Why are these being made out of titanium? Is that what makes YotaMD's (or others) cost so much? I would be interested in the economy edition, if there is an alternative to the $10 amazon / ebay ones.
Cedar's key fob build thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Ohthetrees
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The amount of titanium is so small it doesn't add much incremental cost to the final product, and it is the best material for the job. I think the price YotaMD charges is fair. We are all used to super cheap stuff which is manufactured in vast numbers in china by people earning very low wages. These fobs are small run boutique items, made with relatively expensive manufacturing techniques.
Basically you are paying enough that it is worth his time to manufacture, sell, ship, and support these things. And for an American, making short runs of a niche product in the USA, I guess that price is about $80.
I use grade 5 titanium in the YotaMD shell because it cuts very well (this is the most critical consideration), it's completely corrosion resistant, it's stronger than aluminum (and most steels) and lighter than steel.
However, the material cost of the titanium is small in the overall cost structure. The machining of the titanium costs as much or more than the material itself - and that's running batches of hundreds of part sets at a time so pricing is about as low as it can get. It's just not much material, so you might as well use the best.
For the YotaMD fob, you're not just paying for good raw materials. You're paying for a top shelf product made 100% in the USA with the best materials and most accurate manufacturing techniques available backed up by premium customer service on a design that has been proven out by over 1500 customers in [I'm pretty sure] every state in the US and more countries than I've been able to keep track of. An awful lot of work goes on behind the scenes to ensure that you can open the YotaMD package and assemble the key blade/remote you already have in about a minute into the new shell.
Oh, and you're supporting an enthusiast that cares about making parts that are worthy of the legendary vehicles they accompany.
I've been following this thread and and have gone back and forth on how I feel about this whole thing. On the one hand, the OP did an awesome job for a DIY and should be commended. On the other hand, I didn't get the feeling that @suprarx7nut was given the credit he deserved for the design that, obviously, heavily inspired the OP and all the work he put into it was trivialized by the OP's tone. That being said, I think that @Ohthetrees has clarified his position in subsequent posts.
So, how about we talk about the real takeaway from this post: Can we get a collab going where we can get those custom colored clamshells with the TEQ logo made to fit the YotaMD keys?
So, how about we talk about the real takeaway from this post: Can we get a collab going where we can get those custom colored clamshells with the TEQ logo made to fit the YotaMD keys?
If @suprarx7nut believes it's a copy then he should contact his lawyer and have @Ohthetrees stop making them - even for personal use is Copyright infringement.
Or if @suprarx7nut doesn't have a patent then ANYONE can file and have both members stop producing this item and recoup missed revenue.
This is a big mess these days - I have a product that I produce, filed for a patent and now others produce my product... I can pay a lawyer to fight each vendor but in reality the only thing this solves is MAYBE they will stop selling the item but then they just shut down the LLC and open a new one and do it all over again. My patent lawyer said if it was his business he would abandon the patent and just let others sell my design OR I can pay him more money than I will ever receive for nothing.
I have @suprarx7nut key fob and absolutely LOVE IT and when I buy again I will go with YotaMD
@Ohthetrees don't let anyone talk you out of a design - if it's too close to another you will get a letter from a lawyer
Or if @suprarx7nut doesn't have a patent then ANYONE can file and have both members stop producing this item and recoup missed revenue.
This is a big mess these days - I have a product that I produce, filed for a patent and now others produce my product... I can pay a lawyer to fight each vendor but in reality the only thing this solves is MAYBE they will stop selling the item but then they just shut down the LLC and open a new one and do it all over again. My patent lawyer said if it was his business he would abandon the patent and just let others sell my design OR I can pay him more money than I will ever receive for nothing.
I have @suprarx7nut key fob and absolutely LOVE IT and when I buy again I will go with YotaMD
@Ohthetrees don't let anyone talk you out of a design - if it's too close to another you will get a letter from a lawyer
It costs 10's of thousands to even get a preliminary patent and takes years to get a real one, which is why @suprarx7nut doesn't have one, and that is not counting the 10's of thousands of lawyer fees to defend the patent which is likely not practical. At this point, I think it is more of an ethical issue than a legal one. @Ohthetrees is seemingly legally free and clear to do whatever he wants, including make an exact copy of the YotaMD product and sell them for profit, but I would say the ethical ground is significantly more muddy.
