Dead 1977 FJ55 - Need Help Getting Started

[blackmarsh]

First off - I am new to the board; I live in Utah and work at a desk all day. Enough about me.

I think a picture is obligatory (sorry none in color at the moment). Wagon is gray and white and was made pretty by my older brother whom sold it for another 55. Long story short: It survived a roll over in soft snow by the new owner, the engine later siezed and then wound up back in the family... but it isn't running. I've had it for more than just a few years and installed a motor I bought from a local.

The current engine needs to be rebuilt (I got less than fifty miles out of it) and it is a hybrid of an F block (1974) and F2 head. I'm no pro. so I wouldn't have known what problems to look for starting out.

I will start with just a few questions and go from there because I am saving for this project and have a little time to shop around for the best solution.

1. (The easy way out) Anyone in Utah cheap enough to do it for me?
2. I have not been able to find oil pumps for the 1974. I see them listed as 1958-1969 or 1976-1980 but none for 1974.
3. When it comes to machine work do I need to have the piston chambers bored out before ordering new pistons?

Getting this running again is a sort of proof of manhood at this point. The poor guy is sitting in a field at my Father's place just rotting.

The FJ55 that my bother replaced the one above with was problematic (putting it nicely) and he wound up with a 60's Suburban instead. Years later my brother returned by buying this 1976 TLC:

However he has again left the cruiser world which is a shame (hint hint).

Any rebuild advice appreciated - but I am not considering a Chevrolet (or other) conversion at this time.

 

[PabloCruise]

Welcome to MUD!!!

 

[Pighead]

o.k., blackmarsh, I need more info...the year of your gray/white Pig ('73? '74?).
A 2F head on a 2F block? Interesting. Just the opposite of what I did. I think a 2F oil pump will fit the f block, but you'll need a 2F oil pan or rearrange the baffles in the F oil pan. I'll let the locals chime in on who is close by that can help you, but is Proffit's shop in your area?
You got 50 miles out of a re-build? What happened? Forget to push the distributor all the way in? I'm afraid you're gonna have to pull that engine, disassemble and find the cause. New pistons usually require a bore job to the block, a bore job always requires new pistons. Let the machine shop order new pistons if needed.
Do you have an engine lift? A big engine stand? I want pics of your engine tear-down...good luck.

 

[PabloCruise]

Howdy again!

I would start by getting to know Kurt Williams - owner of Cruiser Outfitters in SLC - https://forum.ih8mud.com/member.php?u=861

Also, Mark Whatley did a write-up about mixing F and 2F blocks and heads, and how to deal with the oil systems. You can search for posts by Mark W, or head over and search the archives of the LCML at www.birfield.com.

Mark is up in Alaska though, so go visit Kurt - he is a good egg...

 

[cardinal fang]

To quote a line rom the infamous and funniest movie ever made(MP &SHG)..... "Run away, run away" ;p Once you are hooked on pigs, your life no longer belongs to you! Your wife will think your having an affair in the garage, because that is where you be spending all your time
Welcome! This is the place to get all those questions you have about your 55 answered or direction where to find the answer. A very wise choice, you have made.
Pighead and Pablo are correct. Good advice, they give. Send Mark Whatley an email with your qeustions. He is MR. land cruiser! Knows everything there is know about LC motors.
F motors were in LC until 1974. The 2f came out in 1975. The oil pumps for the F should be good until 1974. You will know for sure when you tear down the engine and see if they match.
Overboring an engine will require new pistons. Rods should be good with new bearings. First, though, is to have the cylinders mic'ed to see if they need reboring. Most like they will be tapered from the top to the bottom from wear. From what I have seen on this board and Pirate, expect to spend $2k+ to rebuild the old F engine. The option might be to just buy a used 2F motor. A lot of those are floating around the Land Cruiser community. Should be easy to get.
In the meantime, send us lots of pics of you pig. PLEASE

 

[MiniPigg]

1974 F longblock with 2F head? Hmmm... thats a little backarsewards.

In 1974 Toyota had two engines they used in the FJ55. The first was the early model F engine with the oil filter on the bulkhead and oil lines coming out and past the exhaust. The oil spout was on the passengers side. The oiling system was not as good.
The later 1974 engine was the missing link between the F and 2F. I see people calling it a 2F but its actually an F engine. The oiling system was redesigned for better lubrication. The heads for this F series are interchangable with the 2F and I believe the 3F. The oil spout is on the valve cover and the oil filter sits next to and in front of the distributor on the passengers side. Instead of hanging it sits attop the mount.
So what we need to do is find out which F series engine you have. Can you send in a pic showing the passengers side?

The cylinder head used on the later 1974 F series engine has smaller chambers. It is a performance upgrade for those running a 2F. It would be best to use the stock head for that year. They are hard to find being they really only were used in 1974 and part of 1975. The valve trains between this F and the 2F interchange and the 2F valve train in or around 1977 was a liter one so it would be an upgrade for the 1974 F engine. Wont work on earlier F series engines.

