- Thread starter
- #21
I have the same valving as you and they work good for me since my junk is heavy.
Fox Shox 2.0 post your valving and weight.
- Thread starter Rwhat
- Start date
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.
I have the same valving as you and they work good for me since my junk is heavy.
mtnman412 said:
Interesting comments mtnman. I feel my shocks run a little stiff, even playing with the CD adjusters doesn't quite get a plush feel. I am now setup to re charge the shocks myself so am going to start playing with valving in the new year. The one thing I have found is that the CD adjusters are great for dialling out excessive body roll but are still I stiff and when hitting imperfections in the road they are still jarring...
I have been reading up on flutter stacks. Sounds very interesting and may give better small bump sensitivity.
Any shock tuning gurus out there that can post up guidelines for valving?
Buck, The TJM XGS are a great shock for the money. They are perfectly tolerable on a stock weight vehicle and would probably feel even better with the addition of three to four hundred pounds. They greatly reduced body roll (compared to 15 yr old OEM) and are very comfortable on smooth asphalt and gravel roads. They also handled slow technical trails very well. However, they were too harsh for my taste on poor local roads full of cracks, potholes, and expansion joints. Once again this might be less of an issue for you if you have additional weight on board. At this price point I would definitely steer you toward the TJM Tiger Adjustable shocks. I've read several very positive reviews, and an adjustable shock is inherently more adaptable to your specific needs/preferences.
Thomo, I am no shock guru but I will offer a few things I have learned from reading about these shocks in similar applications (namely JK Wranglers and LR Discoverys). It is my understanding that CD adjusters mostly affect "low speed" compression damping but leave "high speed" damping unaffected. Body roll is considered a low speed external force, as opposed to hitting a pothole at 80kph which would be considered high speed. (Speed here would be measured at the shock shaft.) Now how to best setup the shock and tune for those things is beyond me haha.
Thank you
alia176
SILVER Star
I'm leaning toward getting a set of these Fox shocks but have reservations due to the fact that they're re-valveable. It's a double edge sword with me as I've re-valved my Bilstein 7100s more times than I can count and that does get old. Not being a shock expert or having access to a shock dyno, I don't know WTF I'm doing other than trial & error.
Maybe Fox does a better job of explaining how to select the valve shims?
Maybe Fox does a better job of explaining how to select the valve shims?
alia176 said:
True about that. However I'm planning on dialing in mine perfectly when they arrive in my paws tomorrow.
I can almost garantee the valving won't be right the first time no matter who they are from. As its all personal preference. Depending on what shocks your replacing, they will feel great when you first put them in. After about a month you will start to wonder if you can get them a bit better. Go right up and down in the valving before you drill out another bleed. As you cant go back.
BigBoy, would you mind clarifying this statement? Not sure what you mean by "go right up and down". I am familiar with the idea of bleed holes in the piston, but maybe you could tell us how adjusting them (or adding more) affects shock feel? Thanks!
It just means what ever the advised shock valving is. Increase and decrease shimming (rebound and compression) 1 at a time by 3-4 valving numbers. As most people say they want it softer, but in actual fact. They prefer the harder once driving it. So test all valving by driving until your happy.
Thanks BigBoy. So assuming two shocks with identical valving, how would running a single bleed vs. a double bleed affect handling/feel?
Thought I would post up some additional info for those who are experimenting with their valving. From what I have read:
The OD of a shim affects what range of shaft speed it controls. Larger diameters affect lower speeds and smaller diameters affect higher speeds. A shim's thickness affects how much damping it provides. Thicker shims give more damping and thinner shims give less.
On other forums where valving is frequently discussed, it is common for the person posting to "draw" the stack he is referring to. For example:
_____________________.010
___________________.010
________________.012
_____________.015
___________.020
___________.020
I like this practice as it really helps me visualize whats going on inside the shock and better guesstimate how a certain stack will respond. The stack pictured above would provide very progressive resistance, meaning that damping would increase rapidly as shaft speed increased.
The OD of a shim affects what range of shaft speed it controls. Larger diameters affect lower speeds and smaller diameters affect higher speeds. A shim's thickness affects how much damping it provides. Thicker shims give more damping and thinner shims give less.
On other forums where valving is frequently discussed, it is common for the person posting to "draw" the stack he is referring to. For example:
_____________________.010
___________________.010
________________.012
_____________.015
___________.020
___________.020
I like this practice as it really helps me visualize whats going on inside the shock and better guesstimate how a certain stack will respond. The stack pictured above would provide very progressive resistance, meaning that damping would increase rapidly as shaft speed increased.
There is some good reading here about shim stacks and the various types of damping the shims effect (low speed , mid speed and high speed)
http://www.crawlpedia.com/shock_valving.htm
http://www.crawlpedia.com/sample_shim_stacks.htm
I have been reading a fair bit on shim stacks and flutter stacks in particular and After reading coax's feedback on the other Fox thread and speaking to Sonny from Down South I'm going to go ahead and add a "flutter" shim to my existing valving to try and soften up the small bumps. These shocks are re valvable so may as well get playing with them.
