you make it look way too easy in your videos.
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- Thread starter
- #2,323
Here are a couple catch up posts. These are from a while back so some of the details are escaping from memory.
When I pulled the head and had it redone I also swapped in new lower end bearings when I did the minor rebuild. The old ones were still in pretty decent condition but I swapped them anyways.
Here's the ones I took out.
Also before the Rubicon trip I had the rear drive shaft retubed; the old one was dented and giving me some vibs. The splines on the slip are getting close to needing replacement but the CV joint is still in great shape.
Then on the CA trip last summer I was pulling the trailer down and back. This was my first long trip with the twins and was still actively working on tuning. Egts were good but I had used a reducing elbow on the little turbo's outlet and with extended mountain pulls, constant high boost against that silicone elbow proved the failure point of that elbow. I had two back-ups with me on that trip and eventually I popped all of them. After the first one I opened up the exhaust housing on my big turbo (I can adjust it) and kept total boost in the 30s with my right foot. That worked pretty well but I eventually popped another one and put on my last spare. On the way home all was well until the last one let go. From there I had to get "creative" to get us home. That meant duct tape, clamps and zipties. I downshifted during the remaining uphill pulls and watched the gauges religiously and we made it home without further incident. Duct tape only held for the first pull.
When I pulled the head and had it redone I also swapped in new lower end bearings when I did the minor rebuild. The old ones were still in pretty decent condition but I swapped them anyways.
Here's the ones I took out.
Also before the Rubicon trip I had the rear drive shaft retubed; the old one was dented and giving me some vibs. The splines on the slip are getting close to needing replacement but the CV joint is still in great shape.
Then on the CA trip last summer I was pulling the trailer down and back. This was my first long trip with the twins and was still actively working on tuning. Egts were good but I had used a reducing elbow on the little turbo's outlet and with extended mountain pulls, constant high boost against that silicone elbow proved the failure point of that elbow. I had two back-ups with me on that trip and eventually I popped all of them. After the first one I opened up the exhaust housing on my big turbo (I can adjust it) and kept total boost in the 30s with my right foot. That worked pretty well but I eventually popped another one and put on my last spare. On the way home all was well until the last one let go. From there I had to get "creative" to get us home. That meant duct tape, clamps and zipties. I downshifted during the remaining uphill pulls and watched the gauges religiously and we made it home without further incident. Duct tape only held for the first pull.
- Thread starter
- #2,324
Duct tape only lasted for the first pull. I ended up cutting out an over-patch from a previously popped elbow and went to town with zip ties.
This is what got us home, but just barely. You can see where the main hose was continuing to let go.
This is what got us home, but just barely. You can see where the main hose was continuing to let go.
I thought those silicone elbows are rated to 60 psi. How much boost are you making out of those twins? Great job on creativity. I'll add duct tape to my inventory.
- Thread starter
- #2,326
I was experiencing this odd midrange loss. It felt labored and somewhat struggling. I could push past it and the power was back but it almost felt like a miss in that part of the power range. This symptom stuck around for a while as I continued to throw money at it and try out different tunings.
I started playing with injectors.
I picked up new tips and eventually had the pop pressures set to 252 BAR. The new tips are 5x.012 SAC. Now in hindsight I would have set these to 260 bar.
Here's a comparison of the different tips. On the Left are the 5x.014 SAC that I ran for a short while. These were just too big for my set up and what I like. The Middle is the 5x.012 VCO marine nozzle that came on my engine that I've run for several years. On the Right are the new tips, 5x.012 SAC. You'll notice that even though the left and right are both SAC tips they are different sizes. I choose SAC tips because they have a history of being a little tougher than the VCO tips but who knows.
They'll never be this clean again. I used the thinnest sealing washer (~.020" thick) when I put these in.
Then I had to do a bunch of tuning again to play around with them. Ultimately I still had a lazy midrange.
Next I tried an even freer flowing air filter. This is R2C performance newest offering for turbo street application. Because it flowed more it didn't need to be as big. I figured I'd use the Black Hex on the street and then swap over to the White media when I went offroad.
While there was a slight improvement in spool up my midrange symptoms still existed.
I started playing with injectors.
I picked up new tips and eventually had the pop pressures set to 252 BAR. The new tips are 5x.012 SAC. Now in hindsight I would have set these to 260 bar.