Oil pump... You need to remove this so it can be properly matched. But I think you can use the oil pump for the 75+ 2F engine if the F engine you have is the missing link 2F.

After you get it down to a bare block take it to a machine shop you trust and isnt going to charge you a bazillion dollars. They will clean it and check for cracks and then mic the cylinders out to tell you what size it needs to be bored out. Make sure you mark your main bearing caps and include them with the bare block. Might as welll look at having the crankshaft checked. Remove the rods from the pistons. Take those in as well. They can recondition the rods and correct to make them the same weight and length. Have the flyhweel checked, turned, balanced. Inspect the crank pulley.

thats it for now....

 

[blackmarsh]

A special note... the distributor not being all the way down is what started this whole mess to begin with. A shop replaced the side gasket for the owner that bought it from my brother and the dist. wasn't secured that last half inch or so.

My 55 is a 1977. I may be remembering the engine wrong but I got the engine from a local named Royal. With so many others doing things the other way maybe this engine was the result of the left over halves. I honestly think I should have held onto the original engine (was in an apartment where I couldn't store it) but this engine was expected to work. Maybe it did and I botched it.

The truth is the engine was doing well and I dropped the cruiser off to have it inspected. When I picked it up it ran horrible. They said they couldn't even do the test because it wouldn't stay running. I drove it home and the engine was so extremely loud I thought it was going to grenade before I made the two mile stretch.

I really didn't know if I had to replace the pistons every time or not. That is definitely good info. Since doing the tear down and rebuild I've had back surgery and broken some bones in one of my legs so all the heavy lifting because a might bit more difficult. That got me looking into the option of paying someone else to do it...

Cruiser Outfitters costs a might bit more than I can afford and general machine shops are either too expensive or run by meth addicts. Sometimes both.

Oh, and I've been into pigs for along time but I've had to live vicariously through my brother as mine sat in the weather. I'm trying to change that. Damn it.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

...My 55 is a 1977. I may be remembering the engine wrong but I got the engine from a local named Royal.

Royal Rose from Utah County by chance? He had a 55 that now sports a Cummins 6 cyl (now belongs to Brian Steen).

I know of a couple used motors for sale here in the SL Valley, Hit me up with an email if your interested. kurt@cruiseroutfitters.com

 

[blackmarsh]

It was Mr. Rose. I don't know him well but he used to live near my sister so my brother and I spoke to him several times. I believe he had a Montero back in those days too. I used to see him around a lot but I haven't even seen an FJ55 in Utah County for five months or so. Then again I don't get out much.

I picked up the engine from him when he still had that Cummins 55; back in 1998. Damn. My LC has been sitting for about nine years. My pig is up in Heber right now and when I was up there last it was full of dead wasps.

Shame.

 

[blackmarsh]

Beyond anything illegal does anyone have any experience with finding a home for old petrol? The vehicle has a full tank of fuel that is five plus years old.

The shelf-life of fuel isn't great; any concerns to the vehicle I should be aware of with the old gas?

 

[cruiseroutfit]

It was Mr. Rose. I don't know him well but he used to live near my sister so my brother and I spoke to him several times. I believe he had a Montero back in those days too. I used to see him around a lot but I haven't even seen an FJ55 in Utah County for five months or so. Then again I don't get out much.

Royal is sporting an 80 series now, his 55 resides in Idaho with Brian (both are here on Mud from time to time).

 

[PabloCruise]

My pig is up in Heber right now and when I was up there last it was full of dead wasps.

Shame.

Beats having a Pig full of live wasps!!!

 

[blackmarsh]

Cruiser Outfitters costs a might bit more than I can afford and general machine shops are either too expensive or run by meth addicts. Sometimes both.

Turns out I was getting Cruiser Outfitters confused with Cruiser Engineering. Anyone had work done by them and can give an honest opinion of dealing with them? The last time I called it sounded like the guy was on the toilet. IE Not a good impression.

 

[PabloCruise]

No idea about Cruiser Engineering.

Everytime I talk to Kurt at Cruiser Outfitters, he sounds like everything is o-k (ie: NOT in the bathroom) Swing by and visit Kurt - he is a class act!

 

[blackmarsh]

From the website it looked like Cruiser Outfitters just sells parts - IE my interest in Cruiser Engineering.

 

[PabloCruise]

From the website it looked like Cruiser Outfitters just sells parts - IE my interest in Cruiser Engineering.

Kurt does good work - give him a a call (when he is not in the can!!! )

 

[blackmarsh]

I will ask - hoping I haven't poked his feelings too much.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

I will ask - hoping I haven't poked his feelings too much.

Not at all dude.. I get along great with Dave over at Cruiser Engineering, we kindve specialize in different things. I'll reply to you email. Thanks!