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OK, so you performed good diagnostics on this system. I knew you could do it.
That tells me that the FP logic is working as it should...sometimes, and we possibly have more of a mechanical issue with the relay terminals seating in the contacts of the socket. See post #18 in this very thread.
I would now make some assumptions.
1. Chances are the original COR is still good.
2. There is an intermittent/poor connection to that relay socket on pin 3 (starter signal).
3. Possible bad/corroded/loose terminal(s) in that relay socket.
I would remove that entire relay block and have a close look at the wiring and try to cinch down the female terminal prongs so the get a better bite on the relay blade terminals. It's also possible that one of the many splices is where it shouldn't be and has become resistive.
That tells me that the FP logic is working as it should...sometimes, and we possibly have more of a mechanical issue with the relay terminals seating in the contacts of the socket. See post #18 in this very thread.
I would now make some assumptions.
1. Chances are the original COR is still good.
2. There is an intermittent/poor connection to that relay socket on pin 3 (starter signal).
3. Possible bad/corroded/loose terminal(s) in that relay socket.
I would remove that entire relay block and have a close look at the wiring and try to cinch down the female terminal prongs so the get a better bite on the relay blade terminals. It's also possible that one of the many splices is where it shouldn't be and has become resistive.
LOL. Your meter has an automatic continuity beep tone when set at the 200 ohm scale. That's what that speaker symbol is next to the 200 on the meter scale. It's all good.
- Thread starter
- #44
@jonheld good to know about the sound I’m hearing, newbie problems! What are your thoughts on replacing some/all of the wiring harness? If that is overkill, can I replace the section in the kick panel so that I can remove all of the PO’s handywork? Is there a part of the harness I can call my local Yota yard and tell them I need? I’m happy to dig in further, just curious if this could solve a larger issue.
Thank you!
OK, so right now you are trying to solve 1 single issue. I think hacking up your wiring harness will yield more problems.
Fix issues as they arise. And they will arise. But try not to create new ones in the process.
Going any further without the correct factory service manuals and schematics is not advised. There are websites you can download from (http://techinfo.toyota.com/), there are folks here on mud that have them for free, or you can purchase the entire kit and caboodle from me.
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- Thread starter
- #46
Sorry all, we were a little busy this weekend. My girlfriend and I got engaged! Needless to say, I took my focus of the 80 for a moment. But now I am back!
@jonheld thank you for the insight. I very well may be buying those from you in the near future. Regardless, I was planning on sending you a gift card for all your help! I think the wiring fixes may be a bit above my skill set and tolerance level at the moment. I found a local 3FE mechanic that said he could sort all the wiring. I may go that route. He advised that I test my cold start fuel injector and also check my fuel pressure before I did anything. I also thought I would post some disconnected cables in case they may be causing my problems. Thank you all for the help!
Chris
That all sounds reasonable. No gifts necessary and congratulations.
I see more non-oem wire splices in your pictures. Good luck.
- Thread starter
- #48
Team,
I am back after a small hiatus! I have sent the 80 to go live at a local shop that is better with electrical work than I am. They have cleaned up some of the splices and tested the fuel pump and ground wires, all seem to be functional. The shop is saying that they believe I have a bad ECU... Any thoughts on this? Does anyone know of an ECU for sale for an FJ80? Will an ECU work for an FZJ80?
Thank you!
@jonheld
I am back after a small hiatus! I have sent the 80 to go live at a local shop that is better with electrical work than I am. They have cleaned up some of the splices and tested the fuel pump and ground wires, all seem to be functional. The shop is saying that they believe I have a bad ECU... Any thoughts on this? Does anyone know of an ECU for sale for an FJ80? Will an ECU work for an FZJ80?
Thank you!
@jonheld
The ECU is pretty robust and rarely fail.
You would need one from a 91 or 92 FJ80. The FJ62 3FE had a different ECU and the 93+ FZJ80 is a different motor altogether.
Hold on a minute. Didn't this engine run once started? Wasn't the problem getting it to start?
If that's the case, then how could the ECU be faulty? The ECU doesn't run the fuel pump.
