Ford Contour fan installation thread

[Moby]

Lots of good suggestions, thanks for all the input! The A/C makes a huge difference in engine temp and how hard my fan works, I've never been able to get it over 200 without the A/C. And on the two occassions that it did get hot the A/C was cranked and the hills were big and long. I mean more than 15 minutes of intermittent steep hills where I'm way into the throttle, often full throttle or holding it in 3rd. The 2nd time I was loaded (wife, 75lbs dog and lots of cargo). So I was working the truck pretty darn hard. The temp climb happened over time so when I said the the temp was climbing like a rocket that probably wasn't accurate - it was a steady rise over time that was not stabilizing. Again, no regular problems during the past 1.5-2 years, including 100+ degree city driving in Sacramento, just these two incidents.

I think the most interesting suggestion is the t-stat not fully opening. This is the only part of the system that wasn't replaced during the rebuild. Also suspicious is the fact that it is an aftermarket 180 degree unit. I will likely go back to a stock 193 degree t-stat and see if that makes any difference. Of course I won't have a chance to test any changes until it gets hot next summer.

 

[Spook50]

I think the most interesting suggestion is the t-stat not fully opening. This is the only part of the system that wasn't replaced during the rebuild. Also suspicious is the fact that it is an aftermarket 180 degree unit. I will likely go back to a stock 193 degree t-stat and see if that makes any difference. Of course I won't have a chance to test any changes until it gets hot next summer.

If you're using a Stant tstat, they naturally don't have as large an opening for coolant to flow through as a stock unit. The OEM tstats are HUGE compared to the Stant ones I see on the racks at the local parts stores.

 

[ntsqd]

So it sounds like your mechanical fan clutch was toast. And I didn't realize 62s had carb fans without float bowls for the gas to boil out of. If you don't vapor-lock, you don't need it.

The "carb fan" is there to combat vapor lock in the EFI fuel rail.

Sort of off topic, but why are you getting vapor lock with EFI?

This should not be happening. Just like coolant, fuel's boiling point also goes up with pressure. That combined with the constant cycling of fuel through the system should eliminate any possibility of vapor lock.
If you are getting vapor lock with EFI then I would say that you are leaning out in those conditions, which would drive the engine's temperature up considerably.
Is the FPR on the opposite end of the 62's fuel rail from the supply end?

If you can operate consistently and reliably at 200 I'd say that's a good thing. The OE's didn't increase the operating temps of late models because they couldn't cool them lower, they increased to operating temps because there is more efficiency to be found there. So long as things like ring gaps don't close off and stuff doesn't melt, a higher operating temp isn't a bad thing.

 

[Moby]

Sort of off topic, but why are you getting vapor lock with EFI?

This should not be happening. Just like coolant, fuel's boiling point also goes up with pressure. That combined with the constant cycling of fuel through the system should eliminate any possibility of vapor lock.
If you are getting vapor lock with EFI then I would say that you are leaning out in those conditions, which would drive the engine's temperature up considerably.
Is the FPR on the opposite end of the 62's fuel rail from the supply end?

If you can operate consistently and reliably at 200 I'd say that's a good thing. The OE's didn't increase the operating temps of late models because they couldn't cool them lower, they increased to operating temps because there is more efficiency to be found there. So long as things like ring gaps don't close off and stuff doesn't melt, a higher operating temp isn't a bad thing.

Interesting. I'm not having any problems, I was just saying that vapor lock is why that fan is there. My understanding was that underhood temp increases after shutdown and heat soaks the fuel rail. I could be wrong about the reasons but my understanding is that the fan is for vapor lock.

You're right, OE's raised the operating temp. Not sure about efficiency but emissions are better at higher operating temps. In most cases OEMs did this on engines with aluminum heads, which reject heat a lot better than iron heads. That isn't ideal for best power and it is common to swap 180 degree t-stats and lower the operating temperature for cooling fans on late model performance engines (very common on the LT/LS series of engines). However my goal was to reduce my pre-rebuilt engine's mild detonation tendency by attempting to keep the head/combustion chamber somewhat cooler (fortunately I don't have any detonation post rebuild, and I run a J&S Safeguard knocksensor to make sure it stays that way).

As a side note I know that I'm not running lean, I have an Innovate LM-1 wideband O2 in the front of my dual entry/dual exit cat (so it's like putting it in an x-pipe to see exhaust from both banks of cylinders)

 

[ntsqd]

When under typical EFI pressures the vapor point of fuel is enough higher that it won't boil off and become a gas (vapor). On hot shut-down the FPR and the check valve in the pump will hold the rail to the injection pressure of ~40 psi. One of the tell-tale signs of either the FPR or the pump starting to fail is when you Do start to see vapor-lock like problems on a hot re-start.

