Credit where credit is due

[ramangain]

Coming from FL as my home-base until October, I need to give the government and folks of NM proper credit for suppressing spiking COVID cases recently. I enjoy peeking at the Google COVID statistics on certain states, and NM did aa good job. Folks wear masks religiously outside (at least where I'm staying in NE ABQ). Nice work folks.

FL could learn a lesson or two from you folks.

 

[Mauser]

I had something typed up, but I decided to delete it.

If you live your life afraid of dying, then there is no reason to live.

 

[NyNomad]

all about flattening the curve right!. Even if that means destroying the lively hoods of others

 

[SteveLCetc]

"It ain't over 'til it's over." Flatenning the curve is also stretching it out.

 

[pappy]

"It ain't over 'til it's over." Flatenning the curve is also stretching it out.

Steve is right here. I've been saying two things. First, we need to stop looking at absolute numbers, and look at per cap (per 1000) population, or a percentage of the total.

Per Cap COVID infected (official, it's realistically higher) = 5.78% of the population in NM
Per Cap death rate = .094%

Second is this ...

NM Leading Causes of Death, 2017 (the last year on the CDC website)
Heart Disease 3,896
Cancer 3,620
Accidents 1,460
Chronic Lower Respiratory Disease 1,143
Stroke 878
Flu/Pheumonia 338

The American Cancer Society estimates that 3730 people will die of cancer in NM this year (2020).

As of yesterday, COVID deaths in NM = 1,978

I also wonder how many of the official COVID deaths were really caused by one of the "underlying conditions" listed, but because they just happened test positive they became a COVID statistic.

Ya, dying is not good. But look at the numbers and draw your own conclusion. The goal of slowing the spread should be to keep the medical system from getting slammed.

And for the record, as an old dude I don't want this s***. I'm a masker in public indoor spaces, but not outside unless it's crowded.

 

[Whiskerz]

Steve is right here. I've been saying two things. First, we need to stop looking at absolute numbers, and look at per cap (per 1000) population, or a percentage of the total.

Per Cap COVID infected (official, it's realistically higher) = 5.78% of the population in NM
Per Cap death rate = .094%

Second is this ...

NM Leading Causes of Death, 2017 (the last year on the CDC website)
Heart Disease 3,896
Cancer 3,620
Accidents 1,460
Chronic Lower Respiratory Disease 1,143
Stroke 878
Flu/Pheumonia 338

The American Cancer Society estimates that 3730 people will die of cancer in NM this year (2020).

As of yesterday, COVID deaths in NM = 1,978

I also wonder how many of the official COVID deaths were really caused by one of the "underlying conditions" listed, but because they just happened test positive they become a COVID statistic.

Ya, dying is not good. But look at the numbers and draw your own conclusion. The goal of slowing the spread should be to keep the medical system from getting slammed.

And for the record, as an old dude I don't want this s***. I'm a masker in public indoor spaces, but not outside unless it's crowded.

This is the truth Covid is being blamed for deaths that are not Covid and even using that as a bump the Covid deaths on a percentage basis are very low. I have a friend whose uncle died earlier this year from a heart attack he was 72 and not a specimen of health. death certificate came back as covid because they claim he tested positive for Covid anti bodies. Every other disease that the CDC tracks has had a drop in deaths this year. Heck of a coincidence. Then we have closings which are killing small businesses. Several near me have closed including my barber. They could not survive months of no income and pay for a building. This will destroy the economy in states with closings dragging out forever. If 2 weeks works then why do it more than once ?If it does not work why do it again.


Comparing Florida cases to New Mexico in raw numbers is pants on the head retarded. Florida has over 10 times the population of New Mexico. 20,000 cases in New Mexico is a .01 of the population. In Florida that is less than .001 of the population and almost statically insignificant .

 

[ramangain]

The goal of slowing the spread should be to keep the medical system from getting slammed.

This is my point. As medically fragile myself, I'd prefer an appropriate hospital bed to be available if needed.

 

[Whiskerz]

This is my point. As medically fragile myself, I'd prefer an appropriate hospital bed to be available if needed.