Hmmm, I own two and there's nothing flimsy about them. Purchased after one OEM broke and the other was cracking. Can't see how one would be flimsy unless it was assembled incorrectly.
I think it would be great to have more quality options for key cases (as opposed to the very cheap ones on ebay/amazon)...including cutting ones own. No offense, but I think the price is just about 4X too high for the YotaMD version, given the utility.
Don't get me wrong: It's great when people design items for our vehicles, but I'll bet you would sell a whole lot more than 1500 if the price was palatable. I think it's great that @Ohthetrees designed his own, and people ought to lay off him for the concept that he has infringed on @suprarx7nut design: It's a key holder. Basically a stronger version of what Toyota created. How unique can one be?
Kudos to both of you for designing something! Here's another one:
www.amazon.com/STAUBER-Best-Lexus-Shell-Replacement/dp/B01EBBJ23Y/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_107_t_0?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=EG3JNH2WKCDMD3HTKV7D
Don't get me wrong: It's great when people design items for our vehicles, but I'll bet you would sell a whole lot more than 1500 if the price was palatable. I think it's great that @Ohthetrees designed his own, and people ought to lay off him for the concept that he has infringed on @suprarx7nut design: It's a key holder. Basically a stronger version of what Toyota created. How unique can one be?
Kudos to both of you for designing something! Here's another one:
www.amazon.com/STAUBER-Best-Lexus-Shell-Replacement/dp/B01EBBJ23Y/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_107_t_0?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=EG3JNH2WKCDMD3HTKV7D
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I'm certainly against frivolous spending, but $78 is too much to pay to have a solid, will-not-break version of the one thing that starts your vehicle? Scratching my head on that one. I mean, I look for coupons before I order pizza, but I didn't hesitate to spend $160 on two key shells, especially after a broken key left me stranded.
Put your time and money into designing and producing one and tell me if you'll sell them for $20 each. Its worth the money. Not only that, but the guy donates a bunch of them every year at HIH.
He didn't "design his own" he, ripped off the existing product almost exactly, then acted pompous about it.
It is unique and nothing like the flimsy factory design. I dont believe you've compared the two.
I had one of those. its total crap.
I just haven't broken a factory one yet...I understand that others have, but yes $78 for a few pieces of static material strikes me as expensive. To each his own.
atnolan94
I'm Your Huckleberry
Wait til your key snaps in half and you are stranded. I didn't think it would happen to me.
Can't you use the key in that situation? Did one half get lost?
atnolan94
I'm Your Huckleberry
The cylinder is surprisingly hard to turn when you only have the key shank. You would need pliers or something and the transponder has to remain in range of the dash. Then your OEM key replacement will be $200, or $40 for an amazon key that will also break in 6 months. Hence, $80 on a YotaMD isn't unreasonable.
That was me, ha! Even at my cost at a Toyota employee, a key was stupid expensive. I ended up getting it started with a pair of pliers and the fob taped to the dash next to it.
Dissent vs Slee is irrevelent. completely different designs and internal structures. Both great, highly respected operations.
I'll be the devils advocate here on a few things: If I do break my key, as you have suggested, then I would be able to "put" home with the pliers and duct tape that I have in my vehicle. I wouldn't be stranded. (Like many, I also have a spare, but that's beside the point).
The amazon link above (which might break in 6 months, and was referred to as total crap, despite almost 700 positive reviews) is less than $9, not $40. That's for a key shell, which is the article in question, not a $200 OEM replacement key [apples/oranges].
I don't mean to be rude, nor to derail this thread. I think it's great that people design all sorts of aftermarket things for our vehicles. I buy many of them. In this case, what I struggle with is the cost/benefit. It is clear that many people perceive value differently, so don't let me tighten your purse-strings.
if spending $78 is a lot to you for a key that will never need to be replaced and fixes a common issue, you probably bought the wrong car......
Perhaps I'll re-evaluate when I start breaking keys and running low on inventory.
Perhaps. Buy once cry once and move on.