When you put in a lower temp t-stat you're not really putting the engine in a better power producing temp range. What's happening is that the ECU sees that the engine is not up to it's specified temp & increases the injector dwell. Essentially you're running in a partial 'choke' mode, which puts the engine into the range of the 12:1 power A/F ratio rather than the 14.7:1 stoich that it's programmed to run at.

Later ECU's are smart enough that they realize that something is not right and mark that sensor as suspect. Once they do that, they'll bring the injector dwell back down to the baseline fuel map, so you can only fool them for so long.

A carb may need that fan, I'd be really surprised if EFI does. Might try pulling it as those fender vents should help with reducing the underhood static pressure.

 

[Moby]

When under typical EFI pressures the vapor point of fuel is enough higher that it won't boil off and become a gas (vapor). On hot shut-down the FPR and the check valve in the pump will hold the rail to the injection pressure of ~40 psi. One of the tell-tale signs of either the FPR or the pump starting to fail is when you Do start to see vapor-lock like problems on a hot re-start.

When you put in a lower temp t-stat you're not really putting the engine in a better power producing temp range. What's happening is that the ECU sees that the engine is not up to it's specified temp & increases the injector dwell. Essentially you're running in a partial 'choke' mode, which puts the engine into the range of the 12:1 power A/F ratio rather than the 14.7:1 stoich that it's programmed to run at.

Later ECU's are smart enough that they realize that something is not right and mark that sensor as suspect. Once they do that, they'll bring the injector dwell back down to the baseline fuel map, so you can only fool them for so long.

A carb may need that fan, I'd be really surprised if EFI does. Might try pulling it as those fender vents should help with reducing the underhood static pressure.

We're way off topic but since we're already here...

With a 180 degree t-stat and a Contour fan with a DCC controller set up for a 180 degree t-stat my truck normally runs around 190-194 with minimal fan effort (I have the same LED that spook is running and I have a Nordskog water temp gauge plumbed into my t-stat housing opposite the stock water temp sender). At this temp my wideband O2 has me running around 14.5-14.6 A/F ratio most of the time (at cruise, city or highway, it swings between 14.3 and 14.8 which is normal for a EFI system).

I could see what you're saying if you're running an 160 t-stat but not going from a 193 (stock) to 180. Eventually, yes, the ECU will see the engine as simply not warmed up. How it reacts to that is proprietary (well, may be spec'd in ODBCII). However I haven't seen any A/F ratios that are outside of expected parameters from cruise to WOT and from idle to 3700rpms and I have no reason not to trust what my wideband O2 is telling me.

At any rate I will likely go back to a stock OEM t-stat to see if it has any impact on my 2%-of-the-time cooling issue.

 

[Spook50]

We're way off topic but since we're already here...

With a 180 degree t-stat and a Contour fan with a DCC controller set up for a 180 degree t-stat my truck normally runs around 190-194 with minimal fan effort (I have the same LED that spook is running and I have a Nordskog water temp gauge plumbed into my t-stat housing opposite the stock water temp sender). At this temp my wideband O2 has me running around 14.5-14.6 A/F ratio most of the time (at cruise, city or highway, it swings between 14.3 and 14.8 which is normal for a EFI system).

I could see what you're saying if you're running an 160 t-stat but not going from a 193 (stock) to 180. Eventually, yes, the ECU will see the engine as simply not warmed up. How it reacts to that is proprietary (well, may be spec'd in ODBCII). However I haven't seen any A/F ratios that are outside of expected parameters from cruise to WOT and from idle to 3700rpms and I have no reason not to trust what my wideband O2 is telling me.

At any rate I will likely go back to a stock OEM t-stat to see if it has any impact on my 2%-of-the-time cooling issue.

I keep expecting your av to give me the recipe for Bush's Baked Beans...

Even though your tstat is opening at a lower temperature, I'm still leaning towards there simply not being a large enough opening for enough coolant to travel through and sufficiently carry heat away from the engine. I'd say give the OEM tstat a go and see where that gets you.

 

[Moby]

I keep expecting your av to give me the recipe for Bush's Baked Beans...

Even though your tstat is opening at a lower temperature, I'm still leaning towards there simply not being a large enough opening for enough coolant to travel through and sufficiently carry heat away from the engine. I'd say give the OEM tstat a go and see where that gets you.

Very interesting about the size of the Stant. I think that mine is a Beck/Arney but now that I think back I do recall that it was smaller. I thought that it was due to the lower opening temp but now I'm very suspicious as well. I'm going to call CDan this week and get an OEM back in.

My dog will not give away recipes... he will eat them first just in case they have any nutrition value. Can't be too careful when it comes to food.

