Advice from the experts

[jtmosca]

I appear to have a growing Land Cruiser addition. Rather than fight it, I've decided to embrace it and add a classic FJ to my driveway (...my 97 FZJ needs a mentor). My primary fixation revolves around FJ45LWB's. However running at a close second is the family-friendlier Iron Pig (I have a 3yr old boy and another boy on the way). No surprise, the wife is slightly more supportive of the 55s. So I will be posting the same basic questions on both the 45 and 55 forums. Here is some additional info before I post my actual questions.

(Assuming my wife's preference wins out and we end up with a piggy...)
- I intend on using the 55 as a daily driver (5 to 20 miles a day) and the most extreme terrain it would see would be beach camping.
- Cost is a concern. I'm not at a point in my life where I can throw unlimited funds at it but I do understand that this will not be cheap.
- I want to keep it primarily stock Toyota FJ parts and drivetrain. Only potential modifications would be practical ones such as, (heat/a-c, power steering, possible brake upgrade, etc.) and cosmetic mods of slight suspension lift and chunkier tires. In other words no extreme suspension changes or chevy conversions.
- I have reasonable mechanical ability (maint, occasional head gasket, timing belt, etc.) but I have not perfected the art of body work and I have no desire to do extensive amounts of it myself.
- I don't expect to end up with a show car, however I would like to get it to a reasonably reliable and presentable state (good enough to put my business logo on the side and not be embarrassed).
- I do not have a set timeline, so I can wait for the right deal.

So my questions to you experts; Would you..:

A - Ransack every storage building on the East Coast looking for the mythical barn find?

B - Collect a few and frankenstein them together?

C - Pay for a cheaper/rusty one and then little by little pay a small fortune to have someone kill the cancer?

Any mistakes/pit falls that you made when you were hog-hunting that I should look out for?

Minimum budget for a respectable looking 55?

Are there companies like Aqualu for 55s?

Other than, Ih8mud, Craigslist and Ebay is there any other place I should be looking?

Thanks in advance for any insight that you may have.

Justin

 

[RUSH55]

I would be extremely patient and picky. Right now it sounds like you're in the, "want it/gotta have it" stage, which can be very dangerous to your budget and sanity. Everything I've ever seen coming out of the eastern US was rust-bucket city. My opinion is that all that rust repair usually isn't worth the hassle if you just wait it out for the not-so rusty rig that only cost a grand more and emerges 2 weeks after you buy that rust-bucket. It happens every single time! For myself (and sounds like you as well) mechanical issues are easier to deal with than alot of sheetmetal replacement. If you sacrifice or tradeoff somewhere, let it be in that area. By the same token, I'd avoid a basket case, unless it's totally complete, and you know someone personally that does TOP QUALITY work in the engine building/machining business.
From everything I've seen working as a mechanic and being around Cruisers for 15 years, is that an old neglected vehicle will be a PITA for years to come as you come to grips with all the nickle and dime BS you'll have to deal with. The better condition the rig, the better off you'll be, and the more time you'll spend driving it as opposed to tracking down parts or buying cut-off wheels and CO2/Argon and sanding disks and slide-hammers and POR15 and Line-X and thinner and HVLP guns and masking tape and overspray paper and respirators and............

 

[bobm]

I agree with Rush as far as being cautious. I dont agree that all PIGGYS in the East are RUST BUCKETS. There is the Southeast where a lot of fine PIGGYS live. And there have actually been a few for sale recently. What you need to do is look for something thats within your skill level. If body work and welding are not you thing and mechanical is then lean that way. Its a personal preference that you need to decide. We are just here for guidance. No individuals input should be GOLD.

Thanks Bob.

I would be extremely patient and picky. Right now it sounds like you're in the, "want it/gotta have it" stage, which can be very dangerous to your budget and sanity. Everything I've ever seen coming out of the eastern US was rust-bucket city. My opinion is that all that rust repair usually isn't worth the hassle if you just wait it out for the not-so rusty rig that only cost a grand more and emerges 2 weeks after you buy that rust-bucket. It happens every single time! For myself (and sounds like you as well) mechanical issues are easier to deal with than alot of sheetmetal replacement. If you sacrifice or tradeoff somewhere, let it be in that area. By the same token, I'd avoid a basket case, unless it's totally complete, and you know someone personally that does TOP QUALITY work in the engine building/machining business.
From everything I've seen working as a mechanic and being around Cruisers for 15 years, is that an old neglected vehicle will be a PITA for years to come as you come to grips with all the nickle and dime BS you'll have to deal with. The better condition the rig, the better off you'll be, and the more time you'll spend driving it as opposed to tracking down parts or buying cut-off wheels and CO2/Argon and sanding disks and slide-hammers and POR15 and Line-X and thinner and HVLP guns and masking tape and overspray paper and respirators and............