At present my compression valving is #65 front and rear which looks something like this:
1. ---------------------- 0.01
2. ------------------ 0.012
3. -------------- 0.012
4. ---------- 0.012
5. ------ 0.012
6. --- 0.02
So i'll be adding an additional shim between 2 & 3 so the stack will end up looking like so:
1. ---------------------- 0.01
2. ------------------ 0.012
3. --- 0.01
4. -------------- 0.012
5. ---------- 0.012
6. ------ 0.012
7. --- 0.02
By adding the flutter shim this should let the initial part of the stroke be fairly soft by allowing shim 1 & 2 to flex a little more before coming into contact with shim 4 and the rest of the stack which will then progressively increases the damping proportionately to the shaft speed. If the small bumps are still a little harsh after this then I'll try a thinner no. 1 & 2 shim and see how things go from there.
http://www.crawlpedia.com/shock_valving.htm
http://www.crawlpedia.com/sample_shim_stacks.htm
I have been reading a fair bit on shim stacks and flutter stacks in particular and After reading coax's feedback on the other Fox thread and speaking to Sonny from Down South I'm going to go ahead and add a "flutter" shim to my existing valving to try and soften up the small bumps. These shocks are re valvable so may as well get playing with them.
At present my compression valving is #65 front and rear which looks something like this:
1. ---------------------- 0.01
2. ------------------ 0.012
3. -------------- 0.012
4. ---------- 0.012
5. ------ 0.012
6. --- 0.02
So i'll be adding an additional shim between 2 & 3 so the stack will end up looking like so:
1. ---------------------- 0.01
2. ------------------ 0.012
3. --- 0.01
4. -------------- 0.012
5. ---------- 0.012
6. ------ 0.012
7. --- 0.02
By adding the flutter shim this should let the initial part of the stroke be fairly soft by allowing shim 1 & 2 to flex a little more before coming into contact with shim 4 and the rest of the stack which will then progressively increases the damping proportionately to the shaft speed. If the small bumps are still a little harsh after this then I'll try a thinner no. 1 & 2 shim and see how things go from there.
I guess I'll cross post my valving here. More info on the feedback is in the other thread. Thomo, I'm interested to hear what you come up with 
Front Compression:
1.600-------------------.008
1.425--------------.008
0.800----.01
1.350-----------.01
1.100--------.01
0.950------.01
0.800----.02
Front Rebound: 75
Rear Compression:
1.600-------------------.008
1.425--------------.01
0.800----.01
1.350-----------.01
1.100--------.012
0.950------.012
0.800----.02
Rear Rebound: 80
Front Compression:
1.600-------------------.008
1.425--------------.008
0.800----.01
1.350-----------.01
1.100--------.01
0.950------.01
0.800----.02
Front Rebound: 75
Rear Compression:
1.600-------------------.008
1.425--------------.01
0.800----.01
1.350-----------.01
1.100--------.012
0.950------.012
0.800----.02
Rear Rebound: 80
I gotta say representing the stacks the way mtnman suggested really does help visualising and comparing the differences between the different configurations.
What I find a little odd though looking your stack Coax is that the shims your running are thinner, and will flex more easily than mine and in essence i presume will give you less compression damping. I would have thought with the weight of your rig you'd be valved firmer than me and not softer... I cant imagine my rig would be close to yours weight wise. What weight are you chiming in at fully laden?
What I find a little odd though looking your stack Coax is that the shims your running are thinner, and will flex more easily than mine and in essence i presume will give you less compression damping. I would have thought with the weight of your rig you'd be valved firmer than me and not softer... I cant imagine my rig would be close to yours weight wise. What weight are you chiming in at fully laden?
Hard to say, but I would guess that maybe the spring rates are different between the trucks? IIRC the heavies are 220f/250r lbs/inch. Or somewhere in that area. I would guess I am running +300 lbs from a stock rig.
+ ARB, winch (with dyneema), lighter weight rear swing out
- 3 row seats, tow hitch.
I wanted to have the suspension work better on washboard in sacrifice of higher vehicle speed, so that could be a difference too.
Thomo, I'm looking forward to hearing how the addition of that flutter stack impacts ride characteristics. Seems like you and Coax are both experimenting with flutters in the third position down. I wonder how placing it second vs. the third would change things. I have no data to say it would be better, just something that might be worth trying along the way!
Also Thomo, those flexi-coils are awesome but their continuously variable rate is definitely gonna complicate valving somewhat. As for weight, if you have steel bumpers front and rear with sliders I would guess you probably weigh more than Coax around town. Loaded up for a trip could be a different story.
For anybody who wants to get SUPER geeky with this, I found some software that is designed to model all these variables and predict outcomes: Shim Restacker It draws out the stacks in a much more complex version of what we did above and can show how they deflect at different speeds with different force. I doubt I'll buy the software, but the site is worth looking over.
Also Thomo, those flexi-coils are awesome but their continuously variable rate is definitely gonna complicate valving somewhat. As for weight, if you have steel bumpers front and rear with sliders I would guess you probably weigh more than Coax around town. Loaded up for a trip could be a different story.
For anybody who wants to get SUPER geeky with this, I found some software that is designed to model all these variables and predict outcomes: Shim Restacker It draws out the stacks in a much more complex version of what we did above and can show how they deflect at different speeds with different force. I doubt I'll buy the software, but the site is worth looking over.
- Thread starter
- #38
I looked into playing with the shims also. I already have a nitrogen tank and there is no special tools involved. However the master shim kit is pretty expensive.
Pirate4x4 has a good write up on disassembly of the shocks and individual components inside the shocks. However I'm too lazy to mess with it.
My buddy got the radflos earlier this year. I haven't road in his yet. However radflo keeps their valving proprietary. Although valving numbers vary by manufacture from what I heard.
Pirate4x4 has a good write up on disassembly of the shocks and individual components inside the shocks. However I'm too lazy to mess with it.
My buddy got the radflos earlier this year. I haven't road in his yet. However radflo keeps their valving proprietary. Although valving numbers vary by manufacture from what I heard.