Here's a comparison of the different tips. On the Left are the 5x.014 SAC that I ran for a short while. These were just too big for my set up and what I like. The Middle is the 5x.012 VCO marine nozzle that came on my engine that I've run for several years. On the Right are the new tips, 5x.012 SAC. You'll notice that even though the left and right are both SAC tips they are different sizes. I choose SAC tips because they have a history of being a little tougher than the VCO tips but who knows.
They'll never be this clean again. I used the thinnest sealing washer (~.020" thick) when I put these in.
Then I had to do a bunch of tuning again to play around with them. Ultimately I still had a lazy midrange.
Next I tried an even freer flowing air filter. This is R2C performance newest offering for turbo street application. Because it flowed more it didn't need to be as big. I figured I'd use the Black Hex on the street and then swap over to the White media when I went offroad.
While there was a slight improvement in spool up my midrange symptoms still existed.
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- Thread starter
- #2,327
The fine print I didn't read was the temperature. Air compounded is hot and it ended up being a psi at temp over time thing. On hard accelerations it was quick up and down so this was never an issue. When pulling a load up a pass I added the sustained temp part. I figure it warmed up the hose making it soft and then the psi cut right through it along the radius of the elbow since it was being forced to change direction. I've replaced the elbow with metal so at least the path of that boosted hot air is hitting a material that can stand up to it now.
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- Thread starter
- #2,328
Next up was fueling. Maybe the hose size was limiting my fueling. I grabbed a couple of fittings and adapters and converted to 1/2" line going from the lift pump to the main filter head and then from the main filter head to the injection pump. I had previously upsized the line from my prefilter to the lift pump to 1/2" so now it all matched.
This is the section from the main filter head to the injection pump. I was most concerned about the 90 degree bend in the metal line thinking it was restricting fuel. While I'm sure it was a restriction, it wasn't the cause of my midrange symptoms.
This is the section from the main filter head to the injection pump. I was most concerned about the 90 degree bend in the metal line thinking it was restricting fuel. While I'm sure it was a restriction, it wasn't the cause of my midrange symptoms.
- Thread starter
- #2,329
That was enough wrenching for a little while so I got out for some snow wheeling with all this great moisture being pointed at us this winter.
This was on our club's annual Christmas tree run.
It was snowing pretty hard up there but the kids all had a great time playing in the snow while the not so young kids found trees.
I drove around with Esh as he was trying out his new to him Tacoma he had recently picked up. I got some Dora modeling pics.
This was on our club's annual Christmas tree run.
It was snowing pretty hard up there but the kids all had a great time playing in the snow while the not so young kids found trees.
I drove around with Esh as he was trying out his new to him Tacoma he had recently picked up. I got some Dora modeling pics.
Great build, I always look forward to your updates… Thanks!
TLC Norway
woodwelder
Hah, good job on the zip ties. Have you figured out if it's just the pressure taking the hoses out?
Or engine vibrations/tilting?
Or engine vibrations/tilting?
I was experiencing this odd midrange loss. It felt labored and somewhat struggling. I could push past it and the power was back but it almost felt like a miss in that part of the power range. This symptom stuck around for a while as I continued to throw money at it and try out different tunings.
I started playing with injectors.
I picked up new tips and eventually had the pop pressures set to 252 BAR. The new tips are 5x.012 SAC. Now in hindsight I would have set these to 260 bar.
Here's a comparison of the different tips. On the Left are the 5x.014 SAC that I ran for a short while. These were just too big for my set up and what I like. The Middle is the 5x.012 VCO marine nozzle that came on my engine that I've run for several years. On the Right are the new tips, 5x.012 SAC. You'll notice that even though the left and right are both SAC tips they are different sizes. I choose SAC tips because they have a history of being a little tougher than the VCO tips but who knows.
They'll never be this clean again. I used the thinnest sealing washer (~.020" thick) when I put these in.
Then I had to do a bunch of tuning again to play around with them. Ultimately I still had a lazy midrange.
Next I tried an even freer flowing air filter. This is R2C performance newest offering for turbo street application. Because it flowed more it didn't need to be as big. I figured I'd use the Black Hex on the street and then swap over to the White media when I went offroad.
While there was a slight improvement in spool up my midrange symptoms still existed.