 

[Pighead]

I appear to have a growing Land Cruiser addition.

Land Cruiser addiction?

-Skillet

 

[Pighead]

Seriously though, a 55 makes a fine family DD...I had carried my daughters home from the hospital in the back seat of mine. And all the way through all the schools etc. I tied a knotted rope to the inside handle over the passenger rear door so they could climb up into it. I've owned this Pig 25 years now, I'd like to think of myself as an expert on this '74 Pig. There is nothing in it I have not repaired or replaced at least once. It's still not done yet.
Plan C is an awful idea.
Plan B is doable if you have the room and an ex-wife.
Plan A isn't gonna happen.
I found mine in a newspaper ad, back before we had an internets.
I think the 'Mud 55 classifieds would be your best bet. Also network with your local 'Cruiserheads via the closest TLCA affiliated club.
Bob would know more about east coast rust than I, but I would look in more arid climates.
Transport could be arranged per 'Mudship or friends of friends with a trailer...
Frankensteining a Pig together is fun and easy, I'm an expert in that too.
The earliest Pigs had the thickest sheetmetal, the later Pigs had better technology.
It's easier to bolt newer stuff onto an earlier Pig. Earlier may be smog-exempt as well, if that's a concern.
BobM is sorta the aqualu of pigs. My bodywork skills end at sawzall and sledgehammer. Though I will be learning panel replacement any day now.
Pirates of the Rubicon also has a LandCruiser section, but I think everybody there is also here
'Mud is going to be your best resource, there is no site in the world that can help you more than right here.

You have an addiction? Count the Pigs in our driveway...disregard the 80, do not see the 45 inside the garage.

 

[unvincible]

I nearly bought the first one I came across and it was rusty, had a V8 conversion with some doubt as to whether it functioned properly due to a "strange idle issue" I don't know how many of you have tried to chase down the idle ghost on a TBI chevy 350 conversion but it will keep you up at night. Anyway, I gave pause looked around for a few weeks and found one fairly rust free that runs great with all kinds of improvements for $3200. Well worth waiting for the right deal.

 

[LAMBCRUSHER]

I vote for bone stock and go from there. There is nothing like having carnal knowledge of your rig, and also knowing how every little repair or mod was done. a cheap one that needs alot of love could practically fall on you if your lucky, and from what I see, Bob M is making some fine art floorpan reproductions. you will be faced with unobtainium parts when it comes to weather strip and such,
but you can't beat bacon. even the vegans know that

 

[LAMBCRUSHER]

pigheads got me beat by one....we'll see how long that lasts

 

[PabloCruise]

Seriously though, a 55 makes a fine family DD...I had carried my daughters home from the hospital in the back seat of mine. And all the way through all the schools etc. I tied a knotted rope to the inside handle over the passenger rear door so they could climb up into it. I've owned this Pig 25 years now, I'd like to think of myself as an expert on this '74 Pig. There is nothing in it I have not repaired or replaced at least once. It's still not done yet.
Plan C is an awful idea.
Plan B is doable if you have the room and an ex-wife.
Plan A isn't gonna happen.
I found mine in a newspaper ad, back before we had an internets.
I think the 'Mud 55 classifieds would be your best bet. Also network with your local 'Cruiserheads via the closest TLCA affiliated club.
Bob would know more about east coast rust than I, but I would look in more arid climates.
Transport could be arranged per 'Mudship or friends of friends with a trailer...
Frankensteining a Pig together is fun and easy, I'm an expert in that too.
The earliest Pigs had the thickest sheetmetal, the later Pigs had better technology.
It's easier to bolt newer stuff onto an earlier Pig. Earlier may be smog-exempt as well, if that's a concern.
BobM is sorta the aqualu of pigs. My bodywork skills end at sawzall and sledgehammer. Though I will be learning panel replacement any day now.
Pirates of the Rubicon also has a LandCruiser section, but I think everybody there is also here
'Mud is going to be your best resource, there is no site in the world that can help you more than right here.

