Empiric Data: OEM vs. Personal Opinions

[Heritage 2020]

Greetings All,

This applies to oil, consumables, hardware, software, etc,….

FACTS:

I recommend that you ignore every “EXPERT WHO SAYS OEM OR AFTERMARKET IS SUPERIOR.”

OEM isn’t better/worse. OEM posters may own a ton of Toyota parts that they have to sell.

Anyone who says OEM is SUPERIOR has no empiric data.

I will never state “superior”, nor “as good as”, or “worse” without a database of empiric data.

Curmudgeonly experience means zip, zero, nada—except you have been around for a loooooong while.
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NOTE TO ALL:

I personally have been 100% guilty of stating that “this is better/superior/as good.”

MY EGO is involved.

I HAVE ZERO financial interests in what works or does not—as I am a motorsports enthusiast and consumer.

Capitalism means OEM and aftermarket are subject to the same forces.

Marketing is genius: OEM is the way to go vs. we have a superior aftermarket mousetrap.

We don’t know whether OEM vs aftermarket is better/worse/same—so leave it at that.

As a veteran professional mechanical engineer, I am 100% wrong for letting my “experience” related biases cloud the board—but I am human.
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FUTURE:

If you have a vested interest say so.

I will only post superirority or equivalence messages if there is a body of research/data that demonstrates something.

Otherwise: I call bull**** and you should as well.

If your setup works for you—be thankful.

———————-

FAIR ENOUGH?

NOTE: If I ever post that a part is superior, assume I own a lot of them—and want to sell them.

Call me out as I will do the same—show the data.

 

[04UZJ100]

Ok. Cool?

Bottom line, 3rd party manufacturers have no where near the R&D budget that Toyota does. Period. Like for like replacement (not including MODS), OEM is 99% the best option.

 

[Coupedncal]

Isn’t this true not all OEM parts are made in-house by Toyota. Some parts are made by third party and sold as OEM?

 

[04UZJ100]

Isn’t this true not all OEM parts are made in-house by Toyota. Some parts are made by third party and sold as OEM?

Toyota doesn’t manufacture everything. They have a number of JDM manufacturers who provide parts to them per their specifications.

 

[32cls6speedmt]

Toyota Group - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Aisin and denso are partially owned by Toyota. Majority of our 200 series has denso or aisin parts. Only the transfer case is made by borg Wagner

Also, in the past Subaru assembled Toyota Camrys in Indiana.

 

[INTP]

Denso wiper blades are the best.

 

[Sandroad]

As a scientist, I’m a believer in empirical information, but I can also accept supporting lines of relevant information, with or without controlled experiments. In the case of OEM parts vs aftermarket, I think there is a compelling line of relevant information supporting OEM part use. OEM parts are engineered, built, and tested by Toyota or contractual suppliers to OEM standards for fit, initial quality, and durability. That is a known fact. In most cases, It is unknown whether or not aftermarket parts have the same engineering, build quality, and testing. Since OEM parts are a known and aftermarket parts are an unknown, that is enough evidence for me to recommend OEM over aftermarket parts.

And I have no OEM parts to sell!

 

[bloc]

I’ve started calling real Toyota parts “Genuine Toyota” because technically an Aisin or Denso part could be Original Equipment Manufacturer.. and while most likely very very high quality, doesn’t have the guarantee @Sandroad speaks of.

 

[Heritage 2020]

As a scientist, I’m a believer in empirical information, but I can also accept supporting lines of relevant information, with or without controlled experiments. In the case of OEM parts vs aftermarket, I think there is a compelling line of relevant information supporting OEM part use. OEM parts are engineered, built, and tested by Toyota or contractual suppliers to OEM standards for fit, initial quality, and durability. That is a known fact. In most cases, It is unknown whether or not aftermarket parts have the same engineering, build quality, and testing. Since OEM parts are a known and aftermarket parts are an unknown, that is enough evidence for me to recommend OEM over aftermarket parts.

And I have no OEM parts to sell!

@Sandroad

Agreed. I’m wearing my mech engineer hat with the dunce cap spinner this morning.

OEM is a clearly defined control group—a known quantity that is designed to get your vehicle through the warranty period (by hamstrung engineers in combination with the finance department if we are talking about a profit based corporation).

In the case of the Land Cruiser we have observational data indicating that x% of LCs surpass 200k miles (although we don’t know how the data was calculated and the sample size).

Based on that, Land Cruiser, Sequoia, 4Runner, Tacoma—is within percentage points of several GM and Ford SUVs.

Variables (all subjective):

1. I maintain my vehicles religiously. Thus, my current 2016 F250 6.7L PSD with 211k on the clock pulling an RV—with no signs of slowing down, will likely continue to do for a million miles. Highly subjective.

2. This 2016 F250 truck has a ****load of aftermarket parts—including the air filter, airbox, various deletes, and fluids that are of my choosing. Everything has been modded. I don’t know what is extending nor worsening things vs OEM Motorcraft parts.

3. OEM is the control arm. I cannot say that my truck runs great due to the absence of OEM parts—nor the inclusion of all the aftermarket mods.

4. The presence of aftermarket consumables, parts, etc.—provide a subjective bias since I have had good results with them (or poor ones).

5. Factoring in how many Land Cruisers, F250s, etc—all operating under different parameters and we have NOTHING but opinions.

6. At the end of the day, my belief is that we should enjoy our vehicles and run them into the ground. That is just my candid opinion.

Someone else may choose to ceramic/bubble wrap/hermetically seal their Land Cruiser—with the hope of investment status (which is laughable to me)—yet not for me to judge.

I don’t have issue with those who seek to keep their LCs factory pristine with OEM parts.

Moving forward—unless we have empiric data:

“My experience is that ____part works well for me in my application”

VS. “Dude, all King/Fox/Icon parts are great but OEM suspension is superior”.

Sheesh, let’s not start again with consumables—filters, oils,…lol!!

 

[Leelanau]

You know these are daily conversations at the engineering lunch table!

My son just finished his first year of undergrad engineering at Cincinnati. We had a very nerdy discussion of soil types yesterday.

Different discipline, equally nerdy!

 

[Heritage 2020]

You know these are daily conversations at the engineering lunch table!

My son just finished his first year of undergrad engineering at Cincinnati. We had a very nerdy discussion of soil types yesterday.

Different discipline, equally nerdy!

Congrats to your son. I took environmental engineering once—and we affectionately called the class “dirt”.

 

[FxFormat]

I wrench for a living, light duty stuff. If you have had nightmarish experience trying to install bad fitting aftermarket parts you’ll appreciate using oem parts.

 

[DrDuc]

I’m a stats/empirical data freak most of the time. I resonate strongly with Thomas Sowell’s, “Show me the evidence,” battle cry. That said, sometimes, factories work with, even subsidize, aftermarket manufacturers who develop better parts through their racing programs. If aftermarket parts have proven themselves reliable and to fit well in racing applications, I have no problem recommending them over OEM even though they may not have had the same amount of data as OEM to support their claim that they are the better product.