High-temp antisieze for manifold replacement? (1 Viewer)

[DFXR]

I'm in the middle of replacing the int/ex manifold on my '85 FJ60, and I'm looking for a high-temp anti-seize that can "do it all."

I've used Permatex red in the past, but they also have a copper brush-on that is high-temp as well. I'd like to just use one or the other for everything. Anyone who's done this recently care to share?

Specifically, I'll be applying it to:

manifold to engine bolts and studs (all new hardware)
manifold to exhaust down tube studs + nuts (all new hardware)
EGR components when they go back on (cooler to engine bolts, j-pipe at both ends, inlet tube nut, bendy line nuts)

OEM gasket is going on dry.

I have new studs for the carb but I am going to leave them dry as well. Anything else that can or should be left dry?

Thanks
DF

 

[mattressking]

I use permatex nickel anti-seize on anything that heat cycles or has dissimilar metals, though there are certain places I wouldn't run it, for example where anti-seize would come in contact with another lubricant.

Living where rust isn't a problem has its perks. Otherwise anything chassis related would usually get anti-seize as well.

 

[Prairie Swamp]

X2 on the nickel stuff. Spendy but goes a long way. Here in the rust belt for long term ownership it's a must. I thank myself all the time. I've used aluminum, copper now nickel.

Don't use it on safety critical items like caliper mount bolts or wheel nuts. I rely on my old friend corrosion to act as a loctite there. I did use nickel on my exhaust manifold to down pipe nuts and watched the carrier (grease?) Burn off in short order despite the 1800F rating. I guess the nickel is still there and should help removal.

 

[DFXR]

Thanks, I will look for the nickel version. Whatever anti-sieze the PPO used 20 or so years ago on the main manifold studs and bolts actually worked.

The down tube nuts have been the only real curve ball so far. Penetrant, heat, penetrant, wax, impact... in the end I had do grind a slot in one of them and then chisel the stud and nut off with a hammer drill.

Any idea if replacing the exhaust down tube nuts with brass would prevent this next time around?

 

[Prairie Swamp]

Brass is no where near strong enough. If you can find stainless go that way. ARP may make something like that but they will be pricey.

 

[OSS]

The regular ole Permatex silver anti seize will allow any bolt to be easily removed 15 years later. I've done it. When brand new plated bolts are screwed into new plated female threads, antiseize isn't required. Toyota doesn't use it on any of its vehicles. Where anti seize comes in handy is when reusing fasteners that have rust on them. Then it's pretty much required if you want to get them off again in a few years.

 

[Spike Strip]

Never-Sieze Nickel. Quality with high-temp grease. I've used it on CAT fasteners and they come apart no problem. they also make a high-temp stainless.

 

[Seth S]

I use the copper anti seize for everything from lug nuts to manifold studs and it has always worked well. Never had any issues with it on a turbo manifold which reach hot enough temps to glow yellow.

 

[Hojack]

Copper Anti Seize
We use this at work all the time and makes it easy to remove years latter. You’ll thank yourself.

 

[4Cruisers]

Copper Anti Seize
We use this at work all the time and makes it easy to remove years latter. You’ll thank yourself.

View attachment 1746214

That's what I used on my thermostat housing to water outlet housing bolts, plus other applications.

 

[Spook50]

Copper Anti Seize
We use this at work all the time and makes it easy to remove years latter. You’ll thank yourself.

View attachment 1746214

^^^ This.

We used it exclusively when I worked in aluminum casting at Honeywell. It works great.

 

[Feistl]

Can you use these products with locktite?

 

[Hojack]

Can you use these products with locktite?

Anti seize is for allowing hardware to come apart easier in future, locktite is to keep hardware together preventing it from coming apart easily in future. Confusing because Locktite brand makes anti seize too. Check the label and make sure you are using the right product for the right job. You would not want to mix the two for the same job.

 

[Seth S]

Can you use these products with locktite?

Ummm.....is there a hidden camera somewhere?

Serious answer just in case this is legit question: No. If you put anti-seize on a bolt or stud the loctite will not adhere properly. Loctite requires a very clean and oil free surface to properly stick. You could loctite something and and assemble it and then in the case of an exhaust stud paint the exposed threads with anti-seize to help keep them from corroding.

 

[Feistl]

It was a serious question...

As an example I am bolting various types of metal together using stainless steel bolts (quite often aluminium and normal steel) which is apparently a corrosion risk. I've been told to use an anti sieze when mixing metal types, but usually try and use some loctite to prevent things falling apart. I try and use locking nuts or spring washers where possible but sometimes loctite is the only option...

So what is better? Protecting from corrosion or protecting from things falling apart?

 

[Seth S]

It was a serious question...

As an example I am bolting various types of metal together using stainless steel bolts (quite often aluminium and normal steel) which is apparently a corrosion risk. I've been told to use an anti sieze when mixing metal types, but usually try and use some loctite to prevent things falling apart. I try and use locking nuts or spring washers where possible but sometimes loctite is the only option...

So what is better? Protecting from corrosion or protecting from things falling apart?

It depends on how often you think you will have to take things apart. Any time you mix metals in construction and then expose them to the elements and especially if they might get exposed to road salt in the future.....you have to worry about galvanic corrosion...essentially the two materials act like a battery and electrons from one material are attracted to the other (iirc). Sort of like reverse metal plating. Land Rovers are classic for this because they had steel chassis, a steel firewall, and steel radiator support but all the body panels were aluminum. So they corroded like crazy where the two dissimilar metals were close to each other....also why almost all land rovers look good from about 10 feet away but many are worthless when 1 foot away and you see all the hidden corrosion.

 

[britbike2001]

I concur with the copper products above for what it's worth. The nickel looks good too but I have no experience to share with that.
As a slight curve to the topic; once you put the new manifold on, is there a tightening sequence and what are the proper torques, especially with a lubricant like never sieze on there? Dry torque vs. lubricated torque is something to consider.

I'll most likely be installing a new manifold gasket myself shortly, and have not had luck when searching for this information.

Mud's a fantastic source of info. Hopefully I'll be able to provide some to someone in the future.

Thanks

 

[DFXR]

I concur with the copper products above for what it's worth. The nickel looks good too but I have no experience to share with that.
As a slight curve to the topic; once you put the new manifold on, is there a tightening sequence and what are the proper torques, especially with a lubricant like never sieze on there? Dry torque vs. lubricated torque is something to consider.

I'll most likely be installing a new manifold gasket myself shortly, and have not had luck when searching for this information.

Mud's a fantastic source of info. Hopefully I'll be able to provide some to someone in the future.

Thanks

The FSM has the tightening sequence and torque values for the manifold (see below).

I'm using the nickel Never-Seez, and plan to reduce the torque by 5 or so lbs because of it. That's based on advice from my local fastener guru, though I would defer to some others here on Mud who've done this more than once. Especially those who are able to go for long periods in between...