They built emergency facilities for Covid patients here in Georgia and they went unused. My friend who is over the nursing department in a north Georgia hospital says the occupancy rate for ICU beds is unchanged since before the panic started. They stay around 80% . They have eliminated a lot of elective surgery so they have a lot of free staff to take care of Covid patients.

 

[Mauser]

This is my point. As medically fragile myself, I'd prefer an appropriate hospital bed to be available if needed.

Sorry, you are in the wrong state for that. The governess has not only run off hospital staff, but has probably already promised your bed to someone from another state.

 

[marcfj60]

If anything is obvious, we're all worried and angry. I look at the statistics and think what the hell are we so worried about. Then I make the mistake of watching/reading the news and see the worst of the worst and get worried. Then I think of my 88 year old grandmother in a care facility in TX that caught COVID and then recovered from it before anyone in the family was ever notified. I think of my 68 year old father who has smoked all his life and is 50 lbs overweight and worry about him when he goes to Walmart during senior hours once every two weeks and nowhere else. What I would love to see is decisions being made based on sound scientific data and people telling the truth about the reality of the situation instead of the system that seems to be in place right now. And I would love to see no politics in the mix because that just is smoke, mirrors and mud. Some states are wide open and others are locked down tighter than bark on a tree. Yet, statistically, those two classes of states have similar numbers per capita. I think numbers are somewhat worse in NM even with our heavy restriction because of our levels of poverty, poor access to health care and the large number of households with many generations living in them. I recently looked at the CDC for deaths and causes for the entire US (2018). Cancer and heart disease both killed 2X as many people as COVID has been attributed to. And how many COVID deaths have one of those or other serious medical conditions as a comorbidity?

Don't misunderstand me. I think COVID is real. It is dangerous. It is worse than the flu. It is killing lots of people. I mask up in any indoor space. I haven't seen my father in person in months. I haven't been to any parties or gatherings with friends or family in nearly a year. I have had a few people over to the house but only if the weather was decent enough to sit outside on the porch. But I also think our government's response to the situation has been poorly planned and is very inconsistent. And the decisions that are being made are being done without regard to real data and understanding. And a near total shutdown of our society does not seem to be the best way to manage the situation.

 

[SteveLCetc]

Another thing to consider is that the CDC recently estimated that there are 8 times as many people who have actually been infected as have been diagnosed, which means a couple of things. First, for most it's either asymptomatic or very mildly symptomatic, the other is that in NM around 40% have had it - halfway to herd immunity anyway.

Still, you never know how it's going to hit *you*, so stay safe!

 

[pappy]

... the other is that in NM around 40% have had it - halfway to herd immunity anyway.

Still, you never know how it's going to hit *you*, so stay safe!

It wasn't until recently that I knew somebody personally that had it. I've heard the stories, of course. Not having personal experience with it in my core group of friends also helps to skew the severity perception. Until they start mass antibody testing we won't know what the actual number is. But, I'm quite certain the government doesn't want that answer.

 

[ramangain]

I will offer more insight to my opinion since I am an external who has just come to the area, and I have been in two places that took vastly different approaches.

1. Oregon. They came down crushingly hard from day one of the pandemic (my sister lives in Eugene & is in the healthcare field, and she was telling me how things are done before I went there in August and October). To their credit, things were mostly in control until they opened up the U of O campus in the fall, and then things started getting out of hand.

2. Florida. I caught COVID (almost certainly) when some dip**** house inspector came to my mom's house (which I was preparing to sell) and essentially stood three inches from the door when I opened it with no mask. MY FAULT, I did not put a mask on before I opened the door. However, that quick interaction (before I put on my mask) was all it took for me to get COVID. I had mild symptoms (brown rain, aching, mild fever, persistent but unproductive cough) that lasted 2-3 weeks. How many other people did this dip**** inspector infect? This type of behavior is rampant in Central Florida. Folks would throw hissy fits when they couldn't enter a store without a mask - probably one an hour on average. You've probably seen some of the general retardedness that happens in Florida; how they approached COVID is no different, in general.

