Front PTO on a PTO winch (1 Viewer)

[sandec]

So I just acquired a PTO winch for cheap I'm very happy about. Looking at it there is a front PTO drive coming out of the winch. It is round with a slot on one side looks like for a woodruff key and grove on the other side like a socket would have. Does anybody know if this has a specific purpose? I assume it's made to run whatever PTO driven accessories you want off of it but is their anything specifically built to run on this? In a perfect world I would love to hook up an adapter to adapt this weird PTO shaft to one from a tractor then I can just run whatever tractor accessory i want on it. My dad has a PTO generator for a tractor that would be ideal for camping.

 

[amaurer]

One of the very early Toyota brochures showed the PTOs being used to run all kinds of things like a sawmill.

However to my knowledge none of those accessories were a Toyota application. The output is simply available for your use.

 

[sandec]

Ok thanks. Not sure about a saw mill but I have a few things I would like to run off it if I could. I think the key would be finding an adapter to mate that to turn a regular PTO shaft. Anybody have any ideas where to look for something like that? Or even a name of the drive I can use to look up?

 

[flaminbandit]

one of my pto's has an adapter so i can use it manually with the factory jack handle

 

[shelfboy1]

unless you have a govenor to control the engine it wont work right ,i doubt those ptos are made to run at a high rpm for a long period.you dont want to drive through the winch anyhow there should be a rear flange on the pto if you really want to do this.when you can get a coleman or some other camp generator why would you want to run your cruiser.tractor supply has a pile of pto stuff.

 

[sandec]

i doubt those ptos are made to run at a high rpm for a long period.you dont want to drive through the winch anyhow there should be a rear flange on the pto if you really want to do this.

Thanks for the info but I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. I have never opened up the gears on the actual winch. But whatever it is it's just a shaft with some gears running in oil. There's nothing really to break, malfunction or wear out running for a few hours a year. A rear end is just gear running in oil designed to last a million miles. A tranny is gears running in oil designed to be shifted several million times. I think some gears in a PTO will be ok. Plus most PTO driven generators have a gear box on them around 3 to 1. So you run at idle the generator is turning at 1800 rpms.

unless you have a govenor to control the engine it wont work right

This is the one I don't understand. Governor? What does a govener need to control? Keep RPM's constant or keep from overreving? My cruiser, as I think most have, has a hand cable to set your rmps. I like to call that my cruiser control. Either way the idle always stays constant from the engine just like an engine on a generator.

if you really want to do this.when you can get a coleman or some other camp generator why would you want to run your cruiser.

This is the classic, "why would you ever want to" forum question. One man's trash is another man's treasure. One man's perception of "easy" is another's "more trouble than it's worth." For me, my dad already has a PTO generator for his tractors. So it's one less thing I have to buy. I've also worked on small engines and IMO they make great boat anchors. Honda are a little better and at least do well as a paper weight. They are designed to be brick reliable for 30 hrs or so. After that it's anybodies guess. My cruiser is also diesel so if I'm camping, carrying gas, and an extra engine just wouldn't be worth it. Finally the cruiser runs on waste veggie oil. So whenever I run it, it's essentially free.

I don't want you to feel like I don't respect your opinion. Even if I disagree on what you say, it makes me think about it and look into it a little further to see if I'm right or wrong.

 

[sandec]

one of my pto's has an adapter so i can use it manually with the factory jack handle

That's an interesting concept. Sort of when the "fit hits the shan" type thing. Have you ever tried to spool up the winch that way? Who needs a gym membership when you've got that.

 

[amaurer]

That's an interesting concept. Sort of when the "fit hits the shan" type thing. Have you ever tried to spool up the winch that way? Who needs a gym membership when you've got that.

If the shear pin breaks when you're winching (very common) you need to have some way to back the tension off the winch cable or you're in a bit of a bind.

 

[flaminbandit]

nope ive never used it except for stuffing around to show what its for basically, it would take several hours to spool in a cable

i have threatened to make a mate winch me out using it tho


you dont need to back the winch off to replace a sheer pin you just disengage the drive unit to line the shaft up, my sheer pin is through the drive shaft not the winch shaft

 

[shelfboy1]

been there done that you will learn.nuff said.