 

[ntsqd]

Not to be argumentative, but a small t-stat opening can have a significant advantage. There is coolant system pressure, and then there is block pressure. Block pressure comes from the pump working against a restriction and is even greater than the total system pressure. The positive outcome from that is that the coolant between the pump and the restriction is under an even higher pressure, making it that much harder to boil in localized hot spots. A smaller restriction would increase the block pressure. Depending on the pump's capability that may or may not affect total system flow.

That Toyota worked out a specific restriction size for a given pump would come as no surprise. I also think that the OE t-stat is a good call.

Depending on how smart the ECU is and what the programmed temperature tolerance is, going from a 193 to a 180 could have an effect. It would not be huge, but it might be noticeable by SOP.
I had heard that long term use of the wide bands was hard on them?

 

[xxAg3ntOrang3xx]

Installed these fans 2 weeks ago. Cost me $35 at the local pick-n-pull. Took me about a half-hour to get them out of the car...took another week to put them in the LC.

While I had the stock fan & shroud out, I decided to clean things up a bit. Started brushing the buildup of gunk off of the top of the water pump and noticed a small stream of anti-freeze pissing out. Aparently, the pump had corroded from the inside out and the gunk was the only thing holding it together.

So a week later, a new water pump, belts, hoses, and some paint...I have e-fans in the 62.

Here's some pics:
After the new pump, belts, hoses and paint

The fans all wired up and painted:

And installed:

They've worked great for the short time I've had them in. Based on other's results, I don't anticipate any problems.

 

[rover67]

Be sure to tighten the nuts and bolts that hold the fan motors to the plastic frame on the contour setup and maybe use loctite... Mine came loose on a run after having had the setup for about two years. May not be the case with all of them, just sharing my experiences.

My contour setup with the stock rad keeps my vortec cool enough (like below 210) most all the time, even with the AC blowing, and driving aggresively.

Don't know much about the long term life of the widebands, but we have run them for years on overly rich and lean setups, and changed the sensors just because and not seen any major differences in reported AFR under similar conditions. Wouldn't hesitate to trust one for a long time. We kinda tortured ours (no leaded fuel though) and they did fine.

 

[xxAg3ntOrang3xx]

Be sure to tighten the nuts and bolts that hold the fan motors to the plastic frame on the contour setup and maybe use loctite...

Used nylock nuts...shouldn't have a problem, but I'll check them periodically.

 

[Elbert]

I used lock nuts on mine too....as I did not want crap coming loose.

These fans work very well. I've only had one issue...in that I think I have a loose harness where the power connectors "connect" at times I will have one fan come on and the other does not... I'll wiggle the connector on the drivers side fan and everything is good agagin. I bought two new connectors which I've not installed yet (you can get them from Rock Auto)...the ones that connect to the fan motor.

 

[e30fj62]

this is a must do on my 62, need to start colecting parts...

 

[Dazed]

Hey guys. I keep blowing the 30A fuse on my setup with the contour fan and the flex a lite controller.
Have any ideas why or where I should start checking? I don't.

 

[Spook50]

Hey guys. I keep blowing the 30A fuse on my setup with the contour fan and the flex a lite controller.
Have any ideas why or where I should start checking? I don't.

Sounds to me like there's either a short in the wiring somewhere, or one (or maybe even both) of the motors is damaged and pulling too much current. I'd pull the assembly and connect each motor individually to a 12V source with a high current capable ammeter in series between the source and the motor to see if that's the case.

Before that though, do continuity checks all through your wiring for the fans to make sure it's not just a simple "woopsy".

 

[Elbert]

I'm out on these electric fans for all around use + offroad. I went back to OEM GM fan and fan clutch that match my 1999 5.7 Vortec. I would advise others with V8 swaps to do the same.

 

[Dazed]

Sounds to me like there's either a short in the wiring somewhere, or one (or maybe even both) of the motors is damaged and pulling too much current. I'd pull the assembly and connect each motor individually to a 12V source with a high current capable ammeter in series between the source and the motor to see if that's the case.

Before that though, do continuity checks all through your wiring for the fans to make sure it's not just a simple "woopsy".

Spook
Thanks. I will check back through the wiring when I get it home and test out each fan. I have them running in parallel if I remember correctly. It seems to only be doing it when under heavy load (going up the Camarillo grade into LA, and then again when the engine was still way hot). I had to put a 40A fuse in because that's what i had after I ran out of 30A ones.

The other thing I noticed was that the fuse said 32v, not 12v or 16v. Thoughts?

 

[Elbert]

I recall discussions that load was north of 40amps on initial start....I don't think a 30 amp fuse is enough.

 

[Dazed]

I recall discussions that load was north of 40amps on initial start....I don't think a 30 amp fuse is enough.

Never had an issue with inital start and I've seen the fans run before. It's when they are really going at it under load.