How did you set your pop PSI?
How did you determine which size sealing washers you needed?
Where did you get the tips from?
Fantastic work as always.
- Thread starter
- #2,333
It was pressure plus temperature, meaning higher boost numbers for a sustained amount of time. That's when the temperature of the boosted air came into affect for me. I had hit 50+psi numbers multiple times during hard acceleration/testing and never ran into this problem. It was 40+psi pulling a load up the hill in summer that got me. That heat soaked the silicone elbow weakening it and then pressure found its path of least resistance.
- Thread starter
- #2,334
Just to be on the same page, the pop pressure is set by adjusting the preload on that internal spring by varying the thickness of those little washers. I fooled around with them but ended up taking them into a diesel injector shop to have it done correctly. I don't have a pop tester to do it myself.
Sealing washers place the nozzle tip deeper or shallower in the piston bowl. I wanted to place the tip in further since I was going to push more fuel (plus I'm running a wider pattern, 155) to make sure I was spraying in the bowl. I chose the thinnest washer available.
I picked up these tips from Diesel Auto Power. Part No. 12V5X12SAC155. Price was reduced for 4, just had to talk to them on the phone.
Dodge Ram Cummins - 1989-1993 5.9L 12 Valve Dodge Cummins - Fueling and Injection - Fuel Injection Nozzles - Diesel Auto Power, LLC
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I was specifically wondering if you had a pop tester. I've been trying to figure out how to build/get one so I can service injectors at the house.
I can't remember, do you have a 7mm injector head or a 9mm injector head? I'm assuming 7mm head because those look to be 7mm injector tips and I don't see sleeves in any of your pictures.
I can't remember, do you have a 7mm injector head or a 9mm injector head? I'm assuming 7mm head because those look to be 7mm injector tips and I don't see sleeves in any of your pictures.
- Thread starter
- #2,337
Next, I did some changing on my small turbo (secondary). What I had was a Volvo TD04HL-16T. What I basically converted it to was a TD04HL-19T.
16T compressor wheel specs: Inducer: 43.5mm, Exducer: 56mm
19T compressor wheel specs: Inducer: 46mm, Exducer: 58mm
In order to change things out I needed to change the compressor wheel and the compressor housing. The only hitch is that the 16T backing plate is recessed for a 56MM exducer and the 19T wheel has a 58MM exducer. The Volvo world has already dealt with this and offered a conversion wheel that fits a 19T wheel in the 16T backing plate. Instead of getting my backing plate machined I opted to go with the conversion wheel. I got it from ARD tuning Volvo TD04 mitsubishi performance billet compressor wheels
It's an 11 blade wheel.
Superback design
Billet wheel. The idea that it will hold up better to the compounding stresses than the factory cast wheel would.
I picked up a better rebuilt kit and a 19T antisurge compressor housing (housing from: Mitsubishi TD04H-19T TD04HL-19T Turbocharger Compressor Housing w/ Anti Surge Inlet)
Once the parts arrived I pulled the small turbo.
Here's a comparison between the 19T conversion wheel on the left and the factory 16T wheel on the right. The factory wheel is a 6+6 blade design. The conversion wheel works by keeping the base the same size as the 16T (56mm) to fit into the backing plate but have the tips extend past the base following the 19T compressor housing profile. It does loose a little efficiency from a true 19T wheel at the convenience of being a bolt on part.
Because it's billet the center hub can be machined down a little more to reduce weight (helps with spool up) as well as give the blades more surface area which equals more air.
I also converted to a diaphragm style wastegate actuator over my previous spring gate set up to try an get better tune-ability. I made a very simple adjustable boost elbow with a tapped set screw and a tiny bleed port behind the set screw inlet. The barbed part is the outlet of the boost elbow that goes to the diaphragm actuator.
Here is a comparison of the 16T compressor housing on the left and the 19T antisurge housing on the right with the boost elbow installed. I needed to drill and tap a hole for the elbow. I chose an antisurge housing in belief that will give me a little more map cushion with this being compounded.
Made a new bracket to hold the diaphragm style wastegate actuator that will mount to the 19T compressor housing.
Converted from my spring set up to a diaphragm set up. I already had this diaphragm actuator in my collection of turbo parts (came from my original holset WH1C), I just painted it to match the coloring theme.
