield leak or a serious moon roof leak. This leak needs to get fixed. Hugh had bad corrosion from water in the driver side kick panel and darn near burned up his truck.
FWIW, I agree with Tom. That part follows the Lexus part numbering scheme. Dan will know for sure but since you are buying your parts from Toyota of Dallas then you should give them a call and find out what they say.
-B-
FWIW, I agree with Tom. That part follows the Lexus part numbering scheme. Dan will know for sure but since you are buying your parts from Toyota of Dallas then you should give them a call and find out what they say.
-B-
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ToyotaDon
I am here
This one is an LX450. On the LC, the only difference I see in the EWD is between automatic & manual A/C.
I stand corrected on the location as noted earlier. Here's the picure:
You are looking at the right part (A/C Automatic Amplifier) as per my earlier long-distance diag.
Once again this confirms that there are wiring differences between the LC and the LX. This has been discussed many times and those without the EWD for their specific year and model are counting on help from those of us with good intentions but the wrong manual. It takes time to post JPG snippets of PDF documents.
Thanks Donal. I believe I will let you and WE wrap this up. The problem is definitely in one of those "A/C amplifiers"... which one is the issue and starting with the one with obvious water damage is the smart thing to do.
Good luck guys and keep us posted.
-B-
Thanks Donal. I believe I will let you and WE wrap this up. The problem is definitely in one of those "A/C amplifiers"... which one is the issue and starting with the one with obvious water damage is the smart thing to do.
Good luck guys and keep us posted.
-B-
The catalog makes it look like it's above the evaporator.
It is a Lexus-specific part by the way.
gets some pcb cleaner and a tooth brush and get to it. I'm not saying you're going to revive it but that crap can be conductive and you just might need to remove it to get it going. It's dead anyways so no harm no foul.
And look for burnt traces on the board. The front seal blew on one of my cars and the clutch shorted to ground and burned the board in the process. Luckily I was able to solder in a jumper wire across the trace. It saved my a$$ a ton of money as it was on the Porsche.
- Thread starter
- #39
took a couple days to get a response, but here's the price from Riverside Toyota in Tulsa - the same dealer that had my truck for 3 weeks - I would suggest avoiding them at all cost
'Thank you very much for your interest in Toyota parts.
Here is what I can tell you about the part.
It is in out Ontario warehouse.
We are looking at about 2 weeks to get it in.
Part # 88650-60212 cost is $743.59.
If we can be of service to you, please give us a call.'
50% more than TOD, and $70 over MSRP - what a rip off.
My local Lexus dealer uses an escalator and charge walk-ins over the list price. Obviously, I buy anything that I need from Dan if I can get it but many parts are Lexus-only and sometimes Dan cannot get them.
On my last trip to the Lexus dealer I tried to develop a bit of a rapport with the guy at the parts counter. I needed about 10 items and already had the part numbers so all he had to do was price the order and confirm that the p/n that I gave him matched the description of the part. I asked him if he could cut me some slack on the pricing since I am a DIY guy and this is an older vehicle they don't service very often. He offered to sell them to me "at list price." At least that is a start. I thanked him profusely because that saved me about $30 that day. Maybe someday he will set me up with a "Wing Nut's Garage" account and will give me a bigger discount. Till then, it looks like list price is the best that I can get.
-B-