You have an addiction? Count the Pigs in our driveway...disregard the 80, do not see the 45 inside the garage.

25 years?!? That is some serious Piggy love!
I doubt many people have that kind of longevity w/ their Pigs

 

[jtmosca]

Pighead - Yes, I meant "addiction", although "addition" seems ironically appropriate also... As evidenced by your pics, your addiction is unquestionably in a more advanced stage, but what a beautiful sickness to have!

RUSH55, bobm, Pighead, unvincible, and LAMBCRUSHER - Thanks! this the exact kind of value-added input that I'm looking for.

I've been wanting one since 2002, but it's only recently that I have the circumstances to begin entertaining the idea. I have waited this long so I'm willing to continue waiting to find the right deal.

Thanks again!

I am open to additional thoughts or input from others too...

 

[riderjgs]

Two out of three...

I've survived/enjoyed two of your three options, buying a good one and building a Frankencruiser (see my sig line.) Like you, my uses are daily driver, hunting/fishing/camping and moderate trails. Our skills seem similar, some mechanical but no body/point.

The blue/white '73 I found on Ebay in 2008 and bought that same day on a whim. (pic #1) Filled it up and checked the oil and drove it home from AZ a week or so later. SBC/Toyota 4 spd. conversion but otherwise pretty original, including mostly original paint. Fair price but required some additional cleanup. Heavy on patina, only one quarter-size rust spot in the rear sill, crease in the driver door, interior. About a year later I decided I had too much into it and found someone who wanted it as much as I had. Broke even after driving it for a year, including acquisition of a '73 AZ parts rig that had been sitting for about 15 years, sans drivetrain. (Pic 2)
Tried but couldn't get rid of the parts rig or get rid of the "pig on my back" so...
When I was delivering some interior panels to Scorcher (hero of the "Moviestar restoration") some months later I saw his '74 parts rig. (pic #3) Sans roof, glass, rear corners and most of the front clip, it ran and drove. Had a SBC/4spd with a front disc axle. "One of us should take your parts rig and mine," I said. "They'd make a pretty nifty Pig." A month or so later, that "one of us" was me. The exchange involved a few bucks and a 30-pack of PBR.
(to be continued)

 

[riderjgs]

more pig adventures

A year of stripping, head scratching and parts gathering (including two or three sets of interior panels to get what I wanted to replace those Elyse will enjoy in the "Moviestar) followed. Somewhere late in the process, another '69 (pic "1 in next set) ended up behind the fence and contributed a few parts before being delivered to SoCal.
Summer of 2010, with the help of a friend with more skills, tools and equipment than yours truly, we did a body swap and got it on the road. (pic #2 in next set) Drove it for the summer, sorting it out and putting together the best parts. Left it at the body shop in Oct and picked it up in March of last year cleaned up and painted inside and out. Been driving it since then and "finishing" the assemblage, which will be mostly complete in a bit with the addition of a Ranger overdrive, power steering,bucket seats and sorting out driveshaft angle issues we missed during the body swap.
Right now, including the parts yet to be installed, I'm in it about a grand more than I had in the blue/white one when I sold it. This (pic #3) is a much nicer rig and there's the satisfaction of "built, not bought." And I have just what I wanted, including the minor lift and SBC, and learned a heck of a lot in the process.
Short story, IMO either of your first two options is good for people like you and me. I admire but can't imagine the work and frustration it'd take to get one of the many rust buckets to the stage I'm at now but, for the same reasons you cite, wouldn't even try it. More power to those who do.
Enjoy the journey!

 

[scrapdaddy]

Jim,

That was a great story. I think, for the most part, the people on here go that route. It's alot of fun, but work, to put together a nice truck. It takes alot of time and money, family support or not, which can be a big problem. Something to think about.

I started in 70's and 80's with a 40 and a 55. My family was young and we needed other things, so I got out for decades. Now I'm retired and back in with a 55 and one on the way!

Lord help me

Good luck on your quest!

 

[jtmosca]

riderjgs - Awesome info, pics and story, Thanks!

scrapdaddy - When you said "one on the way" are we talking Kid or Pig? If your retired then I hope it's a Pig. Either way, I guess congratulations are in order!