No system is perfect, and many are far from it. Almost everyone hates the system that is in place where they live since it put some form of uncomfortable dent in his/her pre-pandemic way of life. Waiting 2+ hours to get into any Costco in ABQ in the current weather conditions absolutely sucks. However, I use it as an opportunity to listen to an interesting podcast, and last time I happened to pick up the non-biodegradable trash while snaking through the line and toss it in the trash can at the front of the line.

I'm rambling. BASED ON MY EXPERIENCE, I just wanted to thank the local folks for taking COVID seriously and performing active measures to try and keep the local emergency medical care system from crashing. I've seen what not giving a $hit looks like in Central FL, and it ain't pretty.

 

[alia176]

You provided some good insights as someone who is new to this state and been around other states. People will bitch no matter what and the government's actions will always be the bullseye. It's a no win situation for any govt, but I do know that state govts don't want to lose money from missed revenues and decrease their chances at re-election so they're not shutting businesses down willy nilly as some folks tend to think. Everyone thinks they know better, as if they have couple of epidemiologists and experts on infectious diseases in their household.

 

[Mauser]

If there is anything that we can all agree on I think its that this virus isn't going to just go away.

That being said if we are to live any sort of "normal" life we are going to get the virus if we haven't already had it. So, if masks work are we just postponing the inevitable?

Some people put their faith in a mask and the government protecting them, some put their faith elsewhere. I have not worn a mask yet, and believe all politicians are liars. If you want to wear a mask or frilly pink panties outside your pants I don't care.

As for the "experts", they are on both sides of every debate. The sad part is that too many people pick which side to believe because of politics.

 

[alia176]

Only Lexus owners can wear the frilly pink panties

CDC & WHO have pushed masks and countries like China, Korea and Vietnam been wearing masks for years and I don't think it's for protection against dirty air pollution. Those countries have been dealing with air born infectious diseases for what seems like a very long time. I don't think they've been wearing masks for a fashion statement

 

[pappy]

If there is anything that we can all agree on I think its that this virus isn't going to just go away.

Swine flu, H1N1, from 2009 is still out there. It's been included in every flu shot since then.

The BS that the COVID vaccine was produced in record time is an outright lie. H1N1 was discovered in April 2009 (in California). By October 2009 the vaccine was available. By December 2009 the vaccine was opened up to anyone who wanted it.

 

[ramangain]

I do believe the general idea is to try and not contract COVID (mask wearing, hand washing, etc.) until you elect to get vaccinated. If you elect not to get vaccinated, that is your protocol.

My personal opinion is that it is irresponsible to not wear a mask if the following conditions have not been met:

1. You are around people you don't know and you haven't checked with them if you not wearing a mask is OK with them, and them moving out of the shared space is not an option if they say "no" (standing in a line, you entering the home of "them", etc). Just my opinion.

For instance, when I head up to Mauser's place to work on my rig, neither of us wear a mask. When I showed up in NM, I quarantined for 10+ days (even though I had COVID previously) as a precaution I was not an active carrier. Mauser and I implicitly agreed beforehand that no mask was OK with both of us. Kosher. No issues since (I hope).

Were I attend a clandestine meetup with y'all folks, I'd wear a mask. Not because I fear getting COVID again, but MAYBE I'm a current carrier from some unknown source, and MAYBE one of you is a carrier and I don't want to become a carrier and infect my inner circle (one of my house-mates gets sick really easily). In my mind, this is my logic at work.

I've blabbed too much, again. Job hunting is boring!

 

[LXKevin]

Politics
Sucks.

 

[vegasfj40]

I think until you actually lose a loved one from it, some people will think it's a hoax. It was very difficult losing my mother in law from Covid last month. Now she did have underlying conditions and was 89. But it was absolutely not the way we were expecting her to pass. I know otherwise healthy people that have had it and really struggled with it for weeks and a couple that were fine after a few days. Governors are in a no win situation with this. Shutting down businesses is not a decision any of then want to make. I think what Pappy said about keeping our already fragile state health care from getting overwhelmed is the main reason for shutdowns. I don't agree with the way some of the shutdowns have happened, ie, keeping big box stores open but the little guys have to close. I agree with what Warren Buffett said today that small businesses in this country need more stimulus now.