- Thread starter
- #51
@jonheld Mechanic thinks I have a replacement wiring harness which did have splices that were causing resistance. He found and fixed those with a thermal image reader, however there could be more. All Ohms were checked and are in spec. He said all grounds to the fuel pump are working. He has also tested the cold start fuel injector and that seems to be functional. Biggest issue is getting fuel to the engine at startup.
My guy wants to try the ECU as he is out of other options besides checking every connection, one by one. Expensive for me! Please let me know if you have any other ideas!
Thank you!
ECU part I need:
89661-60090
or
89661-60090-84
My guy wants to try the ECU as he is out of other options besides checking every connection, one by one. Expensive for me! Please let me know if you have any other ideas!
Thank you!
ECU part I need:
89661-60090
or
89661-60090-84
But we know all this already. If there was an issue with the fuel pump, the engine wouldn't run.
The ECU does not run the fuel pump in any state on this engine.
Is the fuel pump running when you crank the starter? If no, then you must look to fuel pump logic. Again, NOT controlled by the ECU.
Once the engine fires, if it continues to run then the ECU MUST be good. Injectors are firing, spark is firing, etc.
If the fuel pump is running when you crank the starter, then you could have a possible issue with fuel pressure, but you need to determine if the fuel pump is running FIRST.
- Thread starter
- #53
@jonheld, he said the fuel pump is good so I assume it would be firing when I am cranking. He said the MAF is good too which brings me back to my question of why do I need to spray starter fluid in the intake for it to fire up once the engine has been running. Honestly, I think my mechanic has hit a wall short of checking all connections. He said the new wiring harness could also be a CA harnedd but hes not sure. Whoever put it in didn't do a great job, to say the least. Ugh...
You can't assume.
There are 2 logic paths for the control of the fuel pump.
1. Starter signal to the first coil in the circuit opening relay. This fires the pump when cranking the starter.
2. Flap in the AFM (not MAF on a 3FE). This fires the second coil in the circuit opening relay to keep the pump running after you release the starter.
The fuel pump control never touches the ECU. You can remove the ECU from the truck and put it in the refrigerator, and the fuel pump will behave the same way.
That same starter signal in 1 above should also hit the ECU (E4 pin 2) to tell it that you are cranking the starter. If that signal is missing then the fuel pump won't run during starter cranking and the ECU won't fire injectors or spark.
I would lay odds that 1 of these is missing.
Christo Slee is i Golden, Colorado. All he does is Land Cruisers. sleeoffroad.com
I would lay odds that 1 of these is missing.
Christo Slee is i Golden, Colorado. All he does is Land Cruisers. sleeoffroad.com
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- Thread starter
- #59
Update... New ECU didnt fix the issue, shocker. I am waiting for my mechanic to give me a rundown of the damage done for his work. He is wanting to go through and test all the connections in the electrical system. Sounds expensive. Should I keep chasing gremlins, replace the harness, or just scrap it?
@jonheld
@jonheld
This is a lot like dealing with my wife. I will say one thing and she will go down a completely different path...
You are trying to solve 1 relatively simple issue. The engine doesn't fire when cranking without starter fluid. HOWEVER, once the engine is started it runs normally.
That means one of 2 things.
1. The fuel pump is not running during cranking.
2. The ECU is not seeing the starter signal.
That's it. Those are the only 2 possibilities. How do I know this? Because the freaking motor runs well once started. If the ECU or anything in the ignition system or EFI system was faulty, this engine WOULD NOT RUN.
This is a tractor motor from 1986. If your mechanic can't find the issue, then find another mechanic. You live in Colorado. There are Land Cruiser clubs everywhere out there. There are Land Cruiser specialty shops everywhere. Do some research.
You are trying to solve 1 relatively simple issue. The engine doesn't fire when cranking without starter fluid. HOWEVER, once the engine is started it runs normally.
That means one of 2 things.
1. The fuel pump is not running during cranking.
2. The ECU is not seeing the starter signal.
That's it. Those are the only 2 possibilities. How do I know this? Because the freaking motor runs well once started. If the ECU or anything in the ignition system or EFI system was faulty, this engine WOULD NOT RUN.
This is a tractor motor from 1986. If your mechanic can't find the issue, then find another mechanic. You live in Colorado. There are Land Cruiser clubs everywhere out there. There are Land Cruiser specialty shops everywhere. Do some research.
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