Here it is installed and angled to line up with intake tubes.
Results:
I needed to play around with the adjustable boost elbow to set the pressure ratio between the two turbos but I could tell there was a more distinct difference of when this set up handshakes the boosting duties. Overall the diaphragm style actuator seems more tunable in my setup than the spring gate setup and neither was harder to set up than the other. I was afraid that drive pressure on the wastegate flapper was going to open the wastegate sooner on this new set up than with my stiff spring on the old set up but it seems to work just fine.
So I got the turbos close to sharing the boosting duties how I want and did some driving. Sadly I had not thrown enough money at it and I was still getting my midrange problem . Turbos did spool a little better than before and the exhaust seemed to be a little cleaner once spooled due to more airflow. I didn't see an increase in overall boost. At this point I started driving it a little less as I continued to hunt through forums and threads that might offer me another direction.
16T compressor wheel specs: Inducer: 43.5mm, Exducer: 56mm
19T compressor wheel specs: Inducer: 46mm, Exducer: 58mm
In order to change things out I needed to change the compressor wheel and the compressor housing. The only hitch is that the 16T backing plate is recessed for a 56MM exducer and the 19T wheel has a 58MM exducer. The Volvo world has already dealt with this and offered a conversion wheel that fits a 19T wheel in the 16T backing plate. Instead of getting my backing plate machined I opted to go with the conversion wheel. I got it from ARD tuning Volvo TD04 mitsubishi performance billet compressor wheels
It's an 11 blade wheel.
Superback design
Billet wheel. The idea that it will hold up better to the compounding stresses than the factory cast wheel would.
I picked up a better rebuilt kit and a 19T antisurge compressor housing (housing from: Mitsubishi TD04H-19T TD04HL-19T Turbocharger Compressor Housing w/ Anti Surge Inlet)
Once the parts arrived I pulled the small turbo.
Here's a comparison between the 19T conversion wheel on the left and the factory 16T wheel on the right. The factory wheel is a 6+6 blade design. The conversion wheel works by keeping the base the same size as the 16T (56mm) to fit into the backing plate but have the tips extend past the base following the 19T compressor housing profile. It does loose a little efficiency from a true 19T wheel at the convenience of being a bolt on part.
Because it's billet the center hub can be machined down a little more to reduce weight (helps with spool up) as well as give the blades more surface area which equals more air.
I also converted to a diaphragm style wastegate actuator over my previous spring gate set up to try an get better tune-ability. I made a very simple adjustable boost elbow with a tapped set screw and a tiny bleed port behind the set screw inlet. The barbed part is the outlet of the boost elbow that goes to the diaphragm actuator.
Here is a comparison of the 16T compressor housing on the left and the 19T antisurge housing on the right with the boost elbow installed. I needed to drill and tap a hole for the elbow. I chose an antisurge housing in belief that will give me a little more map cushion with this being compounded.
Made a new bracket to hold the diaphragm style wastegate actuator that will mount to the 19T compressor housing.
Converted from my spring set up to a diaphragm set up. I already had this diaphragm actuator in my collection of turbo parts (came from my original holset WH1C), I just painted it to match the coloring theme.
Here it is installed and angled to line up with intake tubes.
Results:
I needed to play around with the adjustable boost elbow to set the pressure ratio between the two turbos but I could tell there was a more distinct difference of when this set up handshakes the boosting duties. Overall the diaphragm style actuator seems more tunable in my setup than the spring gate setup and neither was harder to set up than the other. I was afraid that drive pressure on the wastegate flapper was going to open the wastegate sooner on this new set up than with my stiff spring on the old set up but it seems to work just fine.
So I got the turbos close to sharing the boosting duties how I want and did some driving. Sadly I had not thrown enough money at it and I was still getting my midrange problem . Turbos did spool a little better than before and the exhaust seemed to be a little cleaner once spooled due to more airflow. I didn't see an increase in overall boost. At this point I started driving it a little less as I continued to hunt through forums and threads that might offer me another direction.
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- Joined
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What about adding a wideband 02 sensor to see what is happening with fueling/air?
I think you need to drive my stock 105 HP with an h1c and you''ll remember how far you've come.
- Thread starter
- #2,340
That would be fun to see the difference. I've been itching to hit the dunes down south again. Might have to add this to the agenda.