 

[chevurai]

I am the current owner of the #1 pic in riderjgs narrative the '69. I have been having a great time with the Pig rescue. Today I am installing the exhaust system and hope to have it on the road in about two weeks. It has been a lot of work, challenging but fun. It had good bones to start with, not too much rust, and gathering the missing parts added to the fun.
So, jtmosca, I would recomend that whatever 55 you get, try to stay within your skill level for the most of the repairs.
Happy wheel'in.

 

[riderjgs]

Hope you or Pat kept the horse on the hood and it shows up on one of your rigs. Did you get all the documentation of the original purchase by the Zimbalist family? Also liked the faded horseshoes enclosing the Z on the doors. End of hijack.

 

[scrapdaddy]

riderjgs - Awesome info, pics and story, Thanks!

scrapdaddy - When you said "one on the way" are we talking Kid or Pig? If your retired then I hope it's a Pig. Either way, I guess congratulations are in order!

Oh Man, took me all day, to catch my breath! No more babies, I'm 58, done with that. I haven't sent the check yet, but I'm buying a 69 for a parts truck

 

[PabloCruise]

I've survived/enjoyed two of your three options, buying a good one and building a Frankencruiser (see my sig line.) Like you, my uses are daily driver, hunting/fishing/camping and moderate trails. Our skills seem similar, some mechanical but no body/point.

The blue/white '73 I found on Ebay in 2008 and bought that same day on a whim. (pic #1) Filled it up and checked the oil and drove it home from AZ a week or so later. SBC/Toyota 4 spd. conversion but otherwise pretty original, including mostly original paint. Fair price but required some additional cleanup. Heavy on patina, only one quarter-size rust spot in the rear sill, crease in the driver door, interior. About a year later I decided I had too much into it and found someone who wanted it as much as I had. Broke even after driving it for a year, including acquisition of a '73 AZ parts rig that had been sitting for about 15 years, sans drivetrain. (Pic 2)
Tried but couldn't get rid of the parts rig or get rid of the "pig on my back" so...
When I was delivering some interior panels to Scorcher (hero of the "Moviestar restoration") some months later I saw his '74 parts rig. (pic #3) Sans roof, glass, rear corners and most of the front clip, it ran and drove. Had a SBC/4spd with a front disc axle. "One of us should take your parts rig and mine," I said. "They'd make a pretty nifty Pig." A month or so later, that "one of us" was me. The exchange involved a few bucks and a 30-pack of PBR.
(to be continued)

A year of stripping, head scratching and parts gathering (including two or three sets of interior panels to get what I wanted to replace those Elyse will enjoy in the "Moviestar) followed. Somewhere late in the process, another '69 (pic "1 in next set) ended up behind the fence and contributed a few parts before being delivered to SoCal.
Summer of 2010, with the help of a friend with more skills, tools and equipment than yours truly, we did a body swap and got it on the road. (pic #2 in next set) Drove it for the summer, sorting it out and putting together the best parts. Left it at the body shop in Oct and picked it up in March of last year cleaned up and painted inside and out. Been driving it since then and "finishing" the assemblage, which will be mostly complete in a bit with the addition of a Ranger overdrive, power steering,bucket seats and sorting out driveshaft angle issues we missed during the body swap.
Right now, including the parts yet to be installed, I'm in it about a grand more than I had in the blue/white one when I sold it. This (pic #3) is a much nicer rig and there's the satisfaction of "built, not bought." And I have just what I wanted, including the minor lift and SBC, and learned a heck of a lot in the process.
Short story, IMO either of your first two options is good for people like you and me. I admire but can't imagine the work and frustration it'd take to get one of the many rust buckets to the stage I'm at now but, for the same reasons you cite, wouldn't even try it. More power to those who do.
Enjoy the journey!

Great build story Jim! That is an awesome looking Pig!

 

[riderjgs]

TJ...thanks. I'm a pretty happy camper, happier when the odrive and seats get installed.

Scrapdaddy...similar story. My only other Land Cruiser prior to the blue/white Pig was a brand new '73 FJ40 soft top bought when we lived in the mountains near Denver. (I tell people it was the best off road vehicle I've ever owned, also the most miserable highway rig.) Always had a 4WD, from Jeeps to GM and Ford pickups, a Suburban and a K Blazer.

 

[Ming89FJ62]

TJ...thanks. I'm a pretty happy camper, happier when the odrive and seats get installed.

Just curious - which OD Ranger or Fairey?