 

[Cruiser_Nerd]

The spud shaft on the front was not designed to transmit power through the winch. Could you? Yes. I've considered running a compressor head on mine.For occasional use with a light load at low rpm it would probably be fine.

If you're determined to learn through experimentation - be prepared for spectacular failures along the way.

The winch input shaft is on tapered roller bearings. You will be turning the worm gear, brass ring gear and drum shaft (on bushings) continuously. Whether you could tolerate that would be your call.

Tractor pto's and this pto are nowhere near the same class. Starting or stopping a large rotating mass would be interesting and most likely catastrophic. The Farm Jeep used an additional gearbox in the rear to help with this. Research overrunning clutches.

Governor? What happens when you apply a load to an idling engine? Surely not necessary if you're not running under varying load or extremely light load. Tractor pto's put out a specified rpm at a specified engine rpm which is above idle where torque is near max. Farm Jeeps made up for their dismal lack of torque by using a governor to respond to load. All direct drive generators govern rpm somehow.PTO generators require a constant input rpm.Again, your call.
The suggestion to use the rear pto output may be more practical and shouldn't be ignored.

Adapting to the shaft? If you measure it you'll find its a standard diameter and keyway, unlike the driveshaft side.

You'll also want to consider if your driven accessory can be reversed, and what to do about it.

Be careful and use common sense.
Have fun.

 

[cjgoode]

The gas consumed to run the fj40 if not a diesel compared to what a Coleman or Honda would take would make this seem not worth it, plus the exhaust fumes of idling your fj40 in camp for long periods or time. Seems like overkill unless you are bringing a full size fridge with you.

 

[Trollhole]

Do it.

 

[Fast Eddy]

It's clearly intended to run a hacked-up blender for camp cocktails...

You guys have no vision.

 

[sandec]

The best way to learn something like that is screwing it up........But in this case I'd better take good advice. I was kind of on the fence about going with the PTO winch in the first. But with all that was said here I think I'll just get an electric one. I already have deep cycle/starting combo batteries, so a 24 volt electric winch would be happy with this. Anyway I appreciate all the good feedback and the edumacation.

 

[joshoisasleep]

Digging up this old thread because I've been thinking about this lately and it seems like a cool idea...

My 3B puts out 67kw at 3500rpm... not sure how that relates to the output at peak torque, I'm guessing much lower.

A cheap 6.5kw generator is $1,200 at Canadian tire. Is it technically possible that one could source a big ol electric motor used online for cheap, hack a simple governing system, and turn their old landcruiser into a diesel generator capable of powering a small village for a few hundred $$?

 

[SteveH]

I would use a PTO generator from a tractor application, before I would try to just spin an electric motor to create power.

I can buy a 6500 watt generator (cheap Coleman with a Briggs and Stratton engine) for $600-ish in the US. You might have fun rigging up a PTO solution, but I doubt you'd save money. Any PTO generator would have to be dismountable either to make the truck driveable to keep the winch out of the mud and elements.

 

[joshoisasleep]

I would use a PTO generator from a tractor application, before I would try to just spin an electric motor to create power.

Yeah that sounds like a better idea for sure.

I can buy a 6500 watt generator (cheap Coleman with a Briggs and Stratton engine) for $600-ish in the US. You might have fun rigging up a PTO solution, but I doubt you'd save money.

I wasn't thinking so much about saving money, as about being able to generate a large amount of power anywhere my truck is, as needed. I live in an area with a lot of power outs, and hauling a generator between my home, my business, and friends houses isn't something I do... it would be pretty cool to just have a diesel generator "on me" at all times.

The other consideration I was thinking of was the amount of power it can generate. Since that 6500w is a what... 5.5hp engine, I would imagine my cruiser could output significantly more. Does anyone have any idea what size generator a cruiser could efficiently power?

Any PTO generator would have to be dismountable either to make the truck driveable to keep the winch out of the mud and elements.

Not if you build it into the front bumper in place of a PTO winch and used the PTO driveshaft instead of the rear output? Making it dismountable